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Running with poor pelvic floor- what is your solution

329 replies

Runlikeareindeer · 21/12/2013 10:52

So my pelvic floor isn't great after two vaginal deliveries, one that was forceps. I do my exercises (prob too late)

I'm running again and it is often difficult to control. I've tried tena lady (well the Aldi version) but sometimes that becomes sodden and then I have a great lump in my pants.

Is there anything I can do?

OP posts:
PenguinsDontEatKale · 20/01/2014 21:39

Thank you Gussie. That's really useful. Yes, generally it is sneezing, when I had a vomiting bug, sudden sprinting, jumping. Weirdly laughing has never been a problem. Nor is it an issue other than if I'm standing up (except the few times I've vomited).

I am still trying to get through the physiotherapists (not physics, blooming autocorrect) but it is brilliant to have some advice whilst I try. Really appreciate it.

gussiegrips · 20/01/2014 21:27

Good graphic on good toileting:

Florida Hospital link

gussiegrips · 20/01/2014 21:24

Blooming heck - this thread's brilliant for making me think! It's hard to remember what's not immediately obvious if you're not knee deep in fanjoes all day, so, thanks.

Penguin - well spotted, there are two main types of muscle contraction from your pf. Some muscles have lots of slow twitch fibres (marathon runners) which are the ones that let you "hold on", whereas some of them are full of fast twitch muscle fibres (sprinters) which are the ones which kick in when you do something that causes a sudden spike in your intra-abd pressure - coughing, sneezing, laughing, puking, shouting, jumping.

That's why the first exercise is a long hold, and the second one is fast twitches.

If you don't leak, apart from when sneezing etc, then, you probably need to concentrate on the 10 quick twitches.

Try to really clench, and then really relax, about one second apart, ten in a row. And, when you get the hang of it, you can clench along to music on the radio. Passes long car journeys rather nicely.

Aquaflex is good, but, tends to work the slow twitch fibres as you hold the cones in place.

Katnip - yep, toilet posture is an issue, but, I don't think I've seen anything saying it's a cause. I'll have a look through the papers I've got. Squatting helps straighten out the "kink" in your rectum, so poo comes out straight down. Sitting means the "kink" stays in place, so you have to work against gravity - which can be a problem if you are constipated or have a rectocele (prolapse at the back of the vagina) when part of the rectum can sag forwards into the vagina. That just wreaks havoc with your pooing. There's stuff you can do to help - but, the easiest thing is to adapt posture into a squat, either a couple of yellow pages under your feet, or a squatty potty yep, that's a thing if you're feeling flush baboom tssssh

Good luck in your race!

But, yep, the anatomy's flawed. It's the evolutionary price we pay for bipedal gait and big brains inside our not-very-developed babies' heads.

At least in the West there is help available. Watch any footage of women in developing countries and you'll see someone sitting with the heel of her foot wedged into her crotch. That's how women support their prolapse in places where there's no one to hoick it back to where it belongs. In some cultures these women are shunned. Really sad.

And, don't get me started on fistulae www.fistulafoundation.org/

That's partly why I witter on about this so much. If women's health had a higher profile in the West then these charities who do so much abroad would find it easier to fundraise. Well, I assume they would.

Milly O' - yep, some people DO find it improves. That's partly because of increased general muscle tone and weight loss, and also because when you run your core muscles are working hard (assuming you have good posture). In general though, most women find the opposite. Am pleased for you - but, still, #doyerblardyexercises!

TracyK - the work that these folk are doing is great. It's old news from a medical perspective, but, presented in a really engaging and accessible way with quite a lot of appealing products you can buy to support you. It's perfectly valid, but, I'm wary of anything that says "do this, it's good for everyone".

You could argue that runners would benefit from really working on their warm up/stretch/train/cool down/stretch/stretch/stretch - that would sort out a whole lot of gait issues. Without having to resort to fugly shoes. Honestly, I just can't take people seriously with their weird big rubber feet shoe things on. I get the theory, and I understand it works for loads of folk. Looks daft.

Fin - these are great links. Huff post are really good at promoting Cinderella issues. Why look, here's a blog from last August's Fringe....(listed in reverse order) (says pretty much everything I've said here, only, in the Huff Post, which makes me awfully chuffed with myself) www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/elaine-miller/

Finabhear · 20/01/2014 18:40

I have recently, quite by coincidence, been doing a bit of googleing on this subject and found this article in the Huffington post about dancing and the pelvic floor and this my privates have a personal trainer

The second link is a great read Grin

MillyRules · 20/01/2014 18:24

Apparently it does have a lot to do with our posture and the way we as women are told to stand. Pulling your tummy in and pulling your bottom in places the pelvic girdle in the wrong position. Apparently we should relax our body into a more natural position which is allowing the bottom to curve outward so that are spine naturally curves. This puts the pelvic girdle into a more natural position.

KatnipEvergreen · 20/01/2014 18:14

who is to say women in the past had great pelvic floors?

I'm not saying they did. It was an open question, wondering whether this is a modern or ancient problem.

TracyK · 20/01/2014 18:11

I can highly recommend katy says or alignedandwell.com
Basically, go barefoot as much as poss, very flat shoes, walk, walk, walk everywhere, sit as little as poss and do various exercises (not just pf ones)

MillyRules · 20/01/2014 17:49

Are you saying that your prolapse improved with increased fitness and running Milly?

MillyONaire · 20/01/2014 17:16

don't know if this has been said but mine improved drastically with increased fitness/running

learnasyougo · 20/01/2014 17:15

rather, I suspect our upright stance is the problem. As mammals, the basic design is to be on all fours and our pelvises, spines (and pelvic floors) are a compromise.

learnasyougo · 20/01/2014 17:12

who is to say women in the past had great pelvic floors? Evolutionary pressures have no mechanism to select for strong or better designed pelvic floors, as long as a weak one is neither life threatening nor likely to lead to poorer outcomes in child bearing or child rearing.

I wonder whether the gentlemanly habit of allowing ladies to sit, and the unseemliness of women participating in sports is as a consequence of these problems being common (and back then, not very fixable).

I'm sure this problem is as common in cultures that do squat to wee (though pooing is better done in a squat).

KatnipEvergreen · 20/01/2014 16:15

I do wonder why we all, or a lot of us seem naturally constructed so that our pf muscles are naturally a bit crap though, unless we do some recently invented exercises several times a day.

Obviously having poor muscle tone in general can cause health problems, but this seems to also happen to people who are otherwise fit and healthy.

What is it about modern lifestyles, aside from say, eating too much or not moving about enough, that causes pf problems? I've heard someone say it's due to modern toilets, and that we sit on them rather than squatting over a hole in the ground, but other than that, why should pf go wrong of its own accord? It is just the toilets?

PenguinsDontEatKale · 20/01/2014 15:15

Right, this is a bit of a hijack but I'm hoping Gussie might see it...

I have had mild pelvic floor issues since DD1 was born 5 years ago. In between pregnancies, I've used Aquaflex as well as pelvic floor exercises, but never got it totally fixed. It seems to be the 'speed' response rather than overall strength that causes me problems as I could do loads of weights with the Aquaflex, even on the smaller whatsit.

I am now 6 months with DC3 and trying to get through to my local physics but having a few issues. In the meantime, are there any particular exercises I should focus on?

MillyRules · 20/01/2014 15:10

Good for you Katnip hope you do really well Smile

MillyRules · 20/01/2014 15:09

Yes Gussie thanks. So helpful and encouraging.Grin

TheseAreTheJokesFolks · 20/01/2014 15:07

Thanks gussie for your posts.

KatnipEvergreen · 20/01/2014 15:03

I apologise if I made anyone feel bad. I'm just improving my running again and training for a race so I guess it hit a raw nerve. I was really referring to people who said in the past that physical exercise damages women - in a sexist way, to keep women down, so that's what I was thinking of. Of course you shouldn't run if it causes you physical problems- my dad can't run because of his hips these days, but he loved running. He does walk a lot though and is still fit.

MillyRules · 20/01/2014 15:00

I'm in Gussie. Squeeze squeeze!!!!

MillyRules · 20/01/2014 14:58

Katnip you were rather dismissive in your earlier post regarding how some of us have given up running because of our pf issues. You said that it was rubbish. So you are equally guilty here of making others feel bad.

gussiegrips · 20/01/2014 14:54

Delighted to hear it.

I'm totally getting an Olympic squad together...who wants to be in it?

The supermarket checkout queue
The between-service-stations-motorway-drive
The lugging a buggy with toddler and shopping up steps
The bus sprint
The birthday party bouncy castle

Be great telly sport!

gussiegrips · 20/01/2014 14:52

Learn - part of the issue is that pf problems are not-very-interesting bread and butter to consultants.

To be fair to them, most women will say "oh, I did the exercises, doctor, it made no difference"

No one checks whether she's doing them correctly or often enough. The NICE guidelines say you need to have an internal to establish strength, spasm, detachment of muscle, neurological or co-ordination problems.
Without doing one there's no way of telling whether you've got spasm, and, if you're 30w pregnant then your pf's working overtime as it is and it's not the time to sort it out!

Might be worth having a chat with your MW, they are great at the pregnant pf. And, then, get a referral from a physio. Who'll be nice to you or I'll shout at her

MillyRules · 20/01/2014 14:47

That's how I felt too Gussie . I read everything I could on the subject and went for the exercises like a demented woman Smile .

KatnipEvergreen · 20/01/2014 14:47

Thanks Gussie. It means a lot.

gussiegrips · 20/01/2014 14:46

Milly - yoga done well is great. Like pilates. ANd, the "3" is a yogic doodah - mula bhanda I think.

gussiegrips · 20/01/2014 14:45

Katnip, I apologise, I don't mean to make you feel pressured.

You are right, some women leak from early adulthood - about 25% of 15-35 year olds. THat's one of the factors that leads many women to stop participating in sport.

But, truly, leaking is not normal. However, I take your point, if it's not a problem for you then it is not a problem.

I am sorry, I didn't mean to make you feel uncomfortable.