POA/Wills - parent refusing

OP, I should have added that it seems so unfair everything is falling to you, and not your sibling. It’s easier said than done, to find the extra strength to sort out her finances. It is relentless. However, if you can at least get her banking online tell her she can get a mini statement 24/7. It will bring some relief.

I have been dealing with the Office of Public Guardian for six years as DM refused POA and sectioned. No fun, expensive an totally a waste of her hard earned savings.
However, if she refuses, it’s her right and it will make you incredibly frustrated.
I second getting internet banking set up with Direct debits and standing orders in place covering all her utilities, window cleaning and garden maintenance. It means if she goes into hospital for an extended stay her outgoings are covered by her and not by you. I’d even go as far as getting her to consider Xmas and birthday standing orders for all the family. Also look into attendance allowance. It’s non means tested and she could well be eligible. Phone up for the forms rather than downloading forms as it often works out that she gets t payment sooner.

Could you suggest doing yours at the same time? To normalise it a it?

Just be brutal.

Say she'll have to instruct solicitors to deal with it all and suggest they'll take the money.

Tell her the cost of the alternative. It took me a while to work it out but it's thousands and requires a solicitor and court.

Sounds rough but some people don't like the rocks and need to be told about the hard places. There are no good alternatives.

I will help anyone but they need to help and give you the tools.

I’ll be forever grateful that my parents were very forward thinking with POA etc 25+ years ago, it made life so much easier in the end stages of life.

However we did need to use a large amount of emotional blackmail on my dad (we’d already lost mum) as to how much it would help us (me and sister) if he’d consider allowing Carers to assist him.

I know that’s slightly different but it comes down to the same thing, she’s almost wilfully making your life more difficult by refusing the POA (which is the more urgent for now) but still expecting you to look after things while she’s undergoing treatment.

POA is often invaluable, as organisations vary in how they interact with anyone other than the account holder/policy holder / customer (and we all want some safeguards I imagine, to prevent fraud, yes?).
POA only lasts while someone is alive. Once the person has died it has no effect. At that point, the executor of the Will takes over (often the same person, in practice, but not necessarily). Definitely focus on inconvenience & cost to her if she doesn't draw up POA or a Will - and you'll be happy to help her do it, of course.

Why write a Will if there's only 2 of you, and inheritance laws would split everything equally anyway? Well the other sibling may declare after death "oh but Mum always said I was to get her diamond necklace / Rembrandt / car / 60% of her money because XYZ" and having a Will at least avoids doubt over her wishes.

Perhaps op can clarify what the estate is likely to be.

My parents haven't done their wills depite being in their 80's and mum having dementia. They finally agreed to POA a year ago and it's taken ages to sort out due to covid.

We had to accept that it was their decision and nothing we could do to make them.

Answer is that it won't.

Sorry, thats no help. The problem is I think it is unimaginable to people that they might not be able to make their own decisions. But it happens every day. Ultimately if she won't trust you, you can't help her.

Speaking as someone who is currently using my Mum's POA for finances while she is in hospital, it is a bit of a godsend. It's a lot of work doing her finances but I'm hugely relieved I can use it. It is extremely unlikely she will ever again have capacity for complex decisions. And that happened overnight.

Poa for health is less important I think, unless she has strong views on something. Mum did write to her GP a few years ago giving the GP permission to talk to us children about her. That's been really useful.

Mum definitely has a will but it's currently missing... that's less vital, it will only mean a bit of a larger tax bill plus one row will happen about a picture everyone except me wants.

Just tell her that if she won't do it then you can't help her. Bills won't get paid. You won't be ringing round explaining. She'll have to sort it herself when she is better.
Her choice. Do the PoA and I can help you or don't and I won't be able to and you deal with it yourself.
A relative can never be responsible for someone else's debt so I would never advise paying it yourself as you are not obliged to.

Plenty of people do get in this situation when they don't have relatives and it all gets sorted out in the end. I have had some elderly folk not pay their bills for years but they don't get cut off because they are mentally incapacitated and the companies know they have to wait. I have bagged up years worth of red bills from properties that look scary but in the end one phone call to say the person is incapacitated means they won't take court action or if they did it would not be enforced.

Can't she just give you the password so you can deal with the account?

If your mum is resisting a POA will she accept a 3rd party mandate. If she will, work with her to internet banking and you should be ok.

Yes, I was focussed on the technical aspect of paying another persons bills and how it is possible without a POA. But I understand/agree that if this is not affordable then you would need a POA to use their money to pay their bill.

We told my mum that the whole family were doing POAs for each other and this convinced her to go ahead, obviously with us doing all the paperwork and just presenting her with the pages to sign. Just in time! She was diagnosed with dementia shortly after and without POA we all would have been at the mercy of social services regarding residential care, her property, her bank accounts etc. With POA we were in charge not just of her finances but her entire welfare. It was such a relief. I wish you well op.

I'm third party representative for my mother's bank account. Have my own card and she still has hers although she doesn't use it anymore.

We have LPAs in place now (her suggestion) but have been third party for a few years.

If your mother is like mine, it was the fear of not being in control of her affairs and having things taken out of her hands that was the reason for her reluctance. She was an avid DM reader and had seen too many stories of relatives spending all the cash and was petrified she would be fleeced - either by strangers or family!

Can you reassure her that the POA will only be used in the circumstances of her not being capable, otherwise if she is well enough, she can still run her accounts etc? That way, you’ve got all bases covered. Your mother will then feel that she can manage and it’s not being taken out of her hands but you’ve got control should the worst happen.

When we got the POA forms signed, mother’s doctor and her bank managers witnessed them (health and welfare/financial) They both explained the implications but also assured her it was very wise and sensible thing to do, otherwise outsiders might have step in. Mother was very secretive and private, so I think this finally persuaded her.