Elderly parents taking no responsbility for themselves

As a non-driving daughter of a widowed and lovely but emotionally frail father, I totally encourage you to hold your ground on the driving. They do not have the right to bully you into being a chauffeur. Running costs of a car can totally cover the costs of taxis where needed, and if they don't live centrally enough, that's for them to fix.
Holding boundaries and being free with the help I was able to give from a distance and pretty ruthless about what I wasn't able to give (i.e. moving home, learning to drive) has made all the difference in the world, 14 years after my father was widowed. I really believe that boundaries save lives, and families. Good luck x

I'm really sorry OP this is horrid to have to deal with I think in these situations you have to remember you have no control over how other people (your parents, in this case) behave.

All you can control is how you behave.

So your mum will huff and puff and wail and tantrum. It doesn't matter what you do, that's what will happen.

So let her. But don't let it make you do things you don't want to. Because the next issue that comes up, she'll huff and puff and wail and tantrum.

All you 'gain' by capitulation is that you end up doing things you don't want to. And you still have to put up with the histrionics.

So just hang up. Refuse to engage. They can't force you into a car and make you drive, they can't force you to stay on the phone and listen to the latest drama. Protect your own mental health, because they won't. It's not 'selfish', it's necessary.

@happywriter

Thanks to each and every one of you who replied, I appreciate them all

midgedude, I appreciate what you are saying, and I do empathise with their situation and try to see it from their side. However, there is a history of my mum throwing tantrums and huffs when she doesnt get her own way, and they are practically putting themselves in danger with thier denial (e.g. him falling and saying he doesn't know what happened, taking constant wrong turnings in car and saying road signs were taken away, etc). Even if I focus on their point of view, it doesnt take away they aren't being sensible, or denying potential dementia which needs to be addressed asap if there is anything there like that.

If your father does have dementia then that needs to be taken account of and he may need to be prevented from driving before an accident happens.
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If your mother is so much in denial about their problems then she is probably unable or unwilling to even try and provide any of the care he needs at home, in addition to her own needs.

As I say, I was fortunate in that we met very little of this resistance from my parents. Sometimes something would be suggested (such as blue badges for the car, or getting carers in) and it would initially be met with reluctance ("oh we don't want that!!") but in the end they were fairly sensible. Once my mother needed a wheelchair to be pushed around town they purchased one and sorted the blue badges. Then they wondered why they had been so against it and said that they should have done it months ago.

The need for carers came after the first lockdown last year. Both had spent it being admitted to hospital for various non-covid related emergencies and despite the only help my sister and I could provide it became clear that the one could never cope if the other became ill. It also became clear that all of us needed the reassurance that should something go wrong when they were on their own that they would be found before too long and we would know about it. So they appointed the carers, who still visit my mother three times each day.

My mother's house is a bungalow that my parents bought over 50 years ago so no stairs, which is what allowed my parents to continue living there for so long. They did totally interdepend on each other though, both with an ever growing list of mobility and medical issues.

I have to admit that having to leave my mother on her own just days after my Dad's funeral did feel brutal. I felt awful but I had been away from my own home and family for about 6 weeks by then apart from when DH drove them all up for the funeral. It had to happen though. No way round it.

My sister and I have visited regularly since and I am going again this weekend for a couple of days (going by train this time instead of all that driving, and looking forward to that).

I am fortunate in that I have not met the resistance from my own mother that OP is getting from hers. My parents actively planned for the possibility of needing care of some type, at least financially. They had a horror of ever ending up depending on their adult children, though recent events have shown that there is only so much you can plan for.

My mother is now looking quite eagerly towards sheltered accommodation in the centre of her local town. It can't come soon enough. She is also considering buying herself a mobility scooter so that once there she will be able to get herself out to the supermarket, or out for a coffee elsewhere.

OP, maybe your mother is one of those who really will have to experience just how difficult it will be. It feels brutal. It feels dreadful. You aren't deserting them though. You are finding ways for them and you to cope, and to preserve your sanity.

Involve their GP. Perhaps speak to adult social services, if the GP doesn't do it for you. Make outside agencies aware that there is a problem, and potentially a crisis brewing. Make it clear that you are not able to available as a carer though, otherwise they will do nothing.

If you think they may have dementia ring their GP and ask that they have a memory check next time they are seen.
They won’t discuss them with you, but you can express your concerns,

Firstly, yes there is no way they should be relying on you.

However, I guess getting old, infirm , unable to do what you are used to is a terrible prospect. Having to give up what you know and love. Seeing each other gradually decline. Knowing there is only one out come, that one of you will soon leave the other.

I see my mam for example hating the fact that she has to pay good money to get things done and then it's not done the way she used to do things, the way she liked. Her terror at the thought she will have to stop driving one day and how that will close her world down.

Just wondering if this might help you think about how you approach the problems

Echoing what everyone says. It's up to you to control your responses. They are in charge of their own lives. The more you say no the easier it will become. The choices are become their servants and have a rubbish life yourself, which will impact your children, or stand up to them and face their disapproval.

You can tell them what you will or won't do until you're blue in the face (either by letter, phone call or face to face).
They won't/don't believe you. You are their back up plan (future full time carer).

Telling alone doesn't work. Your actions have to back up what you're saying. So don't do things. Let them fail. Until they see the consequences of their actions (or inaction) there is no impetus to change their behaviour.

My MIL refused carers and made a nuisance of herself to us, the neighbours, the GP and the emergency services. The GP did nothing.
She should really be in a home, and would have a far better life in one, so we got Social Services involved out of sheer frustration.
They have eventually forced carers on her, and will reassess from time to time.
You have my sympathies. It’s a shit time and it’s only going to get worse for you, particularly when one of them dies.

When they put it on you, then put it back on them. Explain that they can choose to live how they want but they have to accept the consequences of that. Speak to them like adults, if they start becoming unreasonable tell them in a clear manner that if they continue to be unreasonable that you will have to end the call or leave and that you will be happy to speak to them once they can be rational.

I remember your previous thread - well done for reducing the calls. Caring for older people only gets harder and with young children you run the risk of being run ragged.
Hold the line about not driving for a start.
There are other options and services available but they might have to hit the point where they simply cannot do something before they accept that.
Good luck!

How about writing them a letter so they can digest things rather than reacting immediately.

You can tell them your worries and what you can do to help them but also make it clear what you won't be doing if they aren't happy to accept change in their lifestyle.

I had to do similar with my Dad - he now has a full time carer - so result!!

I'm full in your corner, so don't take this the wrong way. Be honest with yourself and look back over the last ten years and consider at any point have your parents made plans to future proof their life?

It's likely your answer will be 'no'
If they were asked the same question, would their answer be: 'But it's all right, it won't happen to us and anyway, we've got 'happywriter' who will do what we need'
If that's the view they held when they were fit and able, now as they become increasingly frail, that view will be unshakeable in their minds. They won't treat you any better and suddenly find extra respect.
My point to you is that for your own well being, you need to find ways of how you deal with them differently.

No real advice just wishing you the best of luck OP, its such a tricky situation to be in but ultimately they are adults, we do have a tendency as a society to start treating our elders like children once they hit a certain age, but this just encourages and reinforces the attitude that you should be doing things for them that they are capable of doing themselves.
One way to cope with this is to act like you dont understand why she cant do it herself/behave like she's joking/dont engage.
For example:
Mum: We need a lift to XX place
You: oh okay, what time have you booked the taxi for?
Mum: laughter or 'dont be ridiculous' 'You need to arrange something'
You: haha very funny mum, you know how to use a phone, grown adults dont need other people to book taxis for them. Oh is that the door - gotta run bye!
Or
Figure out a line like 'you'll need to book a taxi' and resist the temptation to answer any other questions or make any excuses, just keep repeating 'you'll need to book a taxi' until she gets bored. Repeat it even if it doesnt make sense. Stay calm and dont shout,and let there be silence if you need to, you dont need to fill the gap. If you do get a chance read back through some of the threads on this elderly parents forum there as a lot of people have similar experiences, you're not alone and there's some great advice in those threads.
Hope you manage to get on okay with GP!

So sorry. This is a case of the least worst choice. Help is there but you cannot force them to take it. And if you don't drive you aren't driving them around, thats it!!

It's a very difficult situation. However, your Mum cannot expect you to be her chauffeur and you have your own family and home to see to. Im sorry to say she sounds incredibly selfish. One thing you could consider is contacting Age UK for advice. Like another poster said keep an eye on your Dad re signs of dementia. I was a carer for someone and I need to warn you, in my experience GP was useless. I will also say, do not volunteer for anything, once you tell a GP or Social Services you can do X. You will be left to it with no help from anyone. Also don't depend on family, they vanish like snow off a dyke. I can only tell you my own experience and sadly it was grim. It concerns me that you have three children to think about. It is going to come to a point that your parents will have to accept the help. Im so sorry you are in this position, it's not easy.

I speak as someone who has had five years of what's coming your way. Your only solution is to change you.
What Dint said above is something you must remind yourself of over and over again.
This is not your problem unless you want it to be. They have the right to live where and how they like, even if to your eyes their life would be much easier if they lived elsewhere. What they don't have the right to do is demand that you should spend your time, money and effort enabling them in their decisions.
In your shoes, armed with my experience, I'd 'divorce' from them as of this very week and hell mend them. Let them reap what they have sewn. Go spend time with your DCs and husband. They are absolutely your priority. You have spent 50 years trying to help your DM. Accept that she knows best about managing her own life and take a massive step back.

I don't think it's uncommon for a crisis to force changes that are long overdue.

Topseyt you sound so sensitive to your mum's situation - it's really best warming to read. I could well be in her situation one day and would be brokenhearted to leave my home but hopefully we, as a family, can all work together realistically when the time comes. I feel for everyone on this thread. My husband and I are deciding on how we can adapt our home so that we can stay here as long as possible.

I remember you from your other thread. Despite what your mother believes, you weren't put on this earth to make them happy and become their driver. They can have an account with a local taxi firm if she's too Hyacinth for community transport - that's what other people do when they stop driving. They can afford a few taxis with the insurance saved on the car.

Having a dementia screening check does not give you dementia. There is medication that can help slow the decline but it's not available without the diagnosis. Ignoring it will not make it go away. You could drop a note to their doctor with your concerns but this is not your problem to solve.

Prepare yourself for stormy waters ahead but stick to the broken record. "I've told you I'm not driving, get yourself a taxi account" for the driving and "Well move then" for anything to do with the house. "Oh no, not this again mum, do we have to?" would also work. They have choices and if they are chosing to stay there well that's fine but they then accept all that goes with that choice - dodgy transport, gardening, no downstairs loo. They could have a gardener, they could have a stairlift, they could spend money to make their life easier. If it turns into a shouting match you can leave or hang up, your parents have no more right to bully you than anyone else does.

It may be that they don't know how to move house/engage a gardener/hire a taxi so stick with what they know because it's easier. What you know is safe and the unknown is risky, that's why you are the preferred option being known and safe.

One of the grannies is a perpetual victim, nothing is ever her fault and she's never been wrong in her life. It is very wearing, you have my sympathy. If you are set up as the rescuer then they will forever be the victim, the way out of it is to coach them to solve their own problems. I've had a total failure with this because she makes all the right noises and then rings round the family to find someone else to rescue her.

You could actually use the words "take responsibility for yourselves and stop moaning". What's stopping you doing that?

This is not your problem unless you want it to be. They have the right to live where and how they like, even if to your eyes their life would be much easier if they lived elsewhere. What they don't have the right to do is demand that you should spend your time, money and effort enabling them in their decisions.

So as Charlie says, put those boundaries in, don't always be available to answer calls. Not driving is a big asset to you, it's a lot easier to refuse to give lifts if you don't have a driving license. Suggest they get a trolley to help them carry shopping up the path. (The neighbours' raised eyebrows at NHS transport will be as nothing to their raised eyebrows at your parents' going down to the car every time they want a tin of peas.)

You do need to back off and spend less time in conversation with your mother. Irrationalities are easier to tolerate if their not taking up so much of your time. Any time you phone her, or you pick up her call, start by saying "I've only got 5 minutes" And after 5 mins, cut in and say "I' sorry I have to go" and just go.

The one thing where you might want to keep an eye open is your father - make sure his welfare isn't being put at risk by your mother. If you think he's not keeping clean (because he can't access toilet or bathroom) or you think his "senior moments" are tipping into dementia, you can write to his GP with your concerns and ask the GP to see him under some pretext. The GP won't be able to discuss it with you but will read the letter.

They have no need to take responsibility for themselves if you are always there to take responsibility for them.