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Conflict in the Middle East

Who will be marching against the genocide in Sudan?

35 replies

mids2019 · 03/11/2025 21:44

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/nov/03/blood-spilled-sudan-el-fasher-space-rsf-uae-darfur

Actually a reasonable piece and I am glad the media are moving away from 'no Jews no news' for this. However how many are going to be travelling to London to protest about the horror in this country or does the fact the main antagonists are arab Islamic fundamentalists backed by the UAE mean that we can turn a blind eye?

Blood spilled in Sudan can be seen from space. Nobody can feign ignorance about what’s going on | Nesrine Malik

The massacres carried out by the RSF in El Fasher, Darfur, with the support of its UAE sponsors, will only stop when the international community acts, says Guardian columnist Nesrine Malik

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/nov/03/blood-spilled-sudan-el-fasher-space-rsf-uae-darfur

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HoneyParsnipSoup · 13/12/2025 07:51

Absolutely nobody because there’s no trendy scarves to buy from Amazon, no endorsement from edgy celebrities, no Western loathing and no glamour. Just a load of terrified, desperate people caught up in a situation where their oppressors aren’t Jews or the West.

reallyffspeople · 08/12/2025 07:18

@mids2019really curious about whether you’ve travelled to/organised a march about this?

Ihatetomatoes · 08/12/2025 07:16

"Sarah Champion, chair of the Commons international development select committee, said: “Members received a private briefing on Sudan, at which one of the academics stated: ‘Our low estimate is 60,000 people have been killed there in the last three weeks.’”

In just 3 weeks, a low estimate of 60,000 people massacred. Yet mainly nothing to see here on most news outlets, or an occasional comment.

The UAE don't even appear to be condemned much for passing arms on they've purchased.

ScrollingLeaves · 07/12/2025 23:34

https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2025/dec/05/rsf-massacres-sudanese-city-el-fasher-slaughterhouse-satellite-images

It is monstrous that we are selling arms to the UAE. How is it the government is getting away with lying about it? What is the sophistry they presenting to make it seem they aren’t and how can it be countered? I need to know more to write to my MP if anyone can help with these details.

edited for typo

RSF massacres left Sudanese city ‘a slaughterhouse’, satellite images show

Up to 150,000 residents of El Fasher are missing since North Darfur capital fell to paramilitary Rapid Support Forces

https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2025/dec/05/rsf-massacres-sudanese-city-el-fasher-slaughterhouse-satellite-images

EmeraldShamrock000 · 05/11/2025 07:07

I will/would. I'd happily protest against the violence in Sudan, unfortunately unlike Palestine, the media has no desire to cover the story, it won't get anywhere near the same attention.
People like to hate Israel based on their leader and the underhanded influence it has from the US and other big players.

CrossChecking · 04/11/2025 18:35

MushMonster · 04/11/2025 17:39

I cannot go to London.
But I would sign petitions for action against the selling of arms and the two army groups involved.
Plus I have been giving money to Unicef for Sudan.
But, sadly, I cannot make it to London.

You could write to your government representatives and ask them to stop selling arms to UAE. It is against international law to sell arms where there is reason to believe that they will be diverted or used in war crimes. UK made components have been found in weapons used by forces responsible for the widespread killings of civilians in Sudan despite the fact that the UAE has been a known hub for diversion for years.

Stripes56 · 04/11/2025 18:23

UAE appear worried about the PR consequences of this conflict.

As well as a fight over land and right to resources, I also think that there may be concerns about having a mainly Muslim democracy on the footsteps of UAE and other ME countries.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/nov/04/sudan-rsf-militia-uae-united-arab-emirates

« The UAE had actively undermined the idea of a strong civilian democratic government in Sudan in the aftermath of the popular uprising that led to the downfall of the 30-year, Islamist-aligned dictatorship of Omar al-Bashir in April 2019. »

There are now numerous articles about Sudan in the press - so must be garnering interest.

As criticism grows, is UAE ready to walk away from Sudan’s RSF militia?

After mass killings in El Fasher and four years on from a coup, UAE now admits its Sudan policy has gone wrong

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/nov/04/sudan-rsf-militia-uae-united-arab-emirates

MushMonster · 04/11/2025 17:39

I cannot go to London.
But I would sign petitions for action against the selling of arms and the two army groups involved.
Plus I have been giving money to Unicef for Sudan.
But, sadly, I cannot make it to London.

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2025 17:39

Summerhillsquare · 04/11/2025 17:31

When you can explain Britain's historic responsibility and recent role in the region I will.

Nope not me or mine. Unless you want to take some personal responsibility for it.

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 17:34

mids2019 · 04/11/2025 17:20

I think as the Sudan conflict evolves the BBC like the Guardian should now stop having specific sections on Gaza but have a much broader approach to the Middle East and Africa as there is a he'll of a lot going on (and a lot of it not good).

The horror of Sudan is not going to be picked up by our virtue signaling celebs and literati in my opinion though (I may be proved wrong though)

There is no way you can equate the two conflicts. As I said, one genocide does not negate another.

Summerhillsquare · 04/11/2025 17:31

When you can explain Britain's historic responsibility and recent role in the region I will.

mids2019 · 04/11/2025 17:20

I think as the Sudan conflict evolves the BBC like the Guardian should now stop having specific sections on Gaza but have a much broader approach to the Middle East and Africa as there is a he'll of a lot going on (and a lot of it not good).

The horror of Sudan is not going to be picked up by our virtue signaling celebs and literati in my opinion though (I may be proved wrong though)

OP posts:
quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2025 12:36

SomeWomanSomewhere · 04/11/2025 11:13

I'd agree that the RSF are horrific - not quite sure in what way they sound like Daesh to you, though: Daesh's ideology is explicitly eschatologist and as such religious. RSF are anti-Islamist (hence the UAE backing at least in part) and ethnosupremacist.

I'd agree they're both horrific, just don't really see many other commonalities beyond methods.

Not being goady but can you explain?

True. Their psycho m.o mainly. I see some sources feel that SAF are a Trojan horse for the muslim brotherhood. Do you think Sudan would be more stable or better off under SAF or RSF?
Secular democracy is not on the table as an option it seems.
If you had to pick a side.... could you? Assad's regime was monstrous but stable, is Jolani's better so far?

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 11:34

reem123 · 04/11/2025 11:08

I have no vested interest at all. I am just stating facts. I am not Sudanese I am English. A family member has fostered a Sudanese teen and I have educated myself and listen to the people who’ve lived it or are living there and the facts are the brutality towards the civilians is from the RSF. Our own government have committed war crimes itself, just look at the Iraqi war. Does that put them in the same bracket as the RSF? no it doesn’t.

You do realise if you're getting your perspective from someone who supports one side over the other, you are going to get a very one sided perspective.

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 11:18

reem123 · 04/11/2025 11:08

I have no vested interest at all. I am just stating facts. I am not Sudanese I am English. A family member has fostered a Sudanese teen and I have educated myself and listen to the people who’ve lived it or are living there and the facts are the brutality towards the civilians is from the RSF. Our own government have committed war crimes itself, just look at the Iraqi war. Does that put them in the same bracket as the RSF? no it doesn’t.

From an Iraqi perspective it might.

SomeWomanSomewhere · 04/11/2025 11:13

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2025 09:58

BBC summary of the war.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cjel2nn22z9o
The RSF sound like a reiteration of daesh.
https://www.chathamhouse.org/2025/03/gold-and-war-sudan
UAE is up to it's neck in this and a long way from the fighting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Arab_Emirates
I wonder if the ME has had a glut of pistachios because someone has been trying to make 'Dubai chocolate' a thing.

I'd agree that the RSF are horrific - not quite sure in what way they sound like Daesh to you, though: Daesh's ideology is explicitly eschatologist and as such religious. RSF are anti-Islamist (hence the UAE backing at least in part) and ethnosupremacist.

I'd agree they're both horrific, just don't really see many other commonalities beyond methods.

Not being goady but can you explain?

reem123 · 04/11/2025 11:08

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 09:23

You obviously have a vested interest in who wins this war. I don't as they both seem terrible to me. I will concede that the RSF have committed more war crimes but that doesn't mean the SAF haven't. It's like arguing that Ted Bundy was worse than Jeffrey Dahmer because he killed more people. They were both serial killers.

I have no vested interest at all. I am just stating facts. I am not Sudanese I am English. A family member has fostered a Sudanese teen and I have educated myself and listen to the people who’ve lived it or are living there and the facts are the brutality towards the civilians is from the RSF. Our own government have committed war crimes itself, just look at the Iraqi war. Does that put them in the same bracket as the RSF? no it doesn’t.

Ihatetomatoes · 04/11/2025 10:15

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2025 09:58

BBC summary of the war.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cjel2nn22z9o
The RSF sound like a reiteration of daesh.
https://www.chathamhouse.org/2025/03/gold-and-war-sudan
UAE is up to it's neck in this and a long way from the fighting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Arab_Emirates
I wonder if the ME has had a glut of pistachios because someone has been trying to make 'Dubai chocolate' a thing.

Thanks for sharing.

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2025 09:58

BBC summary of the war.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cjel2nn22z9o
The RSF sound like a reiteration of daesh.
https://www.chathamhouse.org/2025/03/gold-and-war-sudan
UAE is up to it's neck in this and a long way from the fighting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Arab_Emirates
I wonder if the ME has had a glut of pistachios because someone has been trying to make 'Dubai chocolate' a thing.

Displaced women rest, one seen with her head resting on her hand, in the town of Tawila after fleeing el-Fasher following the city's fall to the Rapid Support Forces (RSF) - October 2025.

Sudan war: A simple guide to what is happening

Sudan was thrown into disarray in 2023 when its army and a paramilitary group began a power struggle.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cjel2nn22z9o

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 09:23

reem123 · 04/11/2025 09:14

It is an internationalised civil war with one side receiving funds and weaponry from a very rich country. We have a Sudanese refugee boy living in our family who came over on the boats. We are in contact directly with Sudan. I can assure you that the SAF are not anywhere near as bad as the rebels. They are not mass killing and raping innocent civilians. The RSF are going into areas in Sudan and not leaving anyone alive. They are far worse than the internationally recognised National army.

You obviously have a vested interest in who wins this war. I don't as they both seem terrible to me. I will concede that the RSF have committed more war crimes but that doesn't mean the SAF haven't. It's like arguing that Ted Bundy was worse than Jeffrey Dahmer because he killed more people. They were both serial killers.

reem123 · 04/11/2025 09:14

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 09:07

Name me one civil war where foreign actors haven't been involved for their own benefit. I'm not saying it's right but it is a fact. I also don't think you can qualify one side being better than the other because they have committed less war crimes. War crimes are war crimes. Full stop. Personally, from what I've read, both sides are horrendous and this war is more a civil war between two criminal gangs than it is between genuine political leaders.

It is an internationalised civil war with one side receiving funds and weaponry from a very rich country. We have a Sudanese refugee boy living in our family who came over on the boats. We are in contact directly with Sudan. I can assure you that the SAF are not anywhere near as bad as the rebels. They are not mass killing and raping innocent civilians. The RSF are going into areas in Sudan and not leaving anyone alive. They are far worse than the internationally recognised National army.

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 09:07

reem123 · 04/11/2025 08:55

The crimes and abuses of the RSF far far outweigh the crimes of the national army. The outcry is they are being funded largely by the UAE who have an invested interest in Sudan for its gold and access to the Red Sea. Mass killings, rape, torture, people strung from trees, buried alive is all the work of the RSF. Yes the SAF have committed many crimes but you can’t compare them to the rebels. It’s not just a civil war when it has foreign backing and British weapons are being used in Sudan through our sales to the UAE and Egypt.

Name me one civil war where foreign actors haven't been involved for their own benefit. I'm not saying it's right but it is a fact. I also don't think you can qualify one side being better than the other because they have committed less war crimes. War crimes are war crimes. Full stop. Personally, from what I've read, both sides are horrendous and this war is more a civil war between two criminal gangs than it is between genuine political leaders.

reem123 · 04/11/2025 08:55

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 08:35

One genocide does not negate another. The problem in this case is that, as I have said, both armies are equally matched and both leaders are equally unpalatable.

The crimes and abuses of the RSF far far outweigh the crimes of the national army. The outcry is they are being funded largely by the UAE who have an invested interest in Sudan for its gold and access to the Red Sea. Mass killings, rape, torture, people strung from trees, buried alive is all the work of the RSF. Yes the SAF have committed many crimes but you can’t compare them to the rebels. It’s not just a civil war when it has foreign backing and British weapons are being used in Sudan through our sales to the UAE and Egypt.

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2025 08:43

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 08:35

One genocide does not negate another. The problem in this case is that, as I have said, both armies are equally matched and both leaders are equally unpalatable.

Rather like the Syrian civil war, or many other middle eastern wars.
What a good thing the that the Israel/Palestine issue has such well defined goodies and baddies. Or maybe more pr.

Thedawnchorus · 04/11/2025 08:35

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2025 08:29

From what I've read. Middle eastern powers are backing the armies in a bid to get a 'government' sympathetic to them and access to Sudan's resources. This 'civil' war has middle eastern backers exerting a form of colonialism.
TBF Saudi and Egypt are neighbouring countries, so understandably don't want war and caliphatic Islamism on their doorsteps.
Sudanese Arabs are apparently incredibly racist to African Sudanese.
Iran and Russia are involved. Western allies are involved.
There is both genocide by intent, and famine. There are horrific war crimes, millions of displaced people, over a hundred thousand deaths, often brutally up close.

But there is more outrage against an Israeli calling someone a witch (sometimes a badge of honour on the fwr board) on this board. Go figure.

One genocide does not negate another. The problem in this case is that, as I have said, both armies are equally matched and both leaders are equally unpalatable.