91 year old mother gets me down!

I could have written your post OP . My 90 year old mother isnt a bad person and she loves me but she has always suffered from mild depression and both her and my father we never the outgoing types , even when young. Since my father died over 10 years ago ( after a long illness , which I had to support them both through ) , she has never attempted to make any kind of independent life and relies on me for all her physical and emotional support. She is now becoming more and more frail and is barely managing at home , even with me doing shopping / cleaning/ finances etc , for her .
I dread calling or seeing her as I never know how she will be and she drags me down to her level each time . I have just retired myself but feel I have no freedom due to her needs . She wont accept any other help as she feels she can manage ( she cant ) . I have no siblings in the UK so cant share this, and dont feel I can detach . Some days I see my friends of the same age enjoying the freedom in their lives and I want to just sit and cry .

Oh I so wish I could detach! Getting me down so badly atm 😢

Some people are more likely to be like this than others (e.g: if you have always been a moany person all your life), and I think it is important to recognise that there is a difference between someone who in old age has suddenly got frustrated and started moaning a lot because of the afore mentioned factors of old age, and those who have always been difficult to be around due to complaining about everything. Tolerance levels get frayed. Perhaps, I'd have more patience and tolerance if my dm hadn't been a chronic moaner her entire life. It was hard before, but now, it is chronic!

I have many other elderly relatives, aunts, etc, but I am happy to be around them a lot. Yes, they have their moans and that's totally fine (and expected!), however not all they do, and every time they open their mouth like my dm. It all comes down to tolerance levels too and if the individual has been like that all their life, or only in old age.

In old age, I'll have some self-awareness and not make my children not want to be around me because all I do is moan and go off in rants 24/7 Yes, that’s what we all hope. I’m sure my father intended that too.

wonder how we are all going to cope with old age. Are we really such good parents that our children will be delighted to spend time with our 80year-old selves? Will we radiate happiness, contentment and interest in others when we can no longer do the things we enjoy doing, get to the places where we want to go, when every day has some niggling pain, some reminder our bodies are falling apart? Will our children care for us when we haven’t modelled that behaviour for them?

This is really important. It’s easy to be dismissive and irritated. However when it’s our turn we might look back and have more of an insight.

@MereDintofPandiculation

but I've heard of 'just get on with it' being a common mantra of older people. Hmm - that’s a bit of a generalisation.

Not generalising, however to clarify, I will rephrase it as 'I've heard of just get on with it being a mantra of SOME older people', as that is what I meant. Not all, but some do hold this belief, which of course they are entitled to have, but if those who do, are going to hold this belief, they can't expect to be listened to moaning to the point it wears you down.

I wonder how we are all going to cope with old age. Are we really such good parents that our children will be delighted to spend time with our 80year-old selves? Will we radiate happiness, contentment and interest in others when we can no longer do the things we enjoy doing, get to the places where we want to go, when every day has some niggling pain, some reminder our bodies are falling apart? Will our children care for us when we haven’t modelled that behaviour for them?

In old age, I'll have some self-awareness and not make my children not want to be around me because all I do is moan and go off in rants 24/7. Alienating them from wanting to be around me will only make my life in old age even harder, and I'll have the self-awareness and emotional maturity to recognise this.

As a previous poster said, your children aren't the dumping ground for all your moans and complaints.

How to achieve emotional detachment? This is what works for me . Tell myself it’s not personal, i am not at fault, it’s just declining cognitive abilities and the frustrations of a diminished life. Concentrate on observing, count how many times a particular phrase appears, time the length of each rant, do something else and just dip in and out.

Be prepared to terminate the conversation. There is only so much one can tolerate. Don’t necessarily pick up calls. Being emotionally detached makes this easier. You can be emotionally detached but still have sympathy for someone who is lonely and suffering from the lack of autonomy and agency which comes with old age.

I spent my teenage years using my mother as a venting outlet for all my negativity and frustration, so I suppose it’s fair enough to be on the receiving end now.

but I've heard of 'just get on with it' being a common mantra of older people. Hmm - that’s a bit of a generalisation.

She talks about herself instead all the time. My father used to do that, he’d ask about us but then sweep on into his own affairs before he had a chance to answer. Then I realised he was desperate to be able to talk to someone, he spent his days listening to radio 4, he didn’t need any more listening. So I started emailing him with all our news, he still talked at me, but he started talking about the things I’d putin my email. Quite the opposite to @Unescorted !

I wonder how we are all going to cope with old age. Are we really such good parents that our children will be delighted to spend time with our 80year-old selves? Will we radiate happiness, contentment and interest in others when we can no longer do the things we enjoy doing, get to the places where we want to go, when every day has some niggling pain, some reminder our bodies are falling apart? Will our children care for us when we haven’t modelled that behaviour for them?

I had one of these mothers. I managed it by always calling her, only when it suited me, never answering her calls. I would talk at her for about 10 mins in a cheery tone, then "have to go Mum, school run/doorbell/oven timer". It kept a bit of contact, but saved my sanity. You could try something like that?

It is hard. Since my dad died my mum rings every day to tell me how lonely she is and she has no one to talk to. I would have sympathy but I have her friends calling me asking why my mum is not returning calls and she lives with my brother.

I have tried the fixing the situation by suggesting ways to combat loneliness... Picking up the phone when friends call, taking people up on offers of visits, speaking to my brother..... Apparently she doesn't want to put people out. This does not extend to me.

To get through the daily call of malicious and fictional gossip and tales of self centred woe I put her on speaker phone while cooking dinner or sketching a picture. Having another focus means I can dip in and out of the down fest.

I have also stopped telling her anything about my life. It helps to disengage when it is about someone else.

My mother is elderly but doesn’t moan. She talks about herself instead all the time. If I go on holiday she never asks about it. She criticises me and makes snide remarks. Her opinions are the only ones that matter. I hate being with her and talking to her. Her resentment that I don’t see her more often causes more passive aggressive behaviour.

Like many others. I have never had a positive relationship with her so I don’t have any warm feelings and just dread any interaction.

It’s very sad. Children shouldn’t be used as dumping ground for negativity. If I had happy memories or felt I owed her anything, it would be more bearable.

I’m also affected massively by people’s low emotions, it’s classic over-empathising. I’ve had to be really harsh and stop listening, let them rattle on but be doing something else, don’t give them all your attention whilst they pour out their sadness. We get affected bc your mum and ppl like her think and act like WE are responsible for her happiness when in fact, they are responsible for their own happiness- just as we are responsible for our own.

@A580Hojas i could have written your post- especially the bit about your mum being the only thing that makes you depressed. I dread the phone calls - and try to keep visits short. She can find the cloud in every silver lining and it’s utterly draining 😢.

Can you explain how to do that?

Yes family is safe space, and it isn't easy, however there is a limit to how much moaning and complaining one person can listen to, regardless of how hard it is they have itor how understandable their moans are. Life is hard, not just in old age, and in their younger day, would they have entertained me moaning at that level about things? No, I'd have been told to calm down and that 'get on with it, that's life'. Obviously I am talking there about my own situation, but I've heard of 'just get on with it' being a common mantra of older people. So, does this not apply to them?

My relative will start moaning, they moan then launch into a rant. Every single topic discussed gets switched somehow into a moan or rant. How is it easy to switch off to that, when their sole focus is to moan and rant?

I am happy to indulge moans and rants, we all have them and are ebtitled to them, but there is a limit.

Let’s hope the Japanese idea of humanoid robots comes to something. All of us need someone to let off steam to, and it must be so hard being in a care home or needing high levels of care where your very survival depends on not moaning. Family is your “safe space”. Except that nowadays it isn’t

Difficult for those on the transition between family are important simply because they’re family, and family are important if they earn your regard.

It is possible to listen to moaning and not let it affect your mental health. You need to cultivate a level of emotional detachment. And try not to let it spill into the rest of your life

Totally totally agree with you. The people saying oh you'll miss them one day just haven't got a clue. You have to protect your own sanity you really do xx

*all these things

I know how you feel op, my mum is in her 80s and never stops moaning. Every phone call she just goes on and in for ages about all her woes, how she can't get through to anyone on the phone, can't see a gp face to face, needs a handyman but the one guy she phoned once didn't return her call, etc. It is wearing!! Yes, Ll those things are frustrating but she just cant handle it.

They still live in a 3 bed semi ages away from public transport and shops, etc, and instead of planning ahead.years ago, still live there without any support (all refused but will moan plenty), and moans about the stairs, the garden, the distance to the shops, etc. I come off the phone drained and it is affecting my own mental health listening to it.

Then there are people like there's been a few on this thread, saying "one day she won't be around and you'll wish she'd call". These people have no clue what it can be like for people with not great relationships with their parents. I am happy to talk to my mum, but just not listen to nothing but moaning.

Can emphathise too. After years of it then reducing mental health for her which severely impacted on me, cos she got WORSE!, I finally found a few boundaries helped;

• sympathy like someone said but dont get involved and change subject, or say I can only talk for a while
• dont ring when you are in a good mood - stop expecting things to be nice and always expect worse so ring when you are cooking or doing something else
• dont speak often and try not to feel guilty
• being really brave and saying things like (if she shouts or rants or moans on a lot), do you want me to call back when you are feeling better (or even better, I cant listen to this again/ at the moment, why not call when youa re feeling better.

have you tried timing the calls so that they have less impact on you? So not calling on a day off when her chat will ruin your day, but timing the call for an evening when you then have a plan in place for a favourite tv programme/ nice dinner/ phone call to an uplifting friend, after your call with her. Or call her before cleaning the house - amazing how thoroughly and quickly you can clean when you’re expelling anger and hurt! You could also play a game of phone call bingo - mental list of the things you know she’ll moan about and cross them off as she says them - give yourself a treat at the end for a line/full house - it might help you to take on less of the depressing conversation if you’re distracted. Also try to monitor what you choose to share with her - don’t share things that are giving you joy if you know she’s going to behave like a dementor and suck the fun and excitement out of them!

I currently am living with an elderly relative. It is so very hard . He is so negative and nasty , full of regret and no acceptance if his changed circumstances. I have learned that it is not my job to make him happy and nothing ever will. It is not my fault that you are old, family dead , friends also too old to visit. It is very hard to be able to switch off , to not take the comments personally, to not expect gratitude. I have regular carers in who tell me that this is a very common issue with the elderly. They almost revert to petulant children . Lack of control over their life breeds frustration. I try to just ignore the bad behavior and make sure I get regular breaks away.

The David sedaris might have been on the radio. It's actually Happy go Lucky.
If anyone else reads it please let me know what you think.

I am going to buy the David Sederis book

Not my mother but my MIL was only happy when the whole family danced to her tune. She was something of a matriarch. It is / was wearing. Luckily Dh stood up to her when it mattered. In other ways she could be lovely and generous but usually on her terms. DS loved her. I miss her , but I don't think she ever came to terms with her children having their own families and priorities. We got through it by hook or by crook.

My DF is starting to be a bit , when I phone, he starts off with a litany of woes & then I get him on to another topic & he is fine and lovely but I have noticed more pessimism as he gets older ( late 80s)

Was this just on R4? Think I caught half an hour of it the other day, so poignant

I would really recommend David sedaris' latest book, Lucky go Happy, I think, which talks about being a child when you're getting on.

I find my 92 year old mother hard work, but I always have. I am very lucky to have a brother who sympathises and a dear sister who get on better with her.
I also have grandchildren, and we drove 2 hours to see my mother today, and my son and his wife drove up with their tiny children to see her, because she gets droopy about not seeing them. And she seems to think it's MY responsibility.
But she never shows gratitude.
Plus she always finds jobs for my 70 year old husband to do. Today it was cleaning the inside of the kitchen windows.
She is really only happy when she is controlling people.