Grade 1 Violin failure

maggie I think you are wise - my biggest problem was overfamiliarity with my pieces, from having started them 9 months before the exam. Ridiculously far too long, IMO.

Total rubbish, ImNotACeleb! I started piano at 6 and violin at 7, had to practise each for 30 minutes a day, and the only uncertainty over all my grade exams was whether I would pass with merit or distinction! It's appalling to say that having to practise for more than 10 minutes a day means you're not up to scratch - studying an instrument is a great way for children to learn that success takes work and you get out what you put in. God help your dcs if you're teaching them that everything should be easy.

So I stand by what I said, and I also think that if the OP didn't see this coming, the parents are not close enough to the violin learning - it isn't an easy instrument and almost all preteen kids need support at home from someone who knows the difference between good and bad playing. You wouldn't expect a child to succeed in learning Arabic or tennis with 1 hour of teaching a week and nobody at home helping - why do people think music is any different?

I agree. 30 mins every day is unrealistic. At grade 1 standard, 10-15 mins, 5 times a week is more than enough. If it takes 30 mins every day, they're not up to scratch!

Wellwisher I think you are being harsh. Practice time will vary according to the child and in some cases less is more. In fact, in the run up to exam I will probably give my dd a break from her pieces occasionally so that she does not get sick of hearing them but of course this will depend on the individual.

It sounds more like Honeymum's dd was let down by poor exam technigue.

It sounds like the teacher is definitely not up to scratch - he should be teaching exam technique and behaviour. Stopping, let alone speaking, when you make a mistake in a piece is a huge no-no. For children who haven't taken an exam before, I'd go as far as to use one lesson as a "dress rehearsal" where the teacher pretends to be the examiner, so that they can identify any issues and the child knows what to expect on the day.

That said, I thought it was interesting that you say the teacher is "not strict enough" with your DD, while admitting that you only make her practise "10-15 mins a day, 5 days a week" - that's nowhere near enough, especially in the run-up to an exam, so I think you've let her down a bit as well. You don't need to be a tiger mother about it, but 30 minutes a day, every single day, should be doable for a 9-year-old.

I don't know how much this will help because my experience was different but anyway:
I failed Grade 1 piano.
I got 96, so only just - and the reason was because I was started too early on the exam pieces, so by the time the exam came, I knew them all by heart - except that with the nervousness induced by the exam, I forgot them and then couldn't find my place on the page to play it properly.

I changed teacher - the next one was far better for me, not as old-fashioned or strict and more fun - and passed Grade 1 no problem next time. But because of the nerves, I only did Grades 1, 2, 4 and 6 (after taking Grade 5 theory) as it seemed pointless putting me through every grade exam. I only did Grades 3 and 6 in Double Bass as well, for the same reason (passed both despite getting shocking disco knee!)

Just as a thought - does she sing? Singing can help a lot in terms of better sight reading, sight singing, picking out notes from chords, that kind of thing - can she join a choir as well?

You've got a good attitude Honeymum. Hope it all goes well.

hope it goes well for her. I am glad she is enjoying orchestra.

Hope all goes well with the exam!

If you want a (free!) advice lesson over Skype do send me a message. I enter loads of Grade 1s each year :)

Good luck to your dd for the exam Honeymum.

I followed this thread while I was still lurking and found it very helpful when my dd got a pass for her grade 2 violin, and had been predicted a distinction (which she got for grade 1). Not quite the same situation but all the information posters had passed on stopped me interogating quizzing her teacher and helped me come up with the best things to say to my dd. Like you we are working on scales and sight reading and have found a summer school and a possible strings group to join as well.

Do post how she gets on.

Hmm, I think there are a number of factors here. I'm a music teacher with some contact with the ABRSM BTW.

It sounds to me like the fundamental problem is that your violin teacher is just not steeped in the culture of exams. If he was going to enter her for the exam, he should have known the general standard required, and known of the normal problems kids' face doing their first exam, such as panicking about sight reading. All of that should have been taken into account. She should have practised with him attempting the sight reading NO MATTER how bad the attempt. As has been said earlier a minimum of 1/3 marks is given for any attempt.

The fact that he "forgot to enter her" the first time chimes with this. It doesn't sound like he's the kind of teacher who's doing that all the time for lots of students. This doesn't mean he's a bad teacher of course - there are many different, valid ways of teaching. But he needs to know that failing an exam can be very distressing for a child, and if he's not up to overseeing it properly, he shouldn't be entering people.

It's rare to fail grade 1, and FWIW I have heard ABRSM examiners say that when it happens, they consider it purely as an indictment on the teacher, not the student.

There's also another issue, which is the huge difference between the many ways that "musicality" can be expressed in a free and creative fashion, and the incredibly tight-arsed structure and culture of ABRSM exams. There is an enormous gap between a student being able to "do something" in the sense of getting their instrument out when they're ready, having a chat, warming up, playing a bit, eventually finding their way and doing something quite engaging and creative; and going into a 12-minute exam and being told "you have these notes and only these notes on the page, you have one chance to play them: start NOW!" I know I have been guilty of underestimating that gap before, I think it's very easy to do because you get caught up in the pleasure of hearing creative kids do interesting things.

It's terribly important to remember that an exam's validity is only in relation to the parameters it set up for itself in the first place. A "music exam" is a test of SOME musical activities, VERY strictly defined and examined at one time. It's not, in any way at all, a test of "musicality". You can be naturally far worse at something than someone else but if you're put in a competition against them for which you know the rules you are being judged by and they don't, you will win.

I have sympathies with both sides of the pro/con exams debate. I certainly think there are a lot of children who are not suited to them; a lot of young children are forced to take them too early; and parents often make the mistake of attaching wider importance to them then is really merited.

Having said that, the violin is a very classical, reading-based instrument. If she enjoys it and is likely to want to take it further, then that's probably going to happen by reading music in an orchestra, not by jamming in a rock band. There's a case for pushing a structured exam-based approach more than one might on some other instruments.

I think I might look for another violin teacher, while simultaneously investigating other, less formal kinds of musical experience. Get a guitar and learn some chords; join an African drumming group; that kind of thing. If she's going to do the classical violin she needs to do it properly; but she may be more tempermentally suited to doing something else.

One thing that really helped DS2 with his sightreading was a downloadable computer quiz from Wieser called Sightreading Challenge; it's on the homepage here: www.wieser-software.com/. It's very cheap and you can set it to different instruments so you get the right clef and range, and they just try to beat their score by reading the notes as quickly as possible. Very simple but surprisingly effective for speedy note recognition.

I'm finding this very interesting. My dd admits now, at 15, that she's really glad that she knows her scales and so on - she loves improvising and jazz. But if she hadn't done music exams there is no way she would have learnt them. He teacher had a very laid back approach to exams, but they were always there in the background - and that kept the scales and the sight playing ticking along while the fun stuff was going on in front.

also, sad though it is to say it, bits of paper are important to kids nowadays. I deliberately sent my dd to a dance school where they didn't do exams - and now she's in a position of having done 10 years of ballet and not a certificate to put on her CV!

When I learnt to play violin there were 7 of us had lessons together. 5 took their exams at Christmas, all passed with Merits & Distinctions. Myself and my friend were away for that lot of exams so we took ours the following Easter, we had a different examiner.
I passed by 2 points. My friend passed by 3! So it varies hugely on the examiner too.

I had a fantastic teacher, he was head of music services in the city I lived in and he was really anti-exams, so he was more than happy for me to never do another exam again :) ... I had 11 years of lessons and never got any further than grade 1.
But there was a fantastic orchestra scheme where I grew up though, you could join when you were at grade 1 level and every year you auditioned to go up to the next orchestra. He encouraged me to join that and it was the best thing I did.
I did feel a bit daft every year when I auditioned and said I was grade 1 :) But it was the audition that counted. (I hated the auditions too but at least they had a purpose.)

Encourage your daughter to play because she loves it, getting her in an orchestra will be fantastic at teaching her to keep playing.... even if she messes up, and she'll have to learn to find where she is when she's lost which will help with her sight reading too.
Plus it'll be fun and she'll make friends.

Exams put a lot of pressure on, and a lot of the time it's really unnecessary unless you want to be a classical musician or study it at uni.
Music should be fun!

One of the best musicians I know is my DH. He's amazing! He can pick up any instrument and get a good tune out of it, play along with anyone and anything... he's never had a proper music lesson in his live and can't read a note of music.

The only music qualification he has is a GCSE in music, he got a B... because he couldn't read the notes on the sight reading test. He got the rhythm spot on though

Regardless of whether or not a pupil was sitting an exam a good teacher should have them practising scales and technical exercises relevant to the pieces they were working on.

I've been playing various instruments for around 35 years and teaching for the last 20 years and even now I still start every practise session with 10-15 minutes of scales and technical exercises. I do the same with my students. You select scales relevant to the pieces they're working on.

And sightreading is an essential part of playing. Anyone preparing a child for an exam who doesn't get the child to sightread on a regular basis really shouldn't be entering them for an exam. It's bloody terrifying to sit in front of someone on a one to one basis and have to play something you've never seen before.

(Sorry Tangle, that was in response to an earlier comment, not in response to your post which I totally agree with!!!)

I think the sightreading comes from ensemble playing from an early age - whether recorder groups, orchestras, or even piano duets. It all helps to get that pulse established!

The Associated Board examine in about 90 countries worldwide - it's not just a UK thing to do exams.

I've heard from a few different sources that GB produces some of the best orchestral musicians in the world - in particular wrt their ability to sight read. The UK system must be doing something right!

Are exams the be all and end all of music? No, of course not.

Is an ability to read music essential to be able to participate and enjoy music? No - although it may limit your options as its a fairly essential skill for some areas such as chamber/orchestral music.

It is meant to be fun? Definitely - and if any child is trying to learn whilst deriving no pleasure then something's not right. But that's not to say it can be all pleasure if you want to get a solid foundation unless you have an extremely inspiring teacher who can make the mundane exciting.

For sight reading, I recommend 'Improve Your Sight Reading Violin Grade 1' by Paul Harris, published by Faber Music. It has little rhythm exercises at each stage, and music interpretation and understanding questions, as well as the actual reading and playing of the notes. Each stage builds up gradually, so by the end of the book they're doing a standard equivalent to grade 1 sight reading. There's a book for each grade and for different instruments. It's far better than the 'Joining the Dots' series, in my opinion. Whether they're doing exams or not, they're still useful for sight reading improvement.

DD's lesson group starts everybody off with Fiddletime Joggers, so not suitable (too basic) for someone who is nearly Grade 1. Sprinters or Runners might be ok.

Absolutely exams are not the be all and end all. Dh has a few pupils who don't want to do exams ....you can bet they don't practise those scales though! Generally he thinks the exams give a good structure. He has taught at a dodgy uni music department in the past and was totally shocked at some of the pupils. They had grade 8, but were terrible - probably taught to pass an exam. This is his pet hate. He has taken on pupils whose previous teacher has obviously just taught them to pass the exam. They have done nothing else but practise those damn pieces etc.. Sometimes they can barely read music as have just learnt it by rote.

OP - your teacher is dodgy. He must have known she was not secure at sight-reading. Did he do some mock exams with her? Does he have any teaching qualifications? You can be a fantastic player and a crap teacher. Not all authors would make good english teachers. Time for a new teacher I think. Fresh start and all that.

I agree with much of what you say Anaxagora and Sportsmum. I was not suggesting that the OP continue with exams if she did not think it was right for her dd.

I do believe however that it is easy, as I have found, for lack of due attention to be given to scales, sightreading etc in some circumstances. A parent may have to be extra vigilant that these areas are being catered to.