Anyone have a relative in a mcarthey stone? Need advice

@Edinlassy , I wondered if there was any update on the situation as I know of someone considering moving to a MS property.

Op I am so sorry you are going through this does she have a social worker assigned to her?

i would refer it to social services and walk away let them deal with it she is refusing to let you help her and you are under no obligation to do so

@Edinlassy please don’t feel bad for stepping away. I always feel terrible for relatives putting themselves through the wringer for a societal expectation. Not every person, no matter how disabled, is a nice person and I have certainly come across some people who despite having given birth to children could not be classed as a mother in the true sense.

no one will think badly of you. And if someone does they can go try and help her. Trust me, I have rung adult children who have said they want nothing to do with their parents care, and have always believed that there was a reason for that and not judged them for it.

you can’t help her, she doesn’t want it. She only wants to abuse you further. Step away and focus on your own children to be the mom that you would have wanted (which I’m sure you are).

I hope things ate a little clearer today OP, and like other PPs, suggest you walk away for your own sake.

Although it’s too late now rentals are much more flexible. People tend to move into them far too late. DM had very happy times in her one but she rented. I would never suggest buying one at say mid 80’s. They really aren’t a rip off if you look into properly. Never buy brand new. Look at second hand if you insist on buying or rent.

you then need to clean up her apartment and get it onto the market
will there even be enough equity left to make it worth the cost and effort of dealing with the place though?
These places are a rip off, I'd be tempted to abandon it to them!

As a person who has dealt with a similar situation, the best advice I can give you is to refuse to take responsibility.
You have to be hard line, clear that you are not dealing for your own health.
Only then will the relevant authorities actually deal with what needs to be done.
Take care of yourself x.

I know its easy to say but you really need to step away. If you do SS will have to do something eventually. They will probably contact you first but if you say you won't get involved they will sort something out.
It will eb better for her in the long term and for you as well.
Please try and get free from the obligation and look after yourself

Firstly thinking of you going through this tough situation.

Secondly, the MS contracts are pretty tight, I've been through them when some of my congregation who live in them have had issues. But I'd also add that most leasehold properties have rules and even with freehold you can be made to sort out issues that are causing issues for your neighbours.

Thirdly I do think that at best you can buy her time before she needs to move but from what you have written social services need to step in and section her to more appropriate living facilities, sad but it's for the better good (you then need to clean up her apartment and get it onto the market but you will need to go the the court of protection if she hasn't got a power of attorney signed)

I think you need to say very clearly to your husband that you'd appreciate his support, not pressure to go against your own best judgement.

You stepped back to allow your Mum to reach a point where she will get the support she actually needs. And that's working. The manager and the GP and the mental health team and social services aren't emotionally involved and they have actual legal powers to intervene; so let them. When they call you, just say 'Oh dear, she won't let me near her I'm afraid. What are you planning to do next?' And whatever they say, answer, 'I'm sure that's well worth a try, go ahead'. That's all you need to do.

This is not fixable by you, so don't try. If things get bad enough, it may actually result in some kind of permanent support structure.

If she owns the flat then realistically it will be very difficult for them to force her out.

Sounds horrendous. Others have mentioned NHS/social services.

I used to work in a council environmental health department. We had powers to go into people's homes (by force if necessary) if they were filthy/hazardous (under section 83 of the Public Health Act 1936 if I remember correctly) and get the premises cleaned up. We were typically called in by neighbours because of the smell. We worked closely with NHS/social services to support the resident as they were always elderly/vulnerable. Social services also had a 'blitz squad' that could clean up homes

I’m not sure what you mean by refusing to let you activate the POA. If you have poa then it comes into force, decision by decision I think, if she lacks capacity to make that decision, and it does sound like she lacks capacity to make certain decisions but relevant healthcare professionals can assess this. It does sound like she needs to be somewhere else at least for a while which would allow you to clean up, assuming you are able/willing to help. I had MIL and DM in Mc and S and similar. As PPs have said flats are leasehold so you don’t have as much control as freehold. Some Mc and S are now allowing renting which probably makes more sense as it can be really difficult to sell if no longer suitable. You might find you can rent it out?? Or sell if her long term needs are unlikely to improve? Difficult situation and they often sell for less than they were bought for if bought new.

I know this makes me sound terrible
@Edinlassy nothing that you have said here makes you sound terrible.
You are clearly a good decent person trying to do the right thing in a terrible situation, dealing with a woman who's behavior is beyond terrible and who is extremely dysfunctional.
There is nothing that you can do to improve the situation. McCarthy & stone have had all her money, let them deal with it.

I think I would be having a frank conversation with MS ( as well as following up all, of the great information posted regarding Social Care.

I would be telling MS that I fully support any actions that they legally need to take and that you are not responsible. Work with them. If she is homeless SC will have to sort.

Maybe just let what’s going to happen , happen .She sounds like she’ll be sectioned again and as much as you’ve tried ,there’s not much you can do about it. There’s no point you having a mental breakdown too.

She doesn't need to be in your life anymore OP. You can walk away. It's ok to do so.

This is horrendous for you. Could you allow entry to the flat when she is at dialysis?

OP this sounds like an awful situation, I'm so sorry you feel so alone in dealing with it. I only know about England, so if you are in the other UK nations this may be wrong, sorry....
If your Mum bought the M&C flat, she will have the contract I assume? This will tell you what M&C will do if she breaches conditions, not allowing essential checks eg of boiler etc likely to be a significant breach. Did you sign anything as a guarantor or to take on any sort of obligation? If not, you could walk away, if you chose to.
The Manager may harangue you to "sort it out" (er actually possibly more her job than yours) but you have tried and cannot do so. Ask her what the next step is at their end? Landlords quite rightly take their obligation to do checks mega seriously. I expect the Manager will escalate to her seniors on Monday if the check doesn't go ahead. What has the Manager done to expedite the checks? The Manager's Manager will have dealt with this issue before and may have a more constructive take, it's not an uncommon situation. Your Mum pays these people's salary!
In terms of the conditions she is living in, does she have a named Social Worker or Care Coordinator from either/or the local Mental Health Trust or Local Council? Has she given permission for them to share information with you? If she has not, this may be why you're feeling fobbed off by the Social Worker. Do you have a name? If so ask the person if they are able to share information with you. If not, they can (and should) still listen to your concerns. Ask if her capacity to make the decision to live in squalor, self neglect and jeopardise her accommodation has been recently assessed? Ask for them to make enquiries under S42 Care Act (Safeguarding).
I think your best bet to getting the NHS/Social care to help is via the manager of the hospital treatment service where your Mum goes 3x per week. I have to say this is quite an unusual provision these days - she definitely goes there does she? Explain your concerns to the Manager, particularly the self neglect, refusing to let anyone in, squalor. Do they know she is having episodes of faecal incontinence? Is excessive alcohol use a factor?
If none of this works, if you are defined in the Mental Health Act 1983 as your Mum's 'Nearest Relative' (if you are either her eldest child or provide enough input or oversight that an AMPH finds you are providing care to her) you can ask for a Mental Health Act Assessment (MHAA) to see if she needs to be "sectioned" for assessment or treatment. Contact your Mum's local council (the Scheme Manager or whatever the title is of the M&S person) can tell you which Council if you don't know) and as to speak to the Duty Approved Mental Health Professional. They are not obliged to do a MHAA but they should explain their reasons in writing to you if they do not. They will make their own enquiries and will help you navigate this situation. If you are the Nearest Relative (it's not the same as NOK, it's the person the Mental Health Act says it is, not necessarily the person who appears most logical!)
OP if your Mum has given you a Lasting Power of Attorney that has been sent to and returned as approved by the Court of Protection you don't need any further permission from her to act on it. If it's Property and Finances you could legitimately obtain a key and let the check people in if you think she lacks capacity to make or enact the decision for the checks to be done and if his is in her Best Interests.
Good luck OP, I wish you and your Mum the best.