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Elderly parents

Catch 22 with elderly parents and POA

60 replies

charliehungerford · 13/08/2025 11:56

My in-laws, 89 and 90, live independently at home a few hours away from me, they have been in their current home since the 1960’s. We organise home shopping, prescriptions etc and visit when we can. They are no longer able to keep on top of their finances, are pretty much housebound, can’t get to a bank unless we take them, don’t do tech, refuse to pay anything on line, won’t use cards. They have both become very confused over the past year and their short term memory is terrible. They don’t recall a conversation you had with them an hour ago.

They sorted POA ten years ago, they have POA for financial issues for each other, and then their three children are named, two of which live overseas. Problem is that the children (one of which is my husband) cannot act for them unless their POA’s for each other are revoked. They don’t understand why they need to be revoked, they don’t have capacity to instruct their solicitor to change it, but they don’t have capacity to act for each other in the event of something happening, such as needing to pay for carers etc. They have numerous bank accounts with significant funds but have no way of accessing them as they don’t understand how to without significant assistance, but as we cannot currently use the POA we are stuck.

they did the right thing setting up the POA but unfortunately they are trapped in an awful situation where they aren’t able to act for each other and no one can act for them.

Does anyone have any experience of this problem? Any advice on how to move forward would be appreciated.

OP posts:
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ScaryM0nster · 16/08/2025 09:31

charliehungerford · 15/08/2025 14:24

At the moment They don’t want to engage with social services, they seem quite afraid of them getting involved. I think they think they’d be ‘put in a home’. We’ve explained it doesn’t work like that. They don’t need any more income. they probably have around £2k a month spare that is not being spent as well as significant savings (as in a few hundred thousand). They could pay for help if required but would be reluctant to do so. They would see it as wasting money. They are an ordinary working class couple who have been very frugal all their lives, hence the large amount of savings, it’s not going to change any time soon. We’ve always encouraged them to spend their capital but they won’t. Their kitchen is over 50 years old!

One angle that might be helpful.

Spend some money so you dont need to go into a home.

Treat yourselves (and me) to a cleaner.

If there’s that much excess than may have the potential to agree to spend half on it on care home avoidance tactics.

LifeOfAShowGirl · 15/08/2025 22:28

Bateson · 15/08/2025 20:39

You don’t need to be engaged with Adult Social Care to apply for Attendance Allowance. Nor is it means tested.

I’m at actually quite the opposite. You must be fully funding your care yourself to get it. If you’re technically being funded by the local authority while your house sells, but refunding when it’s sold, you can get a backdated payment.

charliehungerford · 15/08/2025 22:19

saraclara · 15/08/2025 21:23

Exactly. We claimed attendance allowance when I was nursing my husband through his terminal cancer. Macmillan suggested it, helped fill in the forms, and that was it.

Have you spoken to Age UK @charliehungerford ? Their helpline is excellent.

Thank you. I will look into it.

OP posts:
saraclara · 15/08/2025 21:23

Bateson · 15/08/2025 20:39

You don’t need to be engaged with Adult Social Care to apply for Attendance Allowance. Nor is it means tested.

Exactly. We claimed attendance allowance when I was nursing my husband through his terminal cancer. Macmillan suggested it, helped fill in the forms, and that was it.

Have you spoken to Age UK @charliehungerford ? Their helpline is excellent.

Bateson · 15/08/2025 20:39

You don’t need to be engaged with Adult Social Care to apply for Attendance Allowance. Nor is it means tested.

charliehungerford · 15/08/2025 14:28

LemograssLollipop · 15/08/2025 06:41

Capacity assessments do need to be paid for and ime cost around £500 for an independent one of your GP won't do it

An attorney can disclaim their appointment so if each parent did this for each other, it allows the replacement attorneys to step up and act.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/disclaim-a-lasting-power-of-attorney

Edited

That’s very interesting. Thank you. I’ll look into this.

OP posts:
charliehungerford · 15/08/2025 14:24

Kyotoorbust · 15/08/2025 06:31

They do need to claim it. It isnt just the money you get engagement with adult social care here as well,

have they had a social services assessment in the home? just put in a request

it is £10k a year for a couple. I told my parents that the government were paying to them as they recognised they needed some extra help and they had to spend it on that. We started with extra cleaning days but in effect another day when someone popped in and checked they were ok

At the moment They don’t want to engage with social services, they seem quite afraid of them getting involved. I think they think they’d be ‘put in a home’. We’ve explained it doesn’t work like that. They don’t need any more income. they probably have around £2k a month spare that is not being spent as well as significant savings (as in a few hundred thousand). They could pay for help if required but would be reluctant to do so. They would see it as wasting money. They are an ordinary working class couple who have been very frugal all their lives, hence the large amount of savings, it’s not going to change any time soon. We’ve always encouraged them to spend their capital but they won’t. Their kitchen is over 50 years old!

OP posts:
charliehungerford · 15/08/2025 14:15

Kyotoorbust · 15/08/2025 06:23

Or you could get them for free via the gp
spamming for your ‘friend’ isn’t acceptable

I understand that their GP doesn’t provide this service, but I heard that from a third party so will check myself.

OP posts:
Kyotoorbust · 15/08/2025 06:58

LemograssLollipop · 15/08/2025 06:41

Capacity assessments do need to be paid for and ime cost around £500 for an independent one of your GP won't do it

An attorney can disclaim their appointment so if each parent did this for each other, it allows the replacement attorneys to step up and act.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/disclaim-a-lasting-power-of-attorney

Edited

They refer you to the nhs clinic service which is contracted out here who do them
here. No need to pay

LemograssLollipop · 15/08/2025 06:41

Capacity assessments do need to be paid for and ime cost around £500 for an independent one of your GP won't do it

An attorney can disclaim their appointment so if each parent did this for each other, it allows the replacement attorneys to step up and act.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/disclaim-a-lasting-power-of-attorney

Disclaim a lasting power of attorney

How to stop being an attorney under a lasting power of attorney (LPA).

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/disclaim-a-lasting-power-of-attorney

PermanentTemporary · 15/08/2025 06:35

@kyotoorbust that’s not true AFAIK. PoA for your spouse is very useful in a lot of circumstances. Being next of kin has no legal status in the UK. Having power of attorney means you can make actual health and/or financial decisions with legal status in the other person’s best interests.

Kyotoorbust · 15/08/2025 06:32

charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 23:34

I know, I said this earlier. We are going to have to get a capacity assessment done for both of them. It’s frustrating though, we don’t want to put them through that, but looks like we have no choice. It’s frustrating that they thought setting up their POA ten years ago was the right thing to do, no one envisioned them Both losing capacity at the same time. It’s very sad.

A capacity assessment starts with a visit to the gp. That is it. Simple start and then the gp advises from there

at the same time adult social care can be contacted and do a home visit

Kyotoorbust · 15/08/2025 06:31

charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 08:18

I appreciate attendance allowance is there for people who need it but the in laws have a very good income most of which they are not spending, it’s just sitting in various bank accounts. They don’t need any extra financial support.

I did enquire about social services being involved but they wouldn’t agree to that, and to be honest with them being self funding I doubt SS are interested, or have the manpower.

They do need to claim it. It isnt just the money you get engagement with adult social care here as well,

have they had a social services assessment in the home? just put in a request

it is £10k a year for a couple. I told my parents that the government were paying to them as they recognised they needed some extra help and they had to spend it on that. We started with extra cleaning days but in effect another day when someone popped in and checked they were ok

Kyotoorbust · 15/08/2025 06:26

charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 23:37

I think our situation is slightly different as mil and fil have POA for each other. I’m sure we’ll get some resolution but it’s hard work !

Did they take advice at the time?
it was pointless if they were married

Kyotoorbust · 15/08/2025 06:23

coldinsummer · 13/08/2025 19:36

A friend of mine works for this company who can do MCA for you. Something like this would work.
https://tsfassessments.co.uk/

Or you could get them for free via the gp
spamming for your ‘friend’ isn’t acceptable

charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 23:37

Juneday · 14/08/2025 15:07

Had an easy time sorting this for MiL as she said I can't understand my bank or bank statements and I keep loosing passwords and that person on the phone doesn't help (a recorded voice message mostly). So I had to make an appointment with the bank and had a 6 week wait, when I went with my ID etc (DH & I both named on PoA) I was asked whether this was to fully remove her from accessing bank account or some sort of half way - I didn't know what was an option. She recognised her own ability and later had a nasty fall and was in hospital on and off for a while so it was good timing BUT my DS and I were talking about parents and we can't see them ever admitting they can't understand or cope with finances - albeit we have PoA. We wondered whether at any point their bank would be obliged (FCA rules maybe) to suggest it? So I am interested to see how this works - I suspect it will be at least another year before DPs are noticeably struggling, but DM got a letter from the bank when I was there and she couldn't understand it but wouldn't ask me for help nor show me - they are meeting the bank tomorrow and I am half expecting a phone to ask my advise post the meeting. Good luck OP and let us know when you get this resolved.

I think our situation is slightly different as mil and fil have POA for each other. I’m sure we’ll get some resolution but it’s hard work !

OP posts:
charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 23:34

LifeOfAShowGirl · 14/08/2025 10:05

This isn’t true and I highly doubt this is what the OPG has told you. You’ve been told multiple times what you need to do. “Removing” them doesn’t mean that they need to make new LPAs. It means you send the original LPAs to the OPG with proof of the attorneys lacking capacity.

I know, I said this earlier. We are going to have to get a capacity assessment done for both of them. It’s frustrating though, we don’t want to put them through that, but looks like we have no choice. It’s frustrating that they thought setting up their POA ten years ago was the right thing to do, no one envisioned them Both losing capacity at the same time. It’s very sad.

OP posts:
Juneday · 14/08/2025 15:07

Had an easy time sorting this for MiL as she said I can't understand my bank or bank statements and I keep loosing passwords and that person on the phone doesn't help (a recorded voice message mostly). So I had to make an appointment with the bank and had a 6 week wait, when I went with my ID etc (DH & I both named on PoA) I was asked whether this was to fully remove her from accessing bank account or some sort of half way - I didn't know what was an option. She recognised her own ability and later had a nasty fall and was in hospital on and off for a while so it was good timing BUT my DS and I were talking about parents and we can't see them ever admitting they can't understand or cope with finances - albeit we have PoA. We wondered whether at any point their bank would be obliged (FCA rules maybe) to suggest it? So I am interested to see how this works - I suspect it will be at least another year before DPs are noticeably struggling, but DM got a letter from the bank when I was there and she couldn't understand it but wouldn't ask me for help nor show me - they are meeting the bank tomorrow and I am half expecting a phone to ask my advise post the meeting. Good luck OP and let us know when you get this resolved.

LifeOfAShowGirl · 14/08/2025 10:05

charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 10:03

DH has spoken to the OPG. They confirmed that as long as Mil and FIL have POA for each other, the replacement attorneys can’t act on their behalf. They need to be removed. It’s just proving difficult to remove them due to their lack of understanding of the process.

This isn’t true and I highly doubt this is what the OPG has told you. You’ve been told multiple times what you need to do. “Removing” them doesn’t mean that they need to make new LPAs. It means you send the original LPAs to the OPG with proof of the attorneys lacking capacity.

charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 10:03

saraclara · 14/08/2025 08:44

Did you contact the OPG or did you go straight to a solicitor?

I think you're making this harder and more drawn out (and more expensive) than it needs to be. Just pick up the phone and speak to the OPG. They're really helpful.

DH has spoken to the OPG. They confirmed that as long as Mil and FIL have POA for each other, the replacement attorneys can’t act on their behalf. They need to be removed. It’s just proving difficult to remove them due to their lack of understanding of the process.

OP posts:
saraclara · 14/08/2025 08:44

Did you contact the OPG or did you go straight to a solicitor?

I think you're making this harder and more drawn out (and more expensive) than it needs to be. Just pick up the phone and speak to the OPG. They're really helpful.

TeenToTwenties · 14/08/2025 08:41

re Attendance Allowance. It can be a 'gateway' to assist in getting other things such as blue badges (I think).

charliehungerford · 14/08/2025 08:18

Kyotoorbust · 13/08/2025 18:39

if in England

Make sure that you have claimed attendance allowance for them both. Long form but low threshold and basically virtually automatic at their age

Also claim for a reduction in council tax due to mental infirmity. Just email the council

if you ask for a social services assessment they will probably action both of the above for you as part of that

I appreciate attendance allowance is there for people who need it but the in laws have a very good income most of which they are not spending, it’s just sitting in various bank accounts. They don’t need any extra financial support.

I did enquire about social services being involved but they wouldn’t agree to that, and to be honest with them being self funding I doubt SS are interested, or have the manpower.

OP posts:
Kyotoorbust · 13/08/2025 18:39

if in England

Make sure that you have claimed attendance allowance for them both. Long form but low threshold and basically virtually automatic at their age

Also claim for a reduction in council tax due to mental infirmity. Just email the council

if you ask for a social services assessment they will probably action both of the above for you as part of that

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