How can I stand firm about care for my elderly mum?

In that case, all you can do is control how you deal with the situation and that might well meaning that you withdraw from it.

I don't know quite how it all works, but there are cared for people in Fife who have had automated toilets installed by social work - I think it works a bit like a toilet and bidet all-in-one. Apparently, they're used with very frail people who cannot wipe. I'm wondering whether that might be an option.

The fact that your mum is using a bidet is a bit alarming - they can be rather unstable, unfortunately, and often cause more bother than they're worth.

When Mum was in her own place, Homecare wanted me to move her bed downstairs into the living room with a bed in case she fell on the stairs.

Instead, I had a stairgate put on (as Homecare requested), but at the top. I converted the 2nd bedroom into living room and Mum kept her own bedroom and access to the bathroom. Although Mum had severe mobility problems, she was still able to walk to the bathroom at that stage.

I was doing a short commute to work each day, driving to Mum's town - only about 14 miles away - to check on things and then driving back home, about 12 miles. (The worst was when DH had open heart surgery and I had to add on an hour's commute each way to the hospital, but Dad was still alive then, though he had medical issues of his own.)

Mum did need more help as her problems progressed. We managed to build on a wet room adjacent to her bedroom in our house, but she did need help in there.

At the time, I didn't know about the automated toilets that I've mentioned.

I took care of her care between 8 pm and 7 am as well as dealing with all DH's care.

In your case, OP, nothing is going to change until you insist on it. You might have to force your mother and brother into going down the carer route by withdrawing.

Your mum will be feeling frightened. Even if it does not show as timid and crying but bolshy and attacking. Fundamentally she has explained she is feeling at the lowest she has her whole life. Because the indignity of having to have people do the most basic things for you, to be so dependent is undignified. And she knows you do not want to be anywhere near her.

It does not have to be all or nothing. There are things you feel you cannot do. Which is fine. Not everyone can. But you and your brother do need to find care for your mother while your brother is away. Either a respite residential or care that comes to her.

It is not a question of whether she wants it or not. It is what is required. Your brother should be supportive, not resistant. And for you, if you are asked to look after her, a carer will be there to support you to do so.

Can mum self pay for that ? Assuming she is still capable to think and manage mind wise you will need to discuss that with her.

If she does not have full capacity, and an assessment will help there as others have said, she will still need the support. It is your mother’s needs that matter.

Your brother should not be refusing support for your mother.

I assume she lives near to you.

Why are you minimising your brother’s contribution Op? It isn’t easier if he is living there, effectively his life is on hold. You note that if it wasn’t for childcare you’d consider going NC so suggests it is transactional for you. Perhaps time for a hard look at how to sort out your own childcare needs and then an honest conversation with Mum and brother on just what you are prepared to do or not so they can take any steps needed. Having experience of elder care it is a bit like boiling frog where it slowly gets more and more without time to sit back and consider whether it’s viable.

Yep. You clearly dislike your brother, OP.

There is an awful lot being assumed about how the OP could take control. Again that must be from a place of naivety.

If a person is able to make their own decisions the OP has absolutely no input here. There is no outside agency that will agree with the OPs side here. This is exactly what external agencies want, a family to take the entire burden of responsibility so they are not paying elsewhere.

The contribution from her brother is absolutely enormous and all the OP can do is keep supporting him as best as she can but also setting her own limits.

No more childcare, that is entirely unreasonable given the level of demands on him for caring already.

If he chooses not to use external care, that is a choice so the OP is free to say no to providing respite if it is too much with the other practical demands she has and the brother and mother will be forced to adapt one way or another.

There are options for respite that can be set up in these situations but that is a choice. This situation really runs the risk of carer burnout but that is because of the level of cares needs and the unwillingness to use services that are available so it is not in the OP’s control.

There is literally no way to keep everyone happy @Dottyraindrops don’t even try.

One thing that might help is looking into the Patients’ Transport Service. That would relieve you of such frequent driving.

You do seem to minimise your brothers contribution. Everything he does is easy or barely an inconvenience and yet when you do it it’s a huge bind. It sounds like he can’t go out in the evening for example, or in the morning till your mum is set up for the day?
Who does all the cooking, cleaning and gardening? Who does the shopping and pays all the bills? What is the plan for when your mum needs more care?

You can say no but with your mum's needs your also cannot asked for childcare.

All you can do is say what is reasonable for you, and deal with the fallout. What you unfortunately can’t do is to control the emotions of others. There isn’t a way to live a reasonable life (full time job and single parenthood is more than enough) and not have your mother lashing out at you. So be it.

A bit of respite care here and there isn't going to provide him with a life where he can find a partner.

She can go into respite care. That’s what my Nanna had to do. My DM needed a break and her DB wasn’t in a position to do, he therefore paid.

I cared for my mum for 36 hours after she was discharged from hospital, I was on my knees after it, thankfully I had to dial 999 as she was unwell & shouldn't have been discharged & she was sent back to hospital. Even with carers 4 times a day it was too much. The time has come for you & your brother to make a decision & involved outside care, either visiting carers or a care home.

I'm trying to understand the full situation here. I'm assuming - possibly incorrectly - that your brother doesn't have a paid job, @Dottyraindrops , and is in receipt of Carer's Allowance?

You can't control what other people do, only your own actions.

If I understand correctly, you don't want to provide care for your mother (and that might mean that someone else will have to take her to appointments etc). You do want some extra help with childcare for yourself.

The only way might be for you to stop paying for holidays for your brother and spending the money on the extra childcare you need.

It then falls to your mother to organise care for herself, if she has capacity. That might mean that she moves into a care home, thus freeing your brother to get a paid job (if he's not already in any form of paid employment - as I'm already assuming he's with your mother nearly 24/7 ).

If she owns her house, then it's probable that it will have to be sold to pay for a care home, although it might be possible for carers to come to her - I'm not sure how the system works in the UK outside Scotland (if you're in the UK), but an income assessment will need to be made. There's a distinct possibility that your brother might need to find somewhere else to live if your mother finally agrees that a care home is the best option.

It's a horrible situation, but I don't see what else can be done.

The other thing to take into consideration is that your brother might not always be fit enough to provide care for your mother.

I recall phoning my husband's daughter to explain that I had a health issue and that if anything happened to me, that care would need to be put in place for her father. Her response was 'You're not thinking of leaving him, are you?'

When I got the all-clear and let her know - but reiterated that anything happening to me would necessitate care, her response was 'But you're all right, aren't you?'

It then dawned on me that the thought that she might have organise care had never crossed her mind. I think that this is quite common in families - possibly because the thought of organising this is overwhelming.

Your brother really needs the carer assessment that's already been mentioned, so that Social Work are at least aware of your mother's needs. That way, if anything ever happens the emergency number for Social Work can be called and they can at least have a record of your mother's medical problems.

Possibly. Or it might be that the mother is still deemed to have the capacity to make her own decisions around care and the OP's brother has been guilted into the situation by his mother.

Then sort out your childcare and insist that carers are organised for your mother.

At one point, I was working full-time and providing all the care for my husband and all the nght-time care for my mother. Mum had severe osteoporosis (had had several spinal and other fractures) plus dementia; DH had hemiparesis following a stroke. Fortunately he was compos mentis, but I had to get him dressed etc before I went to work and also very often had to help with Mum, even with carers coming during the day.

There were times that Mum went into respite care - for example, when I had an operation. Mind you, there was one time I had a shoulder op and the promised respite care fell through.

I just had to manage, though at least I was signed off work for three weeks.

God willing, children become more independent and more able to care for themselves as they grow up. Adults in need of care generally become more and more dependent - except that they're more likely to complain or to refuse to comply with the person caring for them.

You're well within your right to refuse to provide care, but your brother needs respite. As others have said, a carer assessment needs to be made.

Your brother could have a look here for advice. https://www.carersuk.org/

ETA I do know what it's like to run about between two houses and work - that's what I had to do before we could organise to have Mum living with us.

Presumably he'd have looked into respite care if he wanted to. These things aren't all down to family.

And he'll never have the chance to have a partner or children while he's providing all the care, will he?

@DottyraindropsI’m sorry you’re having a hard time. It sounds really tough but you do also sound like a lovely family!! You’re already helping your Mum so much and so is your brother - and he’s also helping you - and you’re paying for his holiday. I’m sorry your Mum doesn’t get it but I suppose she is getting older and unwell etc. I’m afraid I have no advice on carers etc but whatever you decide, you should feel proud of the way you and your brother are supporting her and each other x

Hold on OP , how offered is you brother away for one , but have I got this right you don’t want to help them , but still want and expect help from them and that’s the only reason your not no contact …

Your brother is doing a lot. Obviously not saying that only women should do caring, but just wanting the odd holiday doesn't sound wrong. Not sure where you live, but attendance allowance wouldn't even cover one visit per day here. Unless you pay extra, or are willing to let them be put in a "carehome", family need to do some of the care. Not easy when we're working full-time and have kids.

I sympathise OP. I also have young kids and a mum needing that kind of care. I feel really sad for my kids when I can’t sit and chat with them at bedtime because I need to go get grandma sorted out, etc. We’re kind of finding the new normal at the moment after a big downturn in her health but no way would it be sustainable for me to need to get her up or put her to bed in the long term.

Previously I was up and down the motorway to help her and it would “have” to be at least a two night stay every time; actually it was unsettling for the kids to have their mum disappear for half the week a couple of times a month, unpredictably, and I only realised after they all started displaying stress behaviours.

Yes it sounds like your brother is taking on a lot. But presumably you haven’t asked him to. Anyway your kids deserve a normal life that is not dominated by elder care.

My children are my priority (my mother finds this hard as she feels she should be my first priority as she did everything for me when I was young).

Maybe you need to point out to her that you now need to do everything for your children as they are young?

I sympathise as I've had to put my mother into care as she lives 90 miles from me and in a different country to DB. She's not happy.

Is your brother caring for her 24/7 plus providing childcare for you on an ad hoc basis? Is he happy to do that?

You absolutely do not have to care for your mother more than you already do, but you cannot expect the childcare in this case.