To feel sorry for Ed Sheeran.....

He actually also mentioned Sudan, and the Congo. Mentioned freeing America of ICE too.

seems he’s hyper focused on quite a few issues.

This is a really interesting thread and I'm not sure where I stand - I think it's because we're actually arguing multiple points not just one. I've tried to separate them in my head ...

Is what Israel is doing in Gaza terrible?
Yes

Is Israel/Palestine a complicated conflict that's been ongoing for at least 70 years with atrocities on both sides?
Also yes

Is it anti-semitic to talk about the atrocities in Gaza?
No

Are some people (not all) sliding into anti-Jewish sentiment when talking about Gaza?
Yes

Should performers be expected/forced to take a side on political issues?
No

Should performers be allowed to talk about political issues if they want to?
Yes

Should performers be allowed to talk about political issues if they are a much smaller support act for a non-political artist?
Hmm not sure ... I'd say yes but they should perhaps be a bit sensitive to the wider context

Should a venue owner be able to censor an artist because they disagree with them? (I'm not thinking of Gaza specifically here but more generally - say they were talking about immigration or the trans issue etc etc)
Interesting one ... I'd say No because I strongly believe in free speech ... but I guess if the owner has a genuine belief that what the person is saying is wrong, might they feel they have a duty to act?

Should Ed have supported Macklemore as far as possible and tried to prevent him being taken off the bill?
Yes

If it was non-negotiable and Macklemore was not going to be allowed to perform whatever Ed did, should Ed have cancelled the concerts completely?
Well that's a lot more difficult - we don't want people to be complicit in blocking free speech - but it would have been a big ask for Ed to expect everyone invoved in the concerts to lose all that money, probably be in breach of contract, and disappoint thousands and thousands of fans ... it would also imply he was agreeing with Macklemore on the Israel/Palestine conflict when he's clearly said he doesn't want to publicly take a side

So overall I'd say it's a complex situation, I do strongly believe in free speech but I also think it's too simplistic to just blame Ed.

Free Palestine = very accessible social currency to prove you are a good and moral person.

Fuck people in Yemen, Iran, Sudan, Afghanistan… you don’t get moral brownie points for shouting about those countries. Hyper focus on
Palestine only.

Don’t worry about the complexity of the crisis. You don’t need to understand the history. No knowledge is needed. In fact the less the better. Detail only complicates the issue.

The Hamas charter? WTF is that? Who cares.

Child soldiers? Stolen aid? Human shields? Ignore, ignore, ignore. If in doubt who is at fault, blame Israel.

Don’t worry that for the majority of Jews the words Free Palestine are frankly terrifying. Jews are only 0.2% of the world’s population. They don’t really count.

Feeling uneasy about throwing 0.2% of the world’s population under the bus to prove your moral worth? Remember that Jews control the media, banking and the weather. Proof: Epstein.

Don’t worry that kicking Jews out of Israel is definitely ethnic cleansing. There is a bigger picture.

Free Palestine

Absolutely right

I wouldn’t go and watch Morrissey. Because I totally disagree with his political stance. If you knew that Mackelmore was pro palestinian, and supporting Ed, and likely to say something to make you feel uncomfortable, then give it a swerve.

If you've visited those sites what you posted earlier is even more disgusting. One of the worst posts I've ever read on here, and I've read a lot.

Like you, I hold pretty strongly to the principle of artistic freedom. Because I'm usually the one arguing the (classical) liberal point, I meet a lot of people who make freedom of expression arguments until it's expression they don't like. So I wanted to see whether that is where you would go. My view is also tempered by the fact that I think private venue-owners also have agency in what they platform, though that does also need to be tempered by a pragmatic recognition that to an extent we provide our public square via private venues. So that is two things in tension, which need to be balanced. I'm far more likely to see action by a private actor as 'censorship' if they control a lot of the public space than if they control a little. That's my starting point.

I think the main reason we differ on this is that: i) I see this as Sheeran's concert much more than Macklemore's. So M's artistic rights immediately bump up against S's. ii) I think a private venue has rights too.

How my principles apply to the black-family example. I do think if they'd chosen to buy tickets to a white power band, it would really be on them. I don't think the same if they'd bought tickets to Sheeran. Because the reasonable expectation differs.

On the "Stand with Israel!". As someone who's probably more pro-Israel than most on this board, I think an artist who did not want their support act saying that would be entirely within their right to remove the act if they continued to do so.

I think the venue question is harder, but I think a venue owner (perhaps a Muslim one) who decided they didn't want that act at their venues should be able (provided they are within their contractual rights) to withdraw their support.

The challenge with these things is that "stand with Israel" can mean many things, from 'sympathise with the victims at Nova' to 'remove Arabs from the land and create a greater Israel'. Just like "free Palestine" clearly does too.

In drawing my own view of where M lands on that line (and admittedly I don't know a huge amount about him), the photos of him in Jewface at an earlier concert make me a little sceptical that he is motivated purely by some universal love of all peoples.

I honestly wouldn’t mind if it wasn’t for the double standard. Only certain types of political comment is allowed. There’s no balance. It feels like a sort of public indoctrination.
People get cancelled if their comments don’t conform .

I don't think “everything anyone says about Israel is antisemitic”, and I haven't said anything suggesting that. But your previous post, which has now been deleted, said that Ed Sheeran might be a “zionist sympathiser” and that if he was, “he should never be heard from again”. That's exactly the kind of binary thinking I've been talking about. It shouldn't be necessary for Jewish people to demonstrate that they're the right kind of Jew by listing the Jewish people who condemn Israel's government before their concerns are worth listening to.
Criticising the Israeli government isn't inherently antisemitic. Neither is believing Israel should continue to exist inherently support for everything its government does. Both things can be true.

Good grief music gigs are not places of employment. Musicians are artists they have been political for donkeys' years in their words and their lyrics, have you only just noticed

If I was going out to a concert after a gruelling week at work I would prefer to hear the music that I’ve paid for rather than emotive and angry rantings like those in your post.
Can people just have a night off fgs?

Claiming that supporting the Palestinian people and a Palestinian state means you support the eradication of Israel is quite a stretch and quite frankly tiring as it’s nonsensical.

And arguably, by extension means that supporting Israel means you believe in the eradication of Palestine, if you’re going to look at things so black and white.

He performed at a charity event to raise money for humanitarian aid for Ukraine ... the bastard. Does that mean he has to get involved in every political movement? No it does not. There are lots of wars he has never raised money for or commented on, as is his right. Plus raising money for Ukraine was a lot less controversial than taking a side on the war in Gaza, and unlikely to offend/upset many - if any - of his fans.

Do people argue endlessly on social media about the war in Ukraine? No they don't and people don't use it as an excuse to bring out racist tropes against Russian people or accuse Ukrainian people including those living peacefully in the UK of being somehow culpable.

Actually, yes. If an artist supporting Israel – or expressing solidarity with Israelis, which isn't necessarily the same thing – unexpectedly made that part of their support set at someone else's concert, I would completely understand Palestinian audience members saying it made them uncomfortable. I wouldn't tell them it was their own fault for failing to research the support act first.
And we've recently seen calls for Boy George to be removed from performances because of views he has expressed about Israel. I don't remember everyone responding that artistic freedom means audiences simply have to put up with whatever makes them uncomfortable. But I also wouldn't describe this as simply “pro-Israel” versus “pro-Palestine”. That's exactly the binary I'm objecting to. Caring about Israelis doesn't make somebody anti-Palestinian, any more than caring about Palestinians makes somebody anti-Israeli.

Where will this end? It’s ridiculous. Every time we go to a concert we could be subjected to some politically illiterate’s musician’s half baked and potentially dangerous views.
Most people aren’t allowed to spout off their political views when they are at work.

Or they were implying "white power" was on a par with what Macklemore said which is misleading

Apparently to question that appalling post which has been deleted from Whoisit is wrong in their eyes. No helping some. That post was appalling and glad to see many were shocked by the hatred expressed there. No need for it.

Because the pp has been making an artistic freedom point.

If they think it doesn’t apply in that case, then their argument has to become much more nuanced. I’m interested in that.

An artistic freedom argument for the freedom only to say things the commenter finds palatable isn’t a serious one, after all.

I've been to Aushwitz and Birkenau ...utterly appalling. The holocaust is something that should NEVER have happened again. Yet here we are. Also please stop with the 'everything anyone says about Israel is anti semitic' rhetoric.....it just doesn't wash any more.Total bs. I don't like murderers or slaughterers of any religion doesn't mean I'm against an entire religion.

The slaughter of men women and children, the removal of basic rights of food, water and medicine and breaking every international law under the cosh of of Netanyahu is an abomination. This is intentional murder and slaughter. Anyone who supports it is a disgusting excuse of a human being. You can have your opinion on the rights of Israel but that also applies to the Palestinians, the thing is no one is arresting Israelis for having their say...why else do you think people feel the need to speak out on Palestines behalf.

Many Jews are speaking out against what is happening in gaza. Miriam Margolyes, Mandy Patinkin, including Jewish leaders.

What i find absolutely abhorrent is someone thinking that throwing a bit of money into the 'middle east' will just shut up the world. Wtf !!! Ed Sheeran should be ashamed utterly ashamed. Initially I thought he was between a rock and a hard place but literally everything he has said and done since has stripped away the veneer and shown him to be a spineless coward and I for one don't want him on a public forum pretending he gives a damn.

Someone is clearly trying to twist things in an effort for others to finally agree that Macklemore was wrong with what he said. The thing is, Macklemore is well known for his views. Hind's Hall, for example... It would have been known that some people would get their knickers in a twist over Macklemore being included. Certain people always like to try and prevent people who speak out from performing/having parts/etc etc. Tale as old as time.

I mean a better comparison would be if someone went on stage and gave their pro Israel views. I would say that anyone who felt uncomfortable with that should leave and if the artist had been vocally advocating for Israel for years they probably should have not have gone if pro Israel rhetoric was going to make them uncomfortable.

Would you be OK with an act being censored because they said 'I believe that every human being walking on this earth deserves exactly the same freedom. Stand with Israel!'?

This is a completely legitimate point of view, provided you are consistent in your beliefs. If you would also support, say, Graham Linehan making a speech at the Baftas in which he said, 'Sex matters, trans brothers and sisters this isn't about you... etc etc'. Or Gal Gadot making an anti-Palestinian speech at the Oscars maybe. Then great, that's internally coherent.

I agree freedom of expression is important but I'm much more supportive of people doing it on their own platform (their own concerts, books, twitter etc) than hijacking other people's.

Ed happily supported Ukraine before... so his whole speel about politics was clearly rather false. Ed has chosen to co-operate with the lovely individual who has wanted to silence Macklemore. All about the money but no surprise there. I'm actually really happy the support acts also pulled out. I'm sure they will have a lot more fans now for standing by their beliefs instead of ignoring them for the chance of money and more fame. But Ed has never really been known for being very concerned with much else but amassing more money

I really do hope he’s defiant and actually goes out on stage, performs his show and absolutely ignores the whole mess.

Why would you use "white power" in your example? Did Macklemore say anything racist? Have you read what he said?