Probably going down in flames...

 @ParoxetineQueen

Oh bless, to you both.

I don't think my mother will sue. She's all talk.

@LighthouseSouth You're in between a rock and a hard place here

I also agree that the medical profession is geared up to keeping people alive when perhaps it's time for them to go. My step father died of lung cancer and towards the end it was grim. A dog would have had a more merciful end, and I don't say this lightly.

Back here! In the words of the song I think Mum is tired of living but scared of dying. She fell 4 weeks ago, taken to hospital by well-meaning (arse covering) paramedics. A week later my brother and I made the decision DNR, she begged to be allowed to die, we explained over and over that she wasn’t receiving or going to receive anything other than palliative care then cried when the immensely kind Macmillan nurses suggested a hospice bed. Now we are in limbo, half the time she talks about getting better the rest of the time says why does she have to live. She doesn’t want anyone but me, my brother and my grown up children to visit. Don’t know why I’m posting this but I know some of you will understand how draining this is.

sorry I know I keep venting

but latest is that something dad refused treatment for last year, he now wants treatment because "it will get worse". Well of course it will - they told you that last year!!!

so it looks like he is going to be in two sets of treatment in two different hospitals, when we could have had it handled last year

this means several sets of hospital appointments in one go and they live a 3 hour round trip from me in the first place! Also I told him last year, it was very quiet at work and it would be easy for me to take time off at the original time of diagnosis!

I'm afraid I lost it somewhat today and said to my mum "you know what, he causes the chaos, he can deal with the results without me running round after him".

she'll never stop running round around after him because she thinks the sun shines out of his arse. but I don't think I can make it my problem any more. The thing is, if she doesn't feel well enough to go, he can go alone - he just likes someone to moan at.

@VanillaSugar

thank you so much for your reply. Do you think your mum will sue?

My DM would be very upset if we moved. She has said not to worry about it but we are very close. For me another factor is that because her memory is going, sometimes she'll say "I haven't spoken to you for ages" when it was yesterday, and also we will fix a time to call and she forgets it, then gets upset if she calls and we aren't here.

so I think if she has several years left, it won't be long before she can't compute if she saw me yesterday or three months ago, if you see what I mean.

with my dad, it's kind of ironic because he spent years ranting about what he perceived as elderly people draining the NHS.

he has said some quite vicious things about elderly people and that's in spite of him having things like statins from the age of 50 something.

In general I think societal attitudes to long life are quite odd.....preventative everything and a sense that prolonging life is vitally important, even when quality of life is declining. I so miss the days I was little and people thought "three score and ten" was a good life. It is certainly at least ten years more than what I'd want!

@LighthouseSouth Deep breath. I won't say it will be alright because it won't. Oh dear. I can give you sympathy and and a good old shoulder, but that's about it.

My own DM has also had a run in with the NHS and wants to sue them. Have I already mentioned this? It happened at the same time that a lovely lady I know died (with grace and dignity) and I want to shout at my DM " At least you're BLOODY ALIVE "

How does your DM feel about you moving g?

Oh gosh

I know nobody's posted here for ages but I hope someone will hear my cry....

just to say after a peaceful ish 3 weeks, dad has another round of hospital stuff because he's feeling ill again and I have the rage

if he didn't constantly push to extend his life at every possible opportunity .....argh. my mum actually told me something quite telling....one doctor appointment I didn't attend, the doctor said something to dad about trying to live his extra years with grace and dignity.

I have a lot of experience of doctors myself and I don't think anyone would say that unless they knew the patient in question was not a nice person!! That doctor knows dad quite well now and probably feels pushed to his limit with him too.

we were out in the countryside yesterday and once again I found myself thinking "suppose we don't move for another 20 years because of all this?" I just don't know any more. Perhaps it's time to say, look, if you keep taking all the treatments available to avoid dying at 80, you can take the consequences and we will just go and live our lives. I hate London so much.

@AcrossthePond55

no, I probably didn't explain very well. A TIA has some effect later doesn't it...this is more like before I took meds for depression/anxiety and if I popped to the shop for bread, I'd get there and think "why I am here?" And sometimes I would have to go home because I couldn't remember that one thing.

What she did yesterday, she immediately realised she couldn't move the car - there was a gap of a few seconds between her starting to do it and then realising she'd had a brain blank. She said to the neighbour immediately "I don't know how to do this, what's happening". Dad and I were in the house and from our perspective it was about 30 seconds between her going outside, then coming back in to say "WTF" - except mum doesn't swear, lol.

she does also have very bad insomnia, as do I. I have said to her before, I don't consider myself safe to drive (no problem as I live in London) but she disagrees, she thinks I'd be fine if I did it again.

I am inclined to be massively overcautious just as you say - this affects other people.

the other reason I said it is because she seems to need to concentrate super hard when she drives now, but there are often posts on here from people who are told they are just lacking in confidence if they have to do that. It's an awkward one but I will ask again. Dad is usually with her so he will also say something if he thinks she's not okay to drive.

That's how my mum scared herself! She was driving to the eye doctor, been there a million times, and suddenly she didn't know how to get there! She pulled over and sat for a minute and it all came back, but it scared her enough to make her curtail her driving to local places, etc. We asked her to stop after a severe attack of vertigo AND we found out that she'd let some random in her car because 'they me asked for directions so I thought it would be easier if I just took them myself'.

If your mum is having blank spells, do you think she may be having TIAs? Of course, the problem with those is that they don't show up on tests. Does she realize she's having them and would she tell her GP? If so, maybe if you speak to the office and let them know your concerns ahead of time, the GP would be willing to suggest she stop driving. And perhaps there's a way for a GP to let the relevant agency know a person shouldn't be driving anymore. I know that here if you report repeated seizures or repeated loss of consciousness a doctor will 'turn you in'.

The driving issue is so hard because it doesn't involve just them, does it? It involves other drivers and pedestrians.

She's nervous and has always been a poor driver, but the reason I suggested she stopped is that her mental state is such, she suddenly goes blank.

If you asked her doctor, they would probably say she's fine to drive. But I've noticed her suddenly going blank and thought, what if that happens on the road? i think that's what happened yesterday, she got half way through moving the car, then didn't know what to do next.

tbh if she retook her test on a good day it would be fine. You can never tell when this sudden period of "blank" will happen.

she only drives in an area in the local streets, so only residential roads and the High Street, where the supermarket and GP are located. She would be unlikely to be above 20mph, no journey longer than 5 mins.

Oh, then I guess it’s different there. Do you feel she’s actually unsafe to drive or just a nervous driver.

We were lucky with our mum. She voluntarily curtailed her driving after scaring herself once; no motorways, no after dark, only to very familiar places all very local. But eventually we had to tell her it was time to stop. Luckily she agreed, although as dementia started getting hold of her there were times she made remarks about us wanting to steal her car and my brother had to hide her keys.

I think stopping driving represents such a huge loss of independence that it’s really difficult for them to give it up even if they know deep inside it’s time. Mum used to say how hard it was to have to ask one of us to drive her around. We didn’t mind in the least, small price to pay to not have her on the road.

Across, my understanding is that you have to report an incident.

This was that a neighbour asked her - as a favour - to move her car, she said yes without worry, but panicked and couldn't. Pretty much the whole street saw, (long story) but I'm not sure if a one off thing like this will count.

As I type this I'm not sure if I'm being fair myself actually. But I hope the incident will make her think. She's certainly very embarrassed.

Light I'm in the US so this may not apply, but when my Grandad became a dangerous driver we contacted the agency that controls driver's licenses (DMV here, not sure in the UK) and reported him. They called Grandad in for an exam which he failed and as a result he lost his license. Do they do similar in the UK?

Of course, my DH's Grandad lost his license when the police found him driving on the median rather than in a lane. Didn't stop him from driving though. FiL and his brother had to sneak in the dead of night and take his car keys.

The 'flip side' of this, however, is that now family has to drive them around everywhere.

Slightly worrying visit to the parents. My mother, who I said needs to stop driving ages ago, had a panic attack trying to move the car.

I suppose there is nothing I can do to stop this occurring on a busy road until she has a panic attack there.

My dad and I had a very honest conversation and he admitted they are making life harder for themselves because they refuse to accept their limits - but he also said he realises it's time to stop dragging me into it.

Their neighbours are trying hard to help with everything from bins to shopping but parents said that makes them uncomfortable.

There is nothing I can do to reduce their risk of accident etc and as I travelled home, I think I let go of it, if such a thing is possible.

We have agreed I'm not going to visit for at least the next three weekends. Yay!!

My DD died two years ago he was very ill and scared. It was a blessing but I miss the Dad he was to me when he was younger.

My mother has recently been in hospital and yes, the medics made mistakes, but she is alive and much better than when she originally went in. She was rude to the staff and is threatening to sue the NHS. She has a rant and a tirade against her doctor at every opportunity.

This week I attended the funeral of a darling, darling lady who passed away through cancer. She was a mum and a grandmother. She never had a bad word to say about anybody and she loved everybody. I am devastated for her and her family.

I am going to find dealing with my elderly mother as she becomes more elderly very hard indeed.

Yes of course, across. I didn't mean to dismiss the efforts of families like yours.

Those of us with bad tempered, narcissistic elderlies are over represented in the ranting though, for obvious reasons!

I think the lovely parents have children who don't struggle with their care, partly because the parent doesn't demand anything unreasonable and partly because we don't mind being needed by people who were there for us when we needed them.

My parents were lovely. But it still takes its toll and it's still a struggle. We all still have to juggle our responsibilities to our own family with the needs of our parents. There may still be siblings who don't pull their weight. And no, there isn't the verbal abuse or 'demands' but it's still hard and the time needed isn't that different whether your parents are nice or nasty. And harder still to see a much beloved parent deteriorate before your eyes.

It’s not always a matter of being stuck. I was very privileged to be able to care for my mum. She was tricky as fuck but i treasure the time we had

@doesthisthreadlookgoodonme

Oddly enough I just saw your thread. I really feel for you.

@LighthouseSouth I'm so with you. I get that from FIL. Last week it kicked off because he told me he's going to cut his throat, and I thought I best mention that to the nurses, but apparently I shouldn't have. Myself and OH have agreed that when he attempted suicide a few weeks back and then refused treatment, we shouldn't have convinced him otherwise. He clearly wants to go, and I'm now tasked with being the one who finds him dead one day. I'm hoping they keep him in hospital and don't let him home, that is a possibility

Well my dad was never nice
Mum was lovely, in some ways she still is, but it depends if you catch her on a rare good day

I think part of it is they expect me to entertain them on top of other stuff, but also maybe mum's way of accepting things has changed e.g. She doesn't like me volunteering at the shelter. She thinks everything that can be done for the homeless is done by govt and charity is left for those "choosing" to be homeless. Perhaps it's easier for her to think that, or to complain I could spend that time with her.

My friend's mum died recently, she was the same age as my parents but in much better health, so very busy with hobbies etc and fun to be around. Her death was a total shock, but much better to go suddenly while still enjoying life. My frown has never had to help her same age parents with anything so the relationship is bound to be more free and easy isn't it.

I'm trying to show compassion but it's very difficult to keep hearing "I want to die..." Followed by "actually no, I will take the lifesaving treatment and then whine about how I didn't die". I don't enjoy criticising my folks but this thread is much needed therapy.

I think the lovely parents have children who don't struggle with their care, partly because the parent doesn't demand anything unreasonable and partly because we don't mind being needed by people who were there for us when we needed them.