Is it better sometimes NOT to have PoA?

I will not be a P of E for my mother as her memory is getting bad . Today she said she owed me money got it out her purse and put it back in . I said to her can you pass me the money and she starts screaming she had handed it over , how I'm lying , trying to trick her etc . I've totally had enough now.

Oh dear. You have my full sympathy.

Thank you. I am discussing this with a family member who thinks normal house insurance will suffice.

Sorry to hijack the thread OP.

You have to be really careful about the terms and conditions of the insurance. I looked into it during a house renovation (living elsewhere) and under the normal house insurance visiting weekly or even sleeping there a few nights a month wasn't enough as it wasn't lived in.

We had to switch to empty property insurance.

I refused to have POA for my late DF. He self-neglected to the point of hospitalisation and had never taken responsibility for financial
matters in his life. There’s no way I could have taken it on, especially as his only relative. SS appointed someone.

If property I ersonally would get POA as others have said they'll sell it for peanuts 😬

Scotland does make a difference, I think. Not direct experience but in England people do go into care homes without being assessed as needing 24 hour care. Nursing home may be different. Our nursing home says that unless you receive the nursing supplement, you won't get access to the on-site nursing staff. But that implies they'd accept you as a self funder, but you'd have to get any medical needs separately.

OTs are great. Good to have one on your side.

@MereDintofPandiculation

If she wasn't a self-funder, there isn't a lot of choice.

She is self funding. N Scotland if that makes any difference but I was not able to get her into a home until she was assessed as needing 24 hour care. She was under assessment for months. It was a chance visit from an OT who called out a GP who overruled the carer assessment that finally got her into the home.

This has been so interesting. Thank you.

Basically, if the house is owned by one family member (or a family trust) but occupied by another family member, then they'll put you on to a landlord policy. I don't know where the dividing line is, eg parents go to Australia for 3 months leaving 21 year old son living in the house, whether that counts as unoccupied or being occupied by a tenant or simply still occupied. When it matters, of course, is if something happens and you need to make a claim and the insurance company says "we're not paying out because you failed to tell us that the house was occupied by a tenant".

If she wasn't a self-funder, there isn't a lot of choice. The LA will not pay for a care home unless she can't manage at home, and will often want to trial that. Managing at home means sitting alone in a room with a commode for company and up to 4 visits daily from carers. It is appalling what is considered an acceptable quality of life for our elderly people.

Thanks @SabrinaThwaite

@MereDintofPandiculation

It always will be the medics making the decisions, and social services can only give what is in their gift. What PoA gives you is the ability to speak for the person and make sure their wishes are heard, even though they may be overridden by medical concerns

It wasn't medical decisions, it was trying to get her discharged from hospital to a care home. She suffered months of utter neglect at the hands of 'carers' who said she was fine to be left alone. Nobody listened to me. Nobody.

@Coldilocks My DM’s home insurer allows the property to be unoccupied for a maximum of 60 days. Occasional stays by relatives wouldn’t count towards occupancy. After that it needs to be changed to a specialist insurer for empty properties. The insurer asked if I had LPA but didn’t require a copy. I’ve also notified the Council as it becomes council tax exempt and have had to prove that I have LPA to do that.

We just have the financial LPA, I don’t think we’d want to do the health one as we’re IK with the medical professionals taking the decisions. We did make sure that the care home had a copy of the RESPECT form.

grandparent - does the same apply to parent?

If you have a family member living in a house owned by a grandparent, the insurance will want you to change to a landlord policy, even if there is no letting contract and no rent.

It always will be the medics making the decisions, and social services can only give what is in their gift. What PoA gives you is the ability to speak for the person and make sure their wishes are heard, even though they may be overridden by medical concerns

Re Insurance - what if other family members visit the house / stay over, so the house is never left empty for 31 days? Does the name on the insurance cover need to be changed to the person who uses the house more?

It’s things like, needing to change the insurance on her house if she’s not living there anymore. So much that would be ‘stuck’ waiting.

LAs very rarely (if ever) make Deputyship applications for Health and Welfare matters. Decision makers for social care matters would be a Social Worker and for medical decisions a Doctor, other health professional. Professionals who make 'Best Interest' decisions for people without capacity follow a legally defined formula, which involves consulting family/friends about their views or if there is no one to consult they commission a professional advocate.
LPoA for finances/property is different as others cannot make and enact financial decisions without a legal basis. If someone hasn't given LPoA and decisions need to be made the LA may apply for Deputyship, or more likely ask a local Solicitor to. and is entitled to charge professional fees for this. This is an expensive and prolonged process.

Once they'd obtained a Deputyship Order, they'd probably sell to pay fees. They wouldn't want to mess around with a charge or renting the property out.

Do they still have capacity? If they refuse to sell, there is usually a DPA so the Council can recoup their costs. Honestly, you are better off selling the house, releasing the funds and putting your relative in a home of your choosing. If you leave it to the Council, you won't get much, if any, choice as to where they end up.

AgeUK website is very informative about funding options.

My parent didn't give me PoA, no siblings. No house to sell.
Adult ss took over there pension and paid for the care home etc. liased with me about there council house, care and bills.
Was pretty easy and I don't really have to do much other than zoom call meetings about the care.