Why do we (as a society) do this?

If you want to avoid this for yourself put an advance decision in place with your wishes clearly stated. Compassion In Dying have a good free version you can use.

Also make someone your POA for health and brief them clearly and in writing.

To be really useful it needs to be detailed and quite harsh. Mine says words to the effect of if no quality of life/cannot recognise children/husband then withdraw all care, even for reversible causes, other than palliative care/pain alleviation. Comfort at the expense of extension of life. I’m hoping for a swift bout of pneumonia to carry me off.

I agree OP it’s heartbreaking. My mum is in a care home and has been for the last 5 years. For the last 9 months she had been totally bed bound, incontinent and spends all her time asleep. She has zero quality of life and most of the time doesn’t even wake up when I visit. It is so so cruel, I wish every day she would peacefully slip away, she is alive but not living, it’s so upsetting.

I have 1 remaining Grandparent, other 3 (1 only 60, 1 72 and 1 83 but not insanely old) all died very suddenly and unexpectedly from either a heart attack or brain aneurysm. I tell myself that I'm glad they died this way rather than suffered for a long time.
I work as a carer, currently as a home carer but used to work in a home for residents with dementia.
We had an 83 year old lady who had no grasp of reality whatsoever, she'd walk around the building crying and taking her clothes off, trying to get out of fire exits, found her stroking the wallpaper in her room, conversation was totally nonsensical and sometimes it was hard not to laugh at what she said, but it was also very sad.
Had some other residents the same, no grasp of reality.
I currently look after some people who are 100% reliant on carers to get them out of bed, wash, eat etc.
It is sad but I don't know what the answer is. I do think those with mental capacity should be given the option of assisted suicide if they desire it.

My DGD had a car accident in his early nineties and the health professionals moved heaven and earth to keep him going. After the accident he had no quality of life although he did stay at home and lived until 99. It would have been a kindness to let him pass away in hospital.
Wasn't pneumonia meant to be an old person's friend ? Now it seems we want people to be immortal, and ironically because we're all living so much longer, the non retirees have to work to late 60s to pay for the costs of funding the retired generation.

Sounds awful. I agree with a previous poster that we have become obsessed with the quantity of life, rather than maintaining quality of life. When it comes to medical care in old age, we need to be mindful that just because something can be done, does not mean it should be done.

Two of my sisters are nurses. Mum developed dementia, lived at home for years with care. I remember going to see her - one of the conversations went:
Her: Who are you?
Me: I'm your daughter, mum.
Her: Are you sure?
She came downstairs one morning, must have had a UTI, legs stopped working, and within two days she was in a care home. She was 88. My sisters very specifically said: yes to painkillers, yes to oral antibiotics; no, you will not admit her to hospital and no, we do not consent to intravenous antibiotics. She died after 16 weeks there, she was okay for a couple of months, health diminished, and I suppose it took her 3 weeks to fade away. So death by omission, I'd have preferred her to have something to hasten her path. The care home staff were generally sweet and caring, but it wouldn't be the way I'd choose to go, if I could.

As the saying goes, we wouldn't treat a dog like this.

There are always people on threads like this who seem genuinely surprised to learn that no, consensual euthanasia is not an option for them. No, they their doctor can't give them anything to speed their death along. Yes, their relatives will be investigated for murder if they assist.

I do wonder how much of the population understands the true position or the current level of barbarity being inflicted on people every day at the end of their lives due to our laws and so-called medical ethics.

I suspect if that was better understood there would be more vocal support for a legal change.

I couldn't agree with you more. I think anyone against or on the fence should go and work in a dementia ward for a week

[quote Longingforatikihut]@dontsaythj it's not something I've looked into the statistics of personally, just that was the main take home statement from my medical ethics teaching of my undergraduate degree in regards to human euthanasia.

It's a shame that there are such unscrupulous people that would encourage someone for personal benefit but of course there are.

I am sorry for OP having to watch the decline of there parent. It's very hard to find any solace in such situation.[/quote]
But that's a bit like saying abortion should be illegal to protect against coerced abortions. Which is an argument that used to be made against changing the law.

It doesn't stand up to scrutiny and it's an immoral position to take.

I think it is also important to note that this idea about euthanasia being abused is not evidence-based and is pushed by people holding a very particular ideological stance. One of those is the hospice movement (which is ideological) which pushes back against assisted dying because it sees it as a threat to the success/continuation its own movement! Truly disturbing - to torture people for your ideology.

It is such a contrived "ethical" position to take this black and white view that anything that hastens death must be avoided in all circumstances and that life must preserved until the last miserable moment regardless of cost.

There is nothing ethical about that, it simply reflects a particular ideology born from western medicine and our culture's fear of mortality.

I hope that future generations re-discover their humanity so that they look back at such so-called medical ethics in bafflement.

@Longingforatikihut

I see. It's clearly a concern, but nevertheless I believe that rather than prohibiting euthanasia due to that, the onus should be on designing a system with appropriate safeguards so that no one has to endure prolonged suffering and loss of dignity.

I totally agree, OP. It's fine to say just bump me off if I get like that but it's not that easy in reality. Living wills with the option of deciding in advance on a point of euthanasia would be my choice.

I would absolutely hate to be in that situation,I said to my family let me go.
Don't let me live the remainder of my life in pain and confused.

My mam died at 57,and I read posts like this and I'm glad she didn't live out her remaining years in pain.

@dontsaythj it's not something I've looked into the statistics of personally, just that was the main take home statement from my medical ethics teaching of my undergraduate degree in regards to human euthanasia.

It's a shame that there are such unscrupulous people that would encourage someone for personal benefit but of course there are.

I am sorry for OP having to watch the decline of there parent. It's very hard to find any solace in such situation.

I know it's possible to make advance decisions about care, and to refuse treatment, but I'm not sure how far it extends.

I agree.

My dad always told me that if he ever needed nappies to put a pillow over his head.

I'm glad he died. He would have hated what he had become.

I'm so sorry OP, I completely agree with you

I think the reason it's hard to get change going at an official level is because of the risk that it would be abused, either by individuals or by governments.

There is also the risk that it might increase callousness toward elderly people with health issues.

Not enough countries have made it legal for long enough to have a good sense of the risks.

Personally I agree with legalising it but I understand why people are concerned.

I agree there needs to be more emphasis on quality of life over quantity. I definitely fear ending my days in a state where I’m existing rather than living.

I’m not even talking about euthanasia I’m talking about treating every illness, invasive procedures for the sake of keeping someone alive way past their natural lifespan rather than letting people go when their body is ready.

I agree with you OP and I'm sorry for you both

There is currently a bill being discussed in Scotland regarding this, hoping it goes through and it's the start of stopping people suffering needlessly.

My Dad has some kind of Parkinson's Plus syndrome (can't be definitively diagnosed until after death, basically like very quickly progressing Parkinson's that doesn't respond to treatment) and he is completely housebound and almost completely bed bound, he can only very slowly manage to move between bed, commode and chair with the aid of a Zimmer frame, two carers and my mum, sometimes they have to use a hoist, soon they will always have to. His ability to swallow is declining so he has a chest infection from inhaling food and drink that makes him cough and retch a lot so food gives him no pleasure really. He's incontinent and has the beginnings of bed sores from being unable to move. He has no quality of life and nor does my mum who cares for him. Eventually, he will lose the ability to swallow and will probably die of aspiration pneumonia but he could go on like this and then completely bed bound for years.

I think it's cruel we don't even have the option of assisted suicide for those with mental capacity, who are terminally or chronically ill and who want to die. I think as a society we're squeamish and childish about death in general and would rather pretend it doesn't happen.

Euthenasia would be for people terminally ill and with the capacity to make the decision.
It isn't for old people in homes being coerced by family or whatever the worry is. The person would need a diagnosis of a terminal illness so the life would be shortened to avoid the last weeks of pain.

I was all for 'caring' for ill and elderly in care homes until I realised that the care home set up just prolongs a miserable life.
Residents are not allowed a life in case they fall or injure themselves. If they do fall the care home is lambasted.
So ---- residents have to be wrapped in cotton wool, not allowed to move around much in case they fall, can't wander out in the grounds alone.
I think we should accept that accidents will happen, which will hasten their demise, and let the care home get on with it.

Is there any evidence that this is a significant problem in countries which have legalised it?

My exH died in December. He was in the early stages of pancreatic and liver cancer. He felt so ill and struggled to look after himself. On numerous occasions he asked DD and I to let him take an overdose and die. He wanted to go and was terrified about what was to come. He had no quality of life and was just waiting to die. In December he had to go in hospital for a small surgical procedure. Two days later he had to go into hospital due to sepsis. He knew exactly what was happening and was glad, as it meant he wasn't going to go through the final awful stage of cancer. He died three days after admission with his loved ones all around him and had been able to say everything he wanted to and his final goodbyes. He was on a syringe driver for pain relief in the last few days and it was far better than the alternative he had been facing.

I think it is a really important discussion for us all to have, and to have with our elderly parents. Both sets of our parents had living wills stating very explicitly what treatments they wanted and when, and for how long. Make sure everyone is on board, as it helps if children are aware, and support the decisions made by their parents.

DM had one, and it saved her being taken to hospital by paramedics several times. They persuaded her to go a couple of times, but then when in hospital she was able to refuse treatment, and then return home. Terrible waste, but paramedics tend to err towards treatment, as do hospital doctors.

She was in a care home when she caught Covid, and stayed there, as she wished, and had palliative treatment there, rather than in hospital. Much better for her, and a peaceful end.

Put it all in writing, be explicit, and hopefully everything will go smoothly.

Whilst I'm for human euthanasia with consent, the reason we don't legalise it is because how can you be sure the person giving consent isn't giving consent under duress.

I wouldn't wish to live past the point of caring myself. I watched my mother decline through cancer. It was horrific.