Page 4 | MIL care costs

Original poster

NoHaudinMaWheest · 08/01/2025 18:24

Autumnalmists I don't know but don't think so. LA are providing the amount of funding that she would be entitled to given her needs minus the amount she is assessed to pay out of her income. I.e. same as if she had carers coming in daily. Which is why it nowhere near covers live in care.
Don't know what DH will feel about the inheritance if it comes. I have kept my inheritance from my parents separately as otherwise I have very little of my own but I have also used it for joint costs e.g house adaptions we made for Dd.

OP posts:

Autumnalmists · 08/01/2025 18:15

My only thought is has a charge been put on the house already? As you say SS are providing funding for her live in 1:1 care. If they are providing more than attendance/carer’s allowance does this money have to be paid back, from the estate of the house. Is there actually a full house to inherit?

if your DH says his money is his, then the inheritance will also be his alone then? Ignoring that he has been able to earn his pension due to your role.

Original poster

NoHaudinMaWheest · 08/01/2025 18:04

Custardslices I talked to SIL about it in the summer. She isn't happy but doesn't feel she has much choice and thinks that the inheritance will make up for it. As she has always been in paid employment and has her own quite good pension, she is more separate from the actual payments. I am assuming that she and BIL have at least partly separate finances.

OP posts:

catofglory · 08/01/2025 17:51

@Heretobenosy
That isn't 'romanticising' though. It genuinely did mean my mother had company all the time which suits her.

You are right of course that not all care homes are good, but in the OP's case her MIL would be self funding and they could choose any care home they liked, so a better chance of finding the right one. But anyway I'm guessing she'll be staying at home.

fashionqueen0123 · 08/01/2025 17:49

NoHaudinMaWheest · 08/01/2025 14:32

As the title says this is about paying care costs for my MIL.

I feel the need to give a fair bit of background in order for the situation to be understood and also to get things clear in my own mind. That will make it quite long so advance warning if you are short of time or capacity.

MIL is now 90. She was widowed 30+ years ago and has lived alone in her own owned home since. Until she was 79 she was pretty independent, driving, doing voluntary work, visiting friends etc.
She then had to have a fairly minor operation to remove a melanoma from her leg. She was assured that it was the type that doesn't spread systematically and that it had all been removed so once her leg had healed she could go back to normal. However she developed a severe reactive depression and stopped eating and drinking and caring for herself. She ended up very ill in hospital. After a period in acute and rehab hospitals she was discharged home, physically fine but still very depressed.
When FIL died she had taken out an insurance policy which would provide care at home and so that was used to hire a live-in carer to persuade her to eat, drink, wash etc. She had quite a lot of psychiatric input but never improved.
A few years later she had a fall which resulted in much reduced mobility. Since then she has lived in one room - bed and commode in the sitting room, just moving to the kitchen for some meals. She doesn't do anything -watch TV, read, knit, sew or engage in conversation. She just worries endlessly and repetitively about eg if the heating is working properly.
She has had the live in carers all this time funded by the insurance policy and her savings. About 5 years ago her savings ran out. BIL has POA and does all her financial stuff as well as managing the carers and practial stuff for the house though no hands on care. He managed to get social services to agree to some financial support and that was enough for things to continue until about 2 years ago.
At that point the care company massively increased their fees which meant that there was a considerable shortfall. Again BIL did the negotiations which meant some increase in SS contributions but there was still not enough so he decided that he and SIL and DH and I would top up - £125 a week for each couple (increased to £150 from this month).
He and DH are adamant that their mother should not go into a home. They feel that as they will ultimately inherit her house they will get their money back.
Some years ago (at least 15) MIL sold a field adjacent to her house. BIL had done quite a lot to negotiate with the council and developers so she got quite a good amount for it, some of which she gave to us and to BIL and SIL. DH and BIL feel that that means that it is only fair for them to fund MIL now.

MIL is not exactly healthy but she doesn't have any life threatening conditions and this situation could go on for many years. DH and I are both in our later 60s and both have disabilities which we manage independently now but may not be able to in the future. In addition we have two children in their 20s with disabilities which require additional support and limit their earning capacity.

I feel that although we may inherit there is no guarantee. If MIL was to require 2 to 1 or overnight care in the future she would have to go into residential care and the house be sold anyway. We are paying this out of income and even if we don't absolutely need it for day to day living now, we have good reason to want to save what we can as well as living reasonably comfortably now.

I really resent being given no choice about this funding. I am not sure that living in isolation like this is really in MIL's best interests. And all this is skewed but the fact that I have never really liked MIL - the feeling is entirely mutual.

DH is quite passive and happy to go along with what BIL says. We live a lot further away and have the DCs to be responsible for while BIL and SIL are a bit younger, in good health and don't have children.

I don't even know what the figures are and am not sure that DH does either. Nor do I know for certain what MIL's will contains.

Saying no would cause a huge family rift but it is what I really want to do.

Any advice welcome (if you have managed to get to the end of this screed).

What would happen if you both stop paying?

Heretobenosy · 08/01/2025 17:39

catofglory · 08/01/2025 17:20

@NoHaudinMaWheest
I completely understand you wanting to vent!

@Heretobenosy
I have never seen anyone 'romanticise care homes'. To me it was a practical choice and the best option for my mother. It is by no means posh or upmarket but it is a welcoming pleasant place. The staff are lovely and the care is excellent. She was initially self funding but is now LA funded in her original placement. If in future I have similar care needs, I hope I have the option to go there.

I’ve seen plenty of people suggesting care home for people because of loneliness.

I’ve got very different experiences of care homes professionally as well as personally but I’m not here to convince people that there loved ones placements are actually truly awful. I’m sure for some people they’re a great fit. But unless it’s absolutely necessary for someone’s safety I would never recommend a care home

Custardslices · 08/01/2025 17:39

I'm wondering what SIL thinks of this situation.

Has anyone seen this will? How do you know she doesn't rip it up and make another one tommrow?

BIL knows something you don't as he's in no doubt over inheritance

Original poster

NoHaudinMaWheest · 08/01/2025 17:31

Arran2024 of course I know it looks mean spirited. If MIL had no other resources I would probably feel differently. If I liked her I might feel differently. If I was convinced that this situation is the best possible for her and for everyone else I would certainly feel differently.

OP posts:

catofglory · 08/01/2025 17:20

@NoHaudinMaWheest
I completely understand you wanting to vent!

@Heretobenosy
I have never seen anyone 'romanticise care homes'. To me it was a practical choice and the best option for my mother. It is by no means posh or upmarket but it is a welcoming pleasant place. The staff are lovely and the care is excellent. She was initially self funding but is now LA funded in her original placement. If in future I have similar care needs, I hope I have the option to go there.

Blondeshavemorefun · 08/01/2025 17:16

Can uou afford £600 a month + as I certainly couldn't

Yes nice to inherit a house but makes make sense to sell it and maybe downsize her to a smaller flat near one of you and carry on

Or

Sell and goes into a home that can care for her

Arran2024 · 08/01/2025 17:07

Many children fund their elderly parent's care, regardless of what they will inherit, because they love them and want what is best for them.

You say you don't get on with your MIL and sorry but it shows.

Imo some things are more important than money and you are going to look mean spirited if you decide you won't pay.

Caring for elderly relatives is fraught and imo if you have something that works then it's best sticking to

Original poster

NoHaudinMaWheest · 08/01/2025 17:04

cheezncrackers yes that is how I feel. Persuading DH to see it that way is another matter.

caringcarer if money is given as a gift does it still belong to the giver? It was given with no strings attached and was MIL's own decision.

OP posts:

Original poster

NoHaudinMaWheest · 08/01/2025 16:55

MIL didn't want to go into a home in the past hence taking out the insurance in the first place. Now I think that although in theory she has capacity she really isn't able to weigh all the pros and cons. She is also very passive and tends to just agree with what BIL says on more complicated matters.

I know care homes vary a lot but they are not all bad. Like calmhappyandhealthy my Mum was forced by medical advice to make that decision for my Dad. Not what either of them wanted but the only real possibilty.

To be fair to my BIL I think he does believe he his acting in MIL's best interests and is not just motivated by the inheritance. I also think he is not being realistic about future possibilities and just how bad his mother's life is at the moment.

OP posts:

DwarfPalmetto · 08/01/2025 16:52

I agree with pp, it doesn’t sound like your DH and BIL do have your MILs best interests at heart. They want to protect their inheritance. It sounds like your bil wants to control the situation and your dh goes along with it. I wonder if that has always been the dynamic between them.

My fil is in a care home and is doing much better, both physically and emotionally, than when he was on his own in the house with carers. It was the best choice for him. I have visited a few homes and they are not all as diabolical as some posters seem to think.

caringcarer · 08/01/2025 16:50

I'd agree to carry on paying until the £60k money from the field is all used up. In reality MiL might be dead by then as £60k will fund for 7 years and it was her money.

cheezncrackers · 08/01/2025 16:48

YANBU and I would massively resent paying out £600 a month for a MIL's care who I didn't even like! Plus, it sounds like you and your DH actually need that money, being retired with your own disabilities and your disabled DC to help out. Your DH needs to have an honest conversation with BIL that the two of you can no longer continue to pay this money every month. Surely BIL can understand that you and your DH are in a different financial position than he and his DW appear to be in, being younger, healthier and without DC? I think the whole issue needs to be revisited again, with it being clear that you and your DH can no longer contribute.

Calmhappyandhealthy · 08/01/2025 16:44

Heretobenosy · 08/01/2025 16:39

Sorry that happened to you though. And I say I’d never do it, but in reality there are some situations where it really is necessary, in my head I’m thinking of the times when staying at home is a viable option

Show quote history

Thank you ❤️

It was the hardest thing I've ever had to do.

We had POA but the situation was such that in the end, we had no other choice

We were determined to look after him at home but it almost destroyed us

I won't go into details....it still makes me cry and it occurred in 2022

🥰

Heretobenosy · 08/01/2025 16:39

Calmhappyandhealthy · 08/01/2025 16:34

Honestly, I’d never put my mum in a care home

I felt exactly the same about my Dad.

But the decision was taken out of my hands by the Consultant

Really opened my eyes to the power I had (or didn't have , to be more accurate)

Sorry that happened to you though. And I say I’d never do it, but in reality there are some situations where it really is necessary, in my head I’m thinking of the times when staying at home is a viable option

MissDoubleU · 08/01/2025 16:39

@Heretobenosy
Not at all the case. My father is in local authority funded care home. He has been there for over ten years (he’s now 70) and it is absolutely the best place for him. He is well cared for, is on a floor with people of a similar age/ability/mental capacity as himself. Older and dementia patients are on their own level.

He is always being taken on day trips, they do activities, have musicians/choirs/theatres come and perform for the residents. I imagine he would be extremely depressed living alone and no one to talk to. Even talking to all the different staff members does him wonders. They had lots of parties and socials for Christmas and new year too.

PosiePerkinPootleFlump · 08/01/2025 16:39

Could it be structured as a loan? So everyone funding MIL care is actually lending her money, to be repaid when her house is sold or from her estate if she dies - whichever comes earlier.

Heretobenosy · 08/01/2025 16:35

Calmhappyandhealthy · 08/01/2025 16:34

Honestly, I’d never put my mum in a care home

I felt exactly the same about my Dad.

But the decision was taken out of my hands by the Consultant

Really opened my eyes to the power I had (or didn't have , to be more accurate)

Consultants should have no power, they like think they do but if someone doesn’t have POA then the local authority become the best interest decision makers, not health

Calmhappyandhealthy · 08/01/2025 16:34

Honestly, I’d never put my mum in a care home

I felt exactly the same about my Dad.

But the decision was taken out of my hands by the Consultant

Really opened my eyes to the power I had (or didn't have , to be more accurate)

Heretobenosy · 08/01/2025 16:33

harriethoyle · 08/01/2025 16:24

@NoHaudinMaWheest check that your MIL is claiming attendance allowance. Might help reduce the shortfall if not.

If the local authority are paying for some of her care they will have already insisted on her getting attendance allowance and would take it as part of her contribution to what the local authority pay.

OnceMoreWithAttitude · 08/01/2025 16:31

NoHaudinMaWheest · 08/01/2025 15:48

TheGodWorm there are two siblings DH and BIL both married DH to me and BIL to SIL. If the will states equal splits in any inheritance (which is what we are all assuming but I don't know if anyone actually knows) can that be changed to reflect what each couple has put in?

Does your MIL have capacity (and willingness) to engage in changing her will ? If so there could be a clause about any expenditure on acre from XX date will be first paid to BIL.

Otherwise, there could be a loan agreement between your DH and his brother for half the costs of care from the agreed date - on condition that there is enough money left in the estate to pay it back.

Or your DH could give his brother a signed letter saying that if the estate allows he will repay his share out of his inheritance.

In our case asking the council to put a charge on the house was a better deal than equity release - but I am not sure whether every council does this.

Do BIL and SIL undertake any care themselves? regular visits? Managing live in carers was also a lot of work for my sibling who bore the brunt of it.

Heretobenosy · 08/01/2025 16:29

Honestly, I’d never put my mum in a care home. They are horrible places, especiallly as most people in the ones that accept local authority funding will have dementia and a really high level of need. A nice care home would be £0000’s per week but even those have their issues. I think people on mumsnet romanticise care homes as the better option for people because of loneliness, but they are not some lovely social club. Although to be fair it sounds like your MIL would be able to fund a nice home.

I guess the realt question is what does MIL want? If she wants to go to a care home then BIL is not acting in her best interest for the sake of the house. If she wants to remain at home then I think it would be difficult on your relationship to force DHs hand to withdraw the financial support. Would he resent you or blame you if a care home move coincided with her deterioration? It’s not fair on you, I would also be raging if so much of my family income was going on care costs, but DH shouldn’t be looking at this as a way to protect his inheritance, he should be only considering what is in his mums best interest. (Although it is unusual for families to cover costs in this way)