Are people still rejoicing about Iran?

Well if Iranians are rejoicing - Putin is too.
Supporters of the war seem quite relaxed about how Russia financially benefits from reduced sanctions and selling weapons and information to Iran.

No because you are just plucking numbers out of the air as far as I can tell.

What survey are you talking about?

I appreciate people putting their views but I don’t see it in the same way.

For these reasons, the people are incredibly oppressed and any resistance to the state which they don’t want is crushed brutally. This means you could have a theocratic state that is no where near representing the people.

You can see protests and the Iranian footballers showing this. It’s this that could be very deep and real for the majority.

It may be that even those controlling the population eg military are not highly theocratic but need to be paid. Break that and you get somewhere, eg Kharg Island and oil revenue.

So appreciate the take but perhaps it’s the opposite, it’s not those countries because the Persian people don’t want what they have for a state. Majority that is.

Yes. I do not know. I have seen the survey that has been posted, but that is flawed.

I think we could take it another way. What % do you think is needed before regime change is forced ? Forced as in boots on the ground and lots of dead soldiers and civilians ?

Personally I would put it at 80%. Because I reckon you will be looking at losing half the regime. So if we put the regime at 20%, we are looking at 10% being killed. So we can say 9 million. That's before just the current government.

Would you agree with that number ?

No one knows the percentage but I'm 100% sure you know that.

Is it normal for thousands of people to risk getting murdered by their government they feel so strongly that they must protest against them knowing the likely outcome?

What % of the 90 million people in Iran want to overthrow the theocratic government there ?

This has already been explained. The war aims to weaken the Iranian regime.

Weakening the regime should theoretically help the people of Iran to overthrow it. No one is saying that would be easy & it may not happen on this occasion. That is in the hands of the Iranian people.

But weakening a religious extremist authoritarian regime that is fixated on killing thousands/millions of people around the world via their proxies - & killing thousands of their own civilians over a few days - that is a good thing.

This post will end up a mish mash of thoughts rather than a logical argument, but here goes.

Iran is a theocracy. That to me is the big issue. It's not like Iraq or Syria which were single party states with a bit of religion. Nor is it like former communist states, again single party, where the change was just political. It's not even like a religious state moving to be secular. Nope, it's a full on theocracy.

With that in mind, then without accurate data on how religious the population is, it's impossible to say how change can happen. Because we can't say for sure what change, if any, is wanted.

And yes, I have seen that survey that is going about. But that survey is flawed, as the survey itself says. Surveys in single party states/ theocracies are very difficult to do. Single party states because such surveys are illegal, and theocracies have the added issue that it will be a "sin".

I reckon the closest country Iran can be compared to is the Vatican.

That would be my starting point as a thought experiment. How to change the Vatican. Does the Vatican want to change, what does it want to change to, is their support for change ?

Will break this post here. Apologies to any Iranians reading this who are angry at my post. No offense intended. And TBH, the voices of ordinary Iranians are missing, for obvious reasons.

This. Times a million...

I don't what utopian ideas you might have OP, but down here in the real world, the majority of us do not wish to die in a nuclear winter. Which is exactly what the mad bastard twelver Shia clerics currently occupying Iran want to inflict on us, all so they can realise their crack-pipe crazy plan to expunge Israel from the map, kill every Israeli, and fulfill their fundamentalist prophecy...

I agree with the first point as plausible that we end up with a worst, wilder regime in Iran.

I do not agree with the second, on the basis that an armed resistance including military commanders could. And Trump did not bother to check, talk or assist the formation of a proper opposition or military coup before he started bombing. And that is not the fault of the rest of the world.

So that is it.

We will have to wait to see what we are left with at the end of this.

@MushMonsterI’m happy to answer but first I wonder if you’ll agree with some basics?

That it’ll be harder to deal with this if the IRGC are just left to develop weapons for the next five to ten years or so

and also that the people can’t get rid of the IRGC alone.

In the real world, it is Trump and Netanyahu who are leading this.
It is them who do not have a change of governing at the top of their list.

Go on, tell me what you would do if you could? I am listening.

I forgot questions marks there!

It’s just deflection. You haven’t answered. Something about Trump and Netanyahu and how people can overthrow a brutal regime alone just because.

Nothing on what to do about a stronger Iran in a few years.

Not really..??!!...

You haven’t so far.

How many times do we have to answer it?

So what? All these posts from you and others amd you can’t answer a basic question.

You could change your record.

I watch Trump on one of his meetings with big oil companies about Venezuela's production. This man televises everything!
They need 100-200 billion to refresh the infraestructure there. I am positive they are getting it from the current market drama. We pay extra for everything, they go "drill baby drill" in Venezuela.

What’s that got to do with believing or not believing whether Trump and Netanyahu were truly trying to make life better for Iranian civilians?

And change the record! You constantly ask the same question to everyone on various threads, even when it’s not relevant to what the poster has said!

Ok but can you see that the people alone can’t get rid of the IRGC?

There were the same claims made about Trump’s action in Venezuela. Any questions regarding the US involvement led to claims that the poster didn’t care about women.
The same will be applied when the US takes action against Cuba.

Trump says he is helping...