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Elderly parents
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Elderly mother and conflict with siblings

62 replies

BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 07:32

Over the past few years I had to make a decision to find full time nursing care for my DF. This advice came from his consultant. Unfortunately one of my siblings and DM didn’t like the advice so set about making a few, but rather pointless adaptations to our parents home. I live overseas but do try to return regularly and make an effort to keep communication open. This thread isn’t about DF. He is now safe and in an environment able to meet his needs very close to our mother’s house so she visit easily. My mother is and always has been an incredibly difficult person, forever. I do not wish to ‘out’ myself but as long as I can remember she is awkward, unsympathetic and outright contrary about things. Sadly it appears one of my siblings sees her through rose tinted glasses and is determined she has something wrong with her. She is mid 80s but all I and my other sibling see is Mum being Mum. Unfortunately our brother does not see this. She has now alienated herself from everyone. There is not a neighbour she hasn’t be incredibly rude to. She has alienated all family members, who all tried to help as they liked our DF. We have arranged for a cleaner and a gardener. She will not allow them access. We arranged a private consultation with a geriatric specialist who was fantastic- she aced the memory test but took none of the advice he gave her. It feels like she only wants us as her middle aged children to drop everything and be with her. My sister and I are both retired, she lives an hour away I am overseas but come back to England regularly. Our brother thinks we do not do enough and that we should make our parents more of a priority. He seems oblivious to the fact my sister and I took the initiative and listened to hospital staff that Dad needed full nursing care, we found the home, sorted the room etc, made sure the staff had a life history for Dad and did the paperwork. He repeatedly ignored anything such as emails from the home asking for paperwork to be done. He continues to say Mum is ‘ill’. She may well be sad about the situation but both of our parents repeatedly ignored suggestions to help them selves in later life. Well done for getting so far - feel free to ask what I am actually asking! It feels like he has literally just opened his eyes to our mothers personality. In a nutshell she would and always has been incredibly defiant. Other than move in with her my sister and I are really not sure what to do as she will not help herself or allow us to arrange help. Our brother just criticises everything we do yet turns up when it suits him, not Mum, faffs about and leaves. Thanks for listening that feels abit better.

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Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 14:18

@funnelfan very sound advice and something we are hoping to do soon. Both my sister and I can see that what we used to perhaps roll our eyes at at is now manifesting itself as problematic. In fairness to Mum she asked my sister to write some step by step instructions for an appliance she was a little unfamiliar with. Sis did so and mum has managed it really well even correcting me about using it - I can see this is a confidence thing so am sympathetic to this. Also encouraging her to see being able to follow instructions as a brilliant step forward. Lots of great thoughts on here and I am grateful to everyone being objective and proffering sensible angles to come at it again.

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funnelfan · 03/06/2024 13:39

For example she will say an appliance isn’t working which she did when I came over last year. I demonstrated it was working by using it. She had apparently been telling our brother for 10 weeks but he had done nothing to reassure her.

@BlueLegume only you will know whether this is new behaviour or not, but my mothers cognitive decline started in hindsight when I started getting a litany of complaints that the television, the microwave, the central heating etc weren’t working. They were, she just lost the ability to work them. She could have passed the memory tests at that stage too. Now she can’t even change the channel on her tv any more.

It’s obviously trickier to manage if she’s always been a difficult character, but that doesn’t mean she isn’t developing health issues of her own. As frustrating as it is, you do need to listen to your brother and fully understand what he means when he says she isn’t well. And between you and your sister pick apart what he says to see what is new.

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 10:10

@Tinkerbot I have started to gently tell him she is playing us all off for the attention - we are rarely all there at the same time. My sister and I sorted out the nursing home together. We tried to involve DB but he just left us to it, he didn’t really seem bothered about it. We have tried to ask to get together face to face with him but he just ignores our requests. Sister and I do think he is not coping with the situation so is lashing out, particularly at me. What he does not seem to appreciate is we have to cope in order to ensure Dad was found a safe place. Thanks to everyone it has felt reassuring we are not out of order in how we have dealt with things.

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Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 10:06

@Slugsandsnailsresidehere Yes we have POA although I am not sure it was worth the effort TBH. We have literally suggested everything and she has said no. When Dad was hospitalised she was so rude to the staff my sister and I had to apologise and on one ward the doctor refused to engage with her after she wrote a venomous email to the director of the hospital criticising a clearly very stressed staff member. Nothing is ever right. Brother seems to think she has changed because she is ‘ill’. It is so difficult as we do not want conflict but the reality is she is just Mum and has always been like this. It is like he doesn’t want to see it now it is impacting on him.

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Tinkerbot · 03/06/2024 10:04

I might be tempted to tell him she badmouths him - perhaps in a more gentle way -him believing he is doing a lot and carrying the burden on his shoulders alone would likely stop if he knew she was complaining about him.

Slugsandsnailsresidehere · 03/06/2024 10:01

If she's too proud and cantankerous to accept hired help then you have to let her fail. It's hard to watch but be as stubborn as she is. Do any of you have POA? Any moaning from your DB ask him to solve the issue as he's closest. Just because you and your sister are female doesn't mean you should give up your lives to care for her. Especially as it sounds like she'd fall out with you as "carers" too!

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 10:01

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER very sound advice. Dad is safe and in a good place albeit unwell and clearly not long left, what is sad is he seems secondary in all this as our mother has made it all about herself and literally become helpless. It is so difficult as our brother has suddenly developed this approach which makes it look like he is caring but actually he is not doing much at all - except point out to my sister and I that we don’t care. We do care BUT and it is a big BUT we have also had to deal with the life admin around a clearly very unwell father for a long time, a stubborn mother who wouldn’t take on board the advice of medical professionals. I would also add my sister took the brunt of my mother’s ’mid life crisis’ during possibly our mother’s menopause years as I was out of the country. The other thing is my brother is oblivious to the fact all our mother does is bad mouth him to us. She resents his turning up when it suits him, she doesn’t like the food he buys her. What she won’t see is that we can’t just visit her to keep her company we have to crack on with loads of jobs when we are there. Additionally the house needs loads doing to it but Mum and Dad have not maintained it for some time. All of this was inevitable.

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GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 03/06/2024 09:53

BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 09:45

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER thanks - its a fine line I appreciate we should not foist help onto her but practically cannot do all the jobs for her such as cleaning gardening etc. We simply cannot do it without it impacting on our own lives and families. My sister did raise a good point which is that our brother seems to assume that because we are both retired we have loads of free time. We don’t if anything we are both busier than ever. There is an also an assumption by our mother that we have nothing to do all day when in fact we have very busy lives.

Edited

I’m afraid that assumption is all too common - old people can become extremely selfish and expect adult dcs to run around them non stop. I’m so sorry you’re going through this - we had similar with a relative of dh who could well afford to pay for help but absolutely hated shelling out for anything.

Easy for me to say, I know, but in your place I’d say, ‘I’m sorry, but we just don’t have the time or energy for all this. If you won’t accept help coming in, that’s up to you, but we really can’t do it any more.’

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 09:45

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER thanks - its a fine line I appreciate we should not foist help onto her but practically cannot do all the jobs for her such as cleaning gardening etc. We simply cannot do it without it impacting on our own lives and families. My sister did raise a good point which is that our brother seems to assume that because we are both retired we have loads of free time. We don’t if anything we are both busier than ever. There is an also an assumption by our mother that we have nothing to do all day when in fact we have very busy lives.

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GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 03/06/2024 09:36

If your DM won’t accept help/carers, there’s not a lot you can do, especially from a distance. As a pp said, it’s hard to accept, but sometimes, if the person is still deemed to have capacity, you just have to let it go and wait for some sort of crisis - which may of course not happen. Refusal of practical help, carers coming in, is actually not uncommon.

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 09:05

@Sadless again thank you. I can actually do quite a lot when I am at our house overseas. I can certainly help our mother with food orders which she is actually ok with but our brother has sort of waded in with what my sister describes as help but not help. By this she means he sees help as turning up but not actually addressing our mother’s concerns. For example she will say an appliance isn’t working which she did when I came over last year. I demonstrated it was working by using it. She had apparently been telling our brother for 10 weeks but he had done nothing to reassure her. My sister is incredibly kind despite a very fraught relationship with our mother. Last winter she helped Mum organise her incredibly full freezer and made food suitable for one, listing all the meals and with instructions as to how to prepare them - really clearly. Mum threw all the food away. It is all so attention seeking and always has been. We had to laugh when our brother addressed what is clearly a hoarding issue with us. My sister and I have 6 children between us all grown up now - when they were little they used to talk about shopping at grandmas shop…..they meant her basement…..it is literally like a shop and always has been. Quite how our brother managed to be so unaware of this is quite amusing…..but now he sees it.🙄

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Sadless · 03/06/2024 08:55

My dh is in a similar position at the moment his mum is currently living with her daughter about 30 miles away from us . It’s all gone wrong there she’s been there 6 years now and wants to move back locally. My dh has 3 retired sisters and a retired brother my dh was the last born and only 45 . My mother in laws sister wants the siblings to discuss what will happen if she moves back care needs and stuff she’s 86 .
but none of the siblings are will do do a meeting they don’t want to have to deal with it . My dh is currently waiting for a hip replacement and spends most days off his feet . He said yesterday that he will do whatever he can but they will need to help .

a elderly lady I take shopping every week says it always get left to one to do . She looked after her father for 11 years till he nearly burnt the house down and went into a care home . Her siblings where no where to be since .

i think like others have said state what you can do and let the other take on the rest .
if your brother is so good let him do it And if your living abroad it not like you can be there a lot

sal

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 08:43

@Baaliali sorry to hear of your situation. I do agree about emotional maturity. My sister and I are very practical doers. That shows in our parenting. Brother is emotionally very immature. He’s middle aged but acts like he’s in his early twenties. Thinks he’s really cool when in fact he isn’t.

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Baaliali · 03/06/2024 08:39

This family dynamic is extremely common. Both my family and my DH’s family have it. Favoured children, denied reality, manipulation, expectations of everyone else but very limited from themselves, enabling.

The best you can do is figure out your time and energy that you are willing to commit to the situation and leave it at that. It doesn’t usually change. I’m NC with my family DH is LC with his. There was all sorts of abuse in our family situations which adds to the complexity but the root issue of emotional immaturity was the same.

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 08:36

@Chloethecow sounds very sensible. Definitely agree we probably need to let him have his say and listen properly. Thanks

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Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 08:33

@Elieza no not posted before

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Chloethecow · 03/06/2024 08:31

I am guessing your brother is her favoured child. The one she has always made more of an effort with, like when you have a visitor, putting on a show of coping and pandering to him, not showing vunerabilities. He probably glossed over any issues before. His view has been she's fine, she made me a cup of tea and had my favourite biscuits in.
With your dad not being at hone, advancing age and less energy, she can't pull herself up enough anymore to project shes fine to him. Its likely that he has never really seen her true self and situation before. He has suddenly realised she is old, yes a bit late in the day but some people are that oblivious to reality. He's probably over reacting because its a shock.

He keeps repeating things and getting het up because he doesn't feel his concerns are heard. He probably wishes you or your sister would step up and fix this for him, like you did with your father.
It may help stop the repetition to let him raise all his concerns without either of you or your sister saying "she's been doing that for years". Bite your tongues against the urge. Its a little thing, but you need to make him feel heard. Acknowledge his concerns and push everything back on him to come up with solutions and follow up on his own concerns with GP or social services. You are just too busy right now, so if he is really worried, he should follow it up. He will likely soon shut him up and stop over reacting when the answers involve effort on his part. I'm amazed how quickly oblivious people go back to being unconcerned when the solution to their worries involves a few phone calls and half an hour on hold.

Elieza · 03/06/2024 08:30

Did you post about this before? It sounds familiar.

If it wasn't you then someone has a similar situation and that post and replies could be helpful if you can find it.

If the brother could arrange to be there at the save time as the cleaner and gardener for the first twice each then he can let them in and oversee things until your mother is ok with it?

Make it clear to him that you're not doing anything more and he shouldn't either. She needs help and needs to see that you're all on the same page.

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 08:30

What I would add to sound less harsh about our mother is she genuinely does not have any coping skills and never has. She has always just thrown a hissy fit when things haven’t gone her way. Stopped speaking to people or taken to her bed and starved her self so she then gets sympathy. Sister and I are well aware of her antics.

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Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 08:24

@VJBR good one !

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Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 08:24

@Tinkerbot sound advice. I am aware I’m wasting my own time. Dad is safe. That was my sister and my priority. My brother does by his own admission bt his way through life.

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VJBR · 03/06/2024 08:22

Why not suggest that your mother lives with your brother since he is so concerned.

Tinkerbot · 03/06/2024 08:18

can you ignore DBs comments - just agree but do nothing - ‘DM needs a carer / you to visit more / cleaner etc etc - just agree and leave it at that.
Then the debates over what is needed for the best don’t happen .
Saves a lot of stress and frustration.
I doubt anyone with a magic wand could even make DM happy and content. I would step back- she will do what she wants.

kiwiane · 03/06/2024 08:12

Typical of brothers in my experience; just console yourself that you have a sister that understands.

Original poster
BlueLegume · 03/06/2024 08:10

@mitogoshi Sister and I tried to get our parents to look at assisted living years ago but they refused. My own husband actually offered to buy them a place no strings attached. They refused and brother kept saying we’d all have to help when the crisis happened. Only he didn’t he buried his head in the sand and left us to it. I think mum would struggle in a home - she has an awful attitude. I’m not sure anyone would accept her plus she’s got full capacity she’s just not very nice.

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