Planning for the "in case" - how do you manage when 200 miles away ?

but paid care in an emergency situation doesn't appear to exist.

It does in some areas @EmmaAgain22 - I work in this exact area myself, it's what I do.

Riding I was at the cinema when mum pressed her button (suspected heart attack, now thought to be afib).

so between the time for me to get the neighbours call, and actually arriving there, was about 5 hours. They weren't allowed to go with her in the ambulance as it was during Covid but I felt terrible they had to deal with it at all.

they kept on at me for updates till 1am and were very tearful because they thought she was dying, poor loves. That's when they kept telling me "she is family to us" bless them.

i'd be happy to pay an agency fee monthly or whatever, to supply someone to sit with her when she has a funny turn, till I can get there.

Yes, it's a bit like that with mum. I love that they feel like family but I suppose I worry that one day it will get too much.

they always tell me not to worry and they are happy to do anything but I am really hoping they don't have to, and that my second attempt at moving will actually work.

the reason I'm seeking an emergency stand in is so they don't have to sit with her for a few hours if she is ill, but paid care in an emergency situation doesn't appear to exist.

Don't worry, I was answering your question about what to do in an emergency.

We've had two in the last few months and no family member went. She got herself into A and E, then local friends dealt with anything. Realistically we couldn't have done anything they couldn't.

If there's really nobody other than neighbours then presumably the person has to either move into some kind of supported living and/or closer to you or you have to move closer to them?

As a neighbour to an elderly couple Im more than happy to keep an eye out for them, as long as it doesnt become a situation where they are entirely reliant on us. We've been neighbours for a long time and they have in the past felt like surrogate grandparents to our dc. It feels natural and right that we should be on hand for them now as a friendly face to drop in on them. I think their adult dc worry about boundaries sometimes and I can understand that, it is a valid concern that Im aware of.

Oh I know - it's not me saying anything about the distance?

My mum is only 63 but has a health condition that means she might need more. Operations and care in the future. She used to live 300 miles away, but has recently moved to be near to us. She’s now just a 10 minute drive. I know this might sound extreme but she had covid before the vaccines and was very poorly. It really frightened her that we were all far away. My brother was 200 miles away. She had good friends who help drop off shopping etc but it’s not the same as close family. We were really scared too and felt pretty helpless. After that she decided to move to be nearer to us. I know your relative is now very elderly, but could moving closer to you, into assisted living, be a possibility? Sorry if you’ve already said and I’ve missed it.

@EmmaAgain22 mine has some local friends who will run around and help out with lifts, hospital visiting and shopping. She doesn't like 'putting them out' but equally she chose to live near the friends when she moved rather than near me or DB. She's also given them a fair amount of help in the past (including having one of them to stay with her for a fortnight after an operation - friend's operation, not DM's!) so it feels reciprocal.

At the end of the day there are often good reasons why we don't live near our parents - mine is because there were no jobs locally so I had to relocate for work. I have to live in a certain place because of work, and now I have DD and DH they are settled in the area too.

To be clear, in theory, the longest anyone would have to wait with her is 2 - 3 hours, 3 being if I was really unlucky with transport.

Sharp I don't feel it's fair to them, no. They suggested the emergency button and that they would be first contact, otherwise I don't think we'd have done it. I was vaguely aware of it but they pushed for it as their mum has it.

I won't say "don't approve" as it's not always possible to live near parents but I do tell mum very specifically not to bother them.

they call or pop every day when I'm not there. Not that we ever asked. One hospitalisation, they said "why do you worry, we love her like family" but I feel that must have limits. Also, if they move, we are stuffed!

Anyway, trying to move nearer again.....fingers crossed it works this time.

Nothing official, no. It's a case of relying upon the goodwill of friends and neighbours close by. Which I don't really approve of, to be honest. By all means everyone should look out for each other but I don't think it's fair to ask others to commit to too much.

OP - my mum was recently in care home for two weeks after a hospital admission, it's known as respite care if that helps.

SharpLily as you have posted, do you know of how to get help to an elderly person quickly, apart from 999?

we've got neighbours who can go but I am two hours away and stuck as mum doesn't need daily care but ideally someone nearer who can go if there's an emergency. All ideas gratefully received. I also feel really bad about neighbours being stuck with it.

I am looking to move nearer but had that fall through once already.

What sort of area does your FIL live in? My mother is 82, has lived on the same street for decades, so has neighbours who all keep an eye out for each other, even though they are mostly equally elderly. I don’t have too many worries at the moment even though me & siblings all live far away. I think if there was a health emergency one of us would be able to work remotely from her house for a while.

On the other hand, a friend’s father lives in an isolated rural area with no near neighbours which is a totally different ball game.

there is a stubbornness about "I'm not really old and unwell yet..."

I've seen a couple of old single and very independent rural friends come to grief after just ONE quite minor incident had a devastating knock on effect that instantly changed their lives and took away all independence, choice and decision making.

  Living in glorious isolation /up a hill with lovely view  is wonderful until you are alone and can't drive or walk and there's no bus, then its impossible.   By then it's too late to start househunting for a downsize because you 're not mobile enough to go viewing  them.

Planning ahead  and making changes before you need them is the way to go.

In my experience getting them to wear the emergency button does not mean they will actually press it in an emergency . My parents passed earlier this year but on the couple occasions when they should have done they did not use the button . I was about 5 hours away .

How we controlled the situation was by phoning daily at a set time and by having a key safe and also a friend and neighbour with a key . The neighbour would pop in once a week and both times it was them that called an ambulance when they could see evidence of a fall . The people opposite kept an eye on whether curtains were opened.

My parents would not move closer to me and in reality that is the only way I could really keep them safe .

When things did go wrong we were very much dependent on the NHS and if they had left hospital Local Authority organised care . They both went down hill quickly and passed quickly and unexpectedly

If you can persuade your relative to come closer to you that is the best way though I can 100% understand why my Dad was insistent on staying in his own home.

sorry if this sounds rather bleak but unfortunately this was my experience of how it paned out

One issue we had was when suggesting a key safe my elderly ma checked with her insurers who totally ruled it out…

Some great practical tips on here - for us (similar situation to you - 2 children each living at least 2-3 hrs away and not able to provide help except in an emergency) it took around 2 years of tough conversations. What made the difference ultimately was the pandemic - which put a stop to her social life - and a need for 2 separate ops, which she has recovered from but which also left her frail.

This was a better and safer wake up call than a fall, but it still took a crisis for her to decide in her own mind that something needed to change. She had a carer, cleaner and gardener as well beforehand.

She finally agreed to look at sheltered accommodation and is now in a brilliant place. A key factor was getting her to go round and see places - initially she was really snooty about them but gradually realised that the residents were not all dribbling idiots. The Richard Osman books were also a great help - they nicely glamorise retirement living so well worth investing in the set for your FIL!

You'll have to train him to wear the button at all times INCLUDING at night in bed. So its on him if he gets up at night for a pee. AND USE IT. I recommend occasionally testing it when you're there.

I was the first responder for a very independent neighbours call-button and it took ages before she used it properly. We had one incident where she wasn't wearing it when she fell; another when she was wearing it, needed help in extreme pain at midnight but daftly "decided to wait till morning so as not to wake you". When she had a big stroke at night , thank god she was wearing it and used it. But it had taken years of mean nagging to make sure she always had it on (especially in the shower etc).

Have a spare key to his house; one for you. One kept by a neighbour who is willing to keep an eye out ; just
discreetly checking that the curtains open and shut every day, chimney is smoking, milk bottles taken in etc. Make sure a neighbour has a note of GP or SW and your contact numbers. It's also useful to have all the contact numbers posted in a prominent place inside the house.

Oh and a keysafe!!!!!

DH and I both see a lot of this in our jobs/volunteering, and PIL have shone a light on how not to age gracefully.

We are barely in our 60s but have the following in place:

• wills
• POA - will redo these when we hit 70 giving POA to the (adult) kids rather than each other
• Advance Decision (me, pretty brutal)
• Envelopes in a safe place the kids know about with our passwords and details of bank accounts, pensions, life insurance etc
• Kids know where the original paperwork is
• Kids have explicit permission to tell us when we need to stop driving (I already know my night vision is going)
• Plans for downsizing (or at least moving from somewhere that’s all stairs to somewhere a bit flatter where a stairlift can go in)
• Good financial plans/pensions (obviously started those many many years ago!)

I’m most scared of living in enabled isolation - the current fetish with ‘independence’ and ‘strengths based approaches’ really worries me.

OP it’s hard to avoid crises, but they are easier to manage if you have some plans in place (basic understanding of whether your FIL would be self-funding for care or would qualify for paid care is an excellent start). Good luck.

Oh and check whether they're using the electronic prescriptions thing. I discovered DM was still faffing around dropping a repeat prescription slip off at the GP, then picking it up several days later, then taking it to the pharmacy to collect! If she'd been on the electronic system the HCPs could have accessed what drugs she was taking and the dose during the emergency admission over a weekend instead of having to wait until her GP reopened.

We used a local care home for rehabilitation for DM after planned surgery. She stayed there for a couple of weeks straight from the hospital with all of her meals provided. A couple of friends did her washing (home would have wanted everything labelled if they'd done it) and drove her to physio appointments. Then she had friends bring shopping once she was back home again. I managed to visit twice using compassionate leave - once immediately after the surgery and once when she was in the home. It wasn't cheap but there wasn't really another option.

We've also found after a later problem with an emergency admission that having local friends with a spare key is helpful - she'd given keys to me and DB, both of us 100s of miles away so totally pointless! A key safe would be better - she could give the number eg to a paramedic over the phone so they could get into her rather than being dependent on local friends but she's still resisting that one.

As for work, I'm in a similar situation. I had a chat with my line manager about what to do re the emergency admission and he was clear that in that case (it looked like life or death for a while) I should just go, let him know when convenient and we'd sort out the details later. That's reassuring. But it's definitely only for a day or two of compassionate leave and anything longer would have to be annual leave or unpaid leave which isn't practical to take. So I've begun having conversations with DM about these limitations - she last worked in an era when she got weeks of compassionate leave for a distant relative's death(?!) and struggles to get her head round what it's like now! I've emphasised that I won't be able to do any caring, that for a lot of things she'll need to talk to her friends or get someone in - it was her choice to move closer to the friends rather than to me or DB. I've suggested things like she keeps a small bag and toilet bag packed so a friend can grab it easily and bring it to the hospital.

I'm also strongly encouraging her to sort out a POA and also her paperwork as I have no idea where we'd start currently!

Good luck! It's very difficult though.

Absolutely agree about planning for old age and the reluctance amongst many to do so. MIL is in her nineties and hasn’t even planned her funeral - refuses to talk about it because she’s scared of death. I completely get that, but come on - her 2 children don’t speak to each other and sticking your head in the sand isn’t going to help either of them when it comes to planning it. She’s in hospital st the moment after another fall and is not happy because she doesn’t have visitors every day and the nursing staff refuse to jump to her demands. Again, if she’d moved close to us when we suggested it she could have built up a network of friends and had us on tap so she would have been able to have regular visitors now.

Lilys post is spot on. The refusal of many elderly to prepare for old age is partly why hospital wards are full. I saw it regularly as a district nurse. Living in unsuitable properties and falling about all over the place. Then refusing to pay for help. It has consequences for everyone.
Make sure you have POA first of all.
Also useful to gradually introduce as much external help as you can. Cleaner, gardener, local pharmacy delivery etc, so people are regularly going through the door. Make sure he has the number of a local handyman. Age concern.
This is what we scrimp and save for all our lives, to buy in help and care as needed and not burden busy family with jobs and families of their own, certainly that living miles away. 'Providing care' is not your responsibility and surely he wouldn't let you do that anyway, it wouldn't be fair to tie you like that in the prime of your lives( barring emergencies).
It may be useful to have an idea of the local care home situation/and a preference.
What preparations has he made, how did he think he was going to manage?