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Conflict in the Middle East

I think a lot of people misunderstand this aspect of the situation re why civilians are staying in Gaza

166 replies

Jane3212 · 08/09/2026 17:33

I've seen quite a few posts on Mumsnet and elsewhere asking why Gazans with dependent children are staying there despite the danger, some speculating that it's due to Hamas brainwashing to stay no matter what danger and become martyrs.

But that completely ignores that the Rafah Crossing for various reasons has been closed from 2024 and is only partially open now. The huge amount of crowdfunding campaigns to get into Egypt suggest to me that a lot of Gazans DO want to leave while the fighting continues, and do want to protect their children. It's not their fault that this is extremely difficult.

OP posts:
Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 08:17

DebbieSavage · 22/09/2026 08:02

I think there is scope for Labour to win back support amongst the Muslim diaspora in the UK by pledging to shelter Palestinian families here, rather than increase the burden on neighbouring countries who have had nothing to do with the whole affair.

And what has UK got to do with it ?
Why is the UK's problem ?
We are £ trillions in debt and you want to being in yet more people to look after?
If you feel like that maybe you would be prepared take a Palestinian family into your home and feed and clothe them?

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 08:11

AmberTigerEyes · 22/09/2026 05:47

Egypt was until 1967 when Israel took Gaza by force. It’s a simple principle, if you take land by force with your military you are then responsible for the inhabitants to include ensuring they don’t end up being ruled by criminal gangs or terror gangs.

Yes and Gaza did very well under Israeli control.
They had irrigation and a flourishing fruit and flower export market.
Israel bowed to international pressure and pulled out of Gaza in 2005 and elections were arranged to form a new legislative Palestinian Council.
That's when Hamas took control.

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 08:06

AmberTigerEyes · 22/09/2026 05:51

The land was set aside by the 1947 UN resolution, the same resolution that gave Israel the authority to come into existence in 1948.

Yes and the land was annexed by Jordan, and they never got taken to task over that.

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 08:04

AmberTigerEyes · 22/09/2026 05:49

The 1967 war was started by Israel by a pre-emptive air strike on Egypt destroying most of their air force as the planes were parked on the ground.

Tensions were rising prior to the 1967 attack.
Egyptian President Gamal Abdel Nasser ordered UN peacekeepers out of the Sinai Peninsula, mobilized troops, and closed the Straits of Tiran to Israeli shipping.
Convinced an Arab attack was imminent following false Soviet intelligence reports, Israel launched a surprise preemptive air assault on June 5.
Israel destroyed most of the Egyptian, Jordanian, and Syrian air forces on the ground within hours, securing total air superiority

DebbieSavage · 22/09/2026 08:02

I think there is scope for Labour to win back support amongst the Muslim diaspora in the UK by pledging to shelter Palestinian families here, rather than increase the burden on neighbouring countries who have had nothing to do with the whole affair.

Serenity75 · 22/09/2026 08:01

Unfortunately since the recent actions of Russia and the US, the UN is irrelevant and we seem to be leaving in a “might us right” world where nobody has the will or the power to implement international laws. Discussing the finer points of UN rules is irrelevant if nobody is able or willing to enforce them or put pressure on Isreal to stop. Isreal is in the wrong (imo), the settlers are in the wrong, hamas was in the wrong, but it doesn’t matter. Isreal were attacked awfully and the lack of restraint from the us has given them a free hit to rid themselves of a threat. It’s not right but it’s probably logical based on the way the world seems to be working now.

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 07:59

Squeezingwildoranges · 22/09/2026 07:26

Palestine is a member state of the UN General assembly. The UN nations formally recognizes Palestine territory as per the pre 1967 borders and is currently occupied territory. This is not debatable, this is a fact.

Who cares what the UN says ? It's just a toothless talking shop.
The United Nations has very little direct, independent power and relies entirely on the political and financial cooperation of its member states.

Squeezingwildoranges · 22/09/2026 07:26

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 02:13

This is incorrect. That land has never belonged to Palestinians.
It was annexed in 1950 and ruled by Jordan after the 1948 Arab/Israeli War.
It was captured by Israel after the 1967 War which was caused by Egypt, Jordan and Syria launching an unprovoked attack on Israel.

Palestine is a member state of the UN General assembly. The UN nations formally recognizes Palestine territory as per the pre 1967 borders and is currently occupied territory. This is not debatable, this is a fact.

Schlossadler · 22/09/2026 06:41

No Islamic or Arab states have accepted mass displacement or permanent relocation of Gazan refugees from the Gaza Strip

AmberTigerEyes · 22/09/2026 05:51

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 02:13

This is incorrect. That land has never belonged to Palestinians.
It was annexed in 1950 and ruled by Jordan after the 1948 Arab/Israeli War.
It was captured by Israel after the 1967 War which was caused by Egypt, Jordan and Syria launching an unprovoked attack on Israel.

The land was set aside by the 1947 UN resolution, the same resolution that gave Israel the authority to come into existence in 1948.

AmberTigerEyes · 22/09/2026 05:49

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 02:13

This is incorrect. That land has never belonged to Palestinians.
It was annexed in 1950 and ruled by Jordan after the 1948 Arab/Israeli War.
It was captured by Israel after the 1967 War which was caused by Egypt, Jordan and Syria launching an unprovoked attack on Israel.

The 1967 war was started by Israel by a pre-emptive air strike on Egypt destroying most of their air force as the planes were parked on the ground.

AmberTigerEyes · 22/09/2026 05:47

Vargas · 21/09/2026 22:40

Surely Egypt could step up and help their fellow Arabs?
Or perhaps they fear Hamas terrorism as much as Israel does?

Egypt was until 1967 when Israel took Gaza by force. It’s a simple principle, if you take land by force with your military you are then responsible for the inhabitants to include ensuring they don’t end up being ruled by criminal gangs or terror gangs.

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 02:13

Squeezingwildoranges · 21/09/2026 22:30

Because, legally, Israel is occupying their land as recognised by the UN General Assembly. Occupiers have a legal responsibility towards the population they are occupying.

This is incorrect. That land has never belonged to Palestinians.
It was annexed in 1950 and ruled by Jordan after the 1948 Arab/Israeli War.
It was captured by Israel after the 1967 War which was caused by Egypt, Jordan and Syria launching an unprovoked attack on Israel.

Tiredtaxpayer · 22/09/2026 01:53

Jane3212 · 08/09/2026 22:58

The best scenario would be spreading them among Egypt, Jordan and the Gulf states until it's safe to return. There's obviously several barriers in the way of that.

Egypt don't want them,

https://www.newarab.com/news/egypt-rejects-european-plans-refugee-camps-return-hubs#:~:text=Egypt%20has%20categorically%20rejected%20a,countries%20south%20of%20the%20Mediterranean.

In July 2025 Arab countries still refused to accept refugees
Jordan’s King Abdullah announced immediately after the October 7 attacks that Jordan and Egypt would not accept refugees from Gaza.
“That is a red line,” he said.
Similarly, Turkey and Qatar, both state sponsors of Hamas, are refusing to take refugees even as both countries express support for the Palestinians. Algeria, Kuwait, and Malaysia are openly siding with Hamas but have not said they would admit refugees.

Steve3742 · 22/09/2026 01:08

Vargas · 21/09/2026 22:40

Surely Egypt could step up and help their fellow Arabs?
Or perhaps they fear Hamas terrorism as much as Israel does?

Or perhaps they don't want a million or so refugees, especially as Israel has openly announced its plans for ethnic cleansing, which means they'd likely be unable to return to Palestine. I don't see us volunteering to accept a million refugees, despite our moral culpability in arming and supporting the genocide.

Steve3742 · 22/09/2026 01:05

Squeezingwildoranges · 21/09/2026 22:30

Because, legally, Israel is occupying their land as recognised by the UN General Assembly. Occupiers have a legal responsibility towards the population they are occupying.

Because they're the ones who have destroyed their homes and are bombing them relentlessly. Of course, it's ridiculous to think that a State committing genocide would live up to its obligations, but as we're talking about it...

Vargas · 21/09/2026 22:40

Surely Egypt could step up and help their fellow Arabs?
Or perhaps they fear Hamas terrorism as much as Israel does?

Squeezingwildoranges · 21/09/2026 22:30

Mumsntfan1 · 21/09/2026 22:04

Why?

Because, legally, Israel is occupying their land as recognised by the UN General Assembly. Occupiers have a legal responsibility towards the population they are occupying.

Mumsntfan1 · 21/09/2026 22:04

Steve3742 · 21/09/2026 19:28

Yep. They're Israel's responsibility.

Why?

Steve3742 · 21/09/2026 19:28

Mumsntfan1 · 21/09/2026 17:52

Israel, the only Jewish state in the world should take in people who want to kill Jews?

Yep. They're Israel's responsibility.

Mumsntfan1 · 21/09/2026 17:52

Steve3742 · 21/09/2026 15:23

Actually, the best scenario would be for Israel to take them. But Israel will never do that, because it is openly talking about the ethnic cleansing of Gaza.

Israel, the only Jewish state in the world should take in people who want to kill Jews?

Steve3742 · 21/09/2026 15:23

Jane3212 · 08/09/2026 22:58

The best scenario would be spreading them among Egypt, Jordan and the Gulf states until it's safe to return. There's obviously several barriers in the way of that.

Actually, the best scenario would be for Israel to take them. But Israel will never do that, because it is openly talking about the ethnic cleansing of Gaza.

titchy · 10/09/2026 22:21

Jane3212 · 08/09/2026 22:58

The best scenario would be spreading them among Egypt, Jordan and the Gulf states until it's safe to return. There's obviously several barriers in the way of that.

Is that you Donald?

Mumsntfan1 · 10/09/2026 21:25

Squeezingwildoranges · 08/09/2026 23:12

How many Palestinians from the 1948 Nakba were allowed to return. None. The Palestinians and everyone else with a brain knows that it would be a one way trip.

How many Jew who left Arab countries in 1948 were allowed to return? None. How many of them are still 'refugees'? None.