How will carrying out "powerful strikes " on Gaza help to get the bodies back?

It wasn't that they couldn't find the bodies.

It was that they already had the body, hadn't returned it, hid it, then pretended to find it.

Completely different scenario.

Is there anything that Hamas could do that would in your opinion justify restarting the war?

It remains to be seen whether Netanyahu’s swift retaliation will have been effective or not in sending a message to Hamas not to keep fucking around.

I agree with you that Hamas don’t care about the dead children.

I think they might take notice though that Trump couldn’t or didn’t stop the retaliation. I think they were starting to test the boundaries of what they could get away with, knowing that Trump is proud of the ceasefire.

I don’t understand the logic of the dead children was to dodge a trial @Martymcfly24

The pause in the ceasefire can only delay not dodge the trial.

I do agree that sometimes it will take time & specialist equipment to recover dead bodies though the lack of trust in Hamas makes it hard to say how many more they could have released if they were actually operating in good faith.

The retaliation in case you missed it was for the fact Hamas staged a fake discovery and return of a dead hostage.

And they killed some IDF soldiers who were behind the yellow line.

But if airstrikes haven't worked to show Hamas Israels intentions and change their behavior in the previous two years why did Netanyahu think last night would be any different?

Hamas do not care about the 22 dead Palestinian children. It didn't care about the 20,000 children in the previous 24 months so why would last night be different.

To be honest I think that @BelleHathor had the correct idea on the first page. This was a way to dodge the trial. That was what those children died for

Then you must agree that sometimes you cannot recover dead bodies in millions of tonnes of rubble. And you must agree that you cannot kill children in retaliation for not finding those bodies. Alive children are more worthy than recovering dead bodies.

If you agree that wars are sometimes necessary then you agree that sometimes civilian deaths must happen in wars.

@Everexpanding you also accept that civilian deaths must happen if you agree with any wars around the world.

Why say shame on me when I said it is a horrible phrase used by soldiers in a war zone. I'm pretty sure Hamas fighters will also think in terms of collateral damage though unusually, they seem to apply the same sentiment to their own children and adults as well as the other sides.

So just civilian deaths then

No I have never defended the Israel government's decisions to block humanitarian aid, either on previous occasions or now.

Unlike some on the pro Pal side, I can criticise both sides when I feel it is warranted despite overall supporting Israel.

I don't defend the Settlers and I don't defend blocking humanitarian aid and have always made this very clear.

Collateral damage : a euphemism that dehumanizes non-combatants and minimizes the responsibility of military leaders for civilian casualties.

Shame on you

The purpose of the airstrikes would have been to show Hamas they had exceeded the limits of what Israel would tolerate, and to kill some militants.

It's a horrible phrase and I don't mean to minimise that children were killed alongside Hamas fighters but to soldiers in a war situation, I believe civilian deaths are referred to as "collateral damage".

@Twiglets1 Israel has recently blocked a shipment of aid containing children’s clothing from entering Gaza, with winter approaching can you justify this along with all your other justifications of their actions??? The children last night did not “get killed” they were killed by Israel, their deaths are not justifiable

How is killing 22 children ( 81 people altogether) getting back at Hamas for breaking the ceasefire? Hamas have clearly shown they have no regard for the lives of Palestinians so what was the purpose of the airstrikes except to attack civilians.

Yes the IDF carried out air strikes last night in which children got killed. But only after Hamas shot at IDF soldiers behind the yellow line and staged the discovery of a hostage's remains. That children got killed we can all agree is awful - as always we disagree on who is ultimately responsible for the truce ending.

The Red Cross tries to be completely neutral and not take sides but even they said the hostage show was "unacceptable" and the "return of remains to loved ones must not be politicized".

Yet surprise, surprise....not one of the pro Pals on MN have criticised Hamas for this as all you want to do is act as though Hamas don't exist and Israel just decided to attack again for no reason whatsoever.

How is talking about personal responsibility creating a “blissful vacuum” for terrorists?

Hamas are absolutely responsible for all of their choices. I would be delighted if Israel wiped Hamas from the face of the map, for the sake of the Palestinians as much as the Israelis. That would be holding them accountable. Sadly, Israel seem to be incapable of this and instead continue to slaughter innocent people and children.

What disgusts me is the cost of innocent human life in this conflict. Israel is not “holding Hamas to account” by killing tens of thousands of innocent people and levelling Palestine. I have no idea what they are hoping to achieve by striking a family home.

Only one side killed 22 children last night

The IDF are not denying responsibility for the people that got killed in the air strikes yesterday @BelleHathor but soldiers in an army do have to follow orders, not just in the IDF but around the world.

Your views are muddled if you think large numbers of young Americans who rightly don't want to be associated with killing children are about to deny the Holocaust which unsurprisingly was associated with killing children.

There are always extremist nutcases who gain followings ... the trick is not to become part of the following or start thinking they may have a valid point. I wouldn't even be giving them publicity by naming them in case that attracts more interest in their abhorrent views.

Of course Israel are responsible for their own actions.

Israel carried out strikes because of the blatant breach of conditions, Hamas not returning a body that they were supposed to return.

Are Hamas responsible for the choice they took in doing this? What was to be gained by Hamas doing this? Did Hamas know they were doing this when they were shoveling dirt over the remains? Why are they not responsible for the consequences of those freely taken actions?

Again. My 10 year old wants to know how to exist in this blissful vacuum you've created for terrorists?

I agree the US will not withdraw support for Israel.

The ceasefire will keep failing and people dying until enough pressure is put on both sides to keep to it.

Hamas did not kill 22 Palestinian children last night, the IDF ordered by Netanyahu did. There were famous trials last century where the defence of "We were just following orders" failed spectacularly.

Ignore it at your own peril, but studies show than Gen Z in America are increasingly turning away from both political parties as they see them as to beholden to lobbies that advocate for Israel. Young Americans don't want to be associated with killing children. The worrying trend on the right is that they're turning to influencers like Nick Fuentes who fully advocates for why the Germans had to do what they did. His latest interview has had over 3 million views in less than 48 hours.

Are Hamas responsible for their own actions?

Starting this particular war with the murders and rapes of mainly civilians?

Making a mockery of the hostage releases on several occasions?

I said, why are you leaving Hamas out of this?

It's a forum of Mums fgs. We all want the killing to stop. Do you honestly think theres a bunch of us who enjoy seeing innocent people killed?

Well the comment was addressed to @dairydebris not me.

But it just looks like @Irenesortof has answered a question with a question to avoid answering why they are writing Hamas out of their narrative

Until the US withdraws support for Israel there will not be an end to this absolute carnage. There's little chance of that happening. At least 20 children killed overnight. Ceasefire? What ceasefire?