Feel like once the hostages are handed over Israel will start bombing again

When Trump and Netanyahu are in favour of something, you know it’ll never go well for ordinary people.

Anyone got any links to Hamas threatening gazans?

Hamas have permission from Trump to do this apparently.

Strangely enough, I don't have access to the list of approximately 1,700 innocent people that have not even been charged with an offence that have been held by Israel that are being released today.

That's in addition to the ones that have been convicted of offences by a court system that would not be judged as fair in the UK.

But the 1700 are legally innocent. Their stats as detainees under administrative detention is evidence of that. I don't need to prove their guilt or prove their suspicion, heck, even Israel hasn't bothered to do that, it's just kept them locked up.

So which person can you name whos being held by Israel despite not being suspected of a crime?

Or is that your assumption?

I can name people held by Israel who are suspected / convicted of crimes. You can Google it.

Some guilty. Some not. You are not in a position to judge which is these detainees is innocent and illegally detained, and which are guilty. Neither am I, and I wouldn't presume to do so.

Whereas every single one of those hostages taken by Hamas is 100% innocent and not accused of anything at all.

Not the same group.

Honestly im not getting into it anymore with you. I know your opinions. I just hope others can see the difference.

Bring them home today! 🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗

Poor sods.

Of course they won't. They've never called for Hamas to go. Now Hamas are killing anyone who they think is against them. Sadly, good Palestinian people who want Hamas gone are likely to be executed by Hamas who want to stay in charge. Hamas dont want good things, peace, and their people to prosper like Israel they only do hatred and killing.

This wasn't just a conversation about prisoners of war, and I've not mentioned that term at all.

The idea that these are people being held (without charge) because they're under suspicion of offences is just fanciful. You might hope that that's the reason for them being kidnapped, but you've got no evidence of it. If they were suspected of committing offences then they should be bought before an independent court. So legally, these are innocent people that have been kidnapped by the IDF.

Nah. He'll talk tough but continue to support militarily and politically while bragging about how great he is.

This is why the Palestinian people need Hamas gone with an international (perhaps Arab countries peace keeping force) to keep order. Palestinians are now killing each other. If only the innocents could be moved out of the way whilst Hamas and other gangs fight. Its an awful situation.

There is a leadership vacuum and Hamas want to keep power.

This. Hope it holds.

'Words have meaning' and some people think that the word hostage applies to some Palestinian detainees under International law.

Explaining why she calls many Palestinians in Israeli custody hostages, Albanese says:
“They are often unlawfully seized and detained, although they are uninvolved civilians. They are used by Israel to compel the Palestinians as a whole to act in a given way or to refrain from acting. The ultimate goal is to curb the possibility for the Palestinians to resist.
“They are hostages because they are persons uninvolved. They are uninvolved in situations of combat and unlawfully seized and detained as part of Israel's expectation to push the Palestinians to do or not to do (something), to leave, ultimately, the occupied Palestinian territory.”
While the Israeli authorities don’t issue explicit demands in the same way that Hamas did in relation to their hostages, international law does not require there to be an overt demand in order for captives to be seen as hostages.
As defined in the International Convention against the Taking of Hostages, the crime can be committed in order to compel another party “to do or abstain from doing any act as an explicit or implicit condition for the release of the hostage”.
“It doesn't need to be that explicit,” says Albanese.

Well said @dairydebris

Exactly.

As always, theres enough to criticize using correct words- no need to twist meanings to make a point.

Excellent post @dairydebris.

As it happens, I really loathe internment. But it would be as arrogant as it is thick to imagine one's personal view on an unrelated matter has any bearing on the definition of what a POW is.

The detainees / hostages comparison pops up regularly on here, shamefully enough.

The vast majority of posters agree that extended administrative detention of detainees by Israel is deeply problematic. Contrary to what you say theres often acknowledgement and criticism. Ive seen it many times and taken part in it many times.

However, detainees are not hostages. Words have meanings.

Detainees/ unlawful detainees- people who have been taken on suspicion of committing crimes. Feel free to criticize. Some will be guilty, some will not. Not a homogeneous group.

Hostages- all completely innocent and taken with intent to hold as security for a specific reason not connected to them personally. All completely innocent is the key factor.

Please can we use words correctly, otherwise how can we sensibly talk?

🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗🎗

Because it was a post specifically relating to the legal definition of a POW. None of the things you've mentioned, even taking your argument at absolute highest, have any influence whatsoever on that. They just don't. This isn't a matter of opinion.

There are also lots of things you've not mentioned in your post, but it would be equally idiotic to try and crowbar those into a discussion about the legal definition of a POW that they do not in any way affect.

So in summary, the people who think the legal definition applies to the hostages currently and previously held by Hamas are wrong.

No, but as usual there's absolutely no acknowledgement that Israel have captured
and held thousands, including children without trial or charge.

No acknowledgement
No criticism of it.
No delight in their release.
No criticism of Israel's decision to throw parties and celebrations for the hostages returning, whilst warming Palestinians that they are forbidden from doing the same.

At least one guy was due to be returned to his family in the west bank, now will be dumped in Gaza instead. Another was due to come home to the West Bank, then was told he'd be exiled. His family was denied exit permits to go and see him. Because Israel control every aspect of the Palestinians lived.

Perhaps, although there's never been a time when the majority of hostages held by Hamas were soldiers, so that's something she really ought to have been clear about. But either way, there are requirements set out in the Geneva Convention that haven't been met.

That poster said But then some might argue that the hostages that Hamas has aren’t hostages but prisoners of war. so I would presume she is talking about the hostages that they have now, the soldiers.

Do you think Israel having held people without trial means Kfir Bibas in fact did meet the legal definition of a POW then? If so, I have some unfortunate news about how that works.

POW isn't a term you can use because you happen to like or not like one of the parties involved. It has a meaning. If you find that meaning inconvenient, the option is there to stay away from posts explaining that people who misuse it are stupid.

And the innocent Palestinians that gave been kidnapped and held by Israel? Including kids.

As a point of fact, prisoner of war has a definition set out in the Geneva Convention. None of the hostages held by Hamas meet that, even the small minority who are military. I'll pay you the possibly undeserved compliment of assuming you mean them rather than, say, Kfir Bibas.

So no doubt some are arguing that, through either genuine ignorance and bad faith, but they're wrong.

Just to add that some of those Palestinians that are being released today are also hostages.

I’m sure people will argue that they aren’t hostages and how dare I compare. But then some might argue that the hostages that Hamas has aren’t hostages but prisoners of war.

But here’s hoping for lasting peace but I doubt it will happen. Wonder what the argument for the pro Israelis across this board will be then.

You post doesn’t have anything to do with what I had written.

I asked what Israeli man was being referred to in the sane paragraph as a Syrian refugee being stabbed. There was no Israeli man involved with this.

I pointed out that Palestinians were now killing each other. Apparently Hamas wanted to use a building do they shot the family inside it.at first it reported 47 dead, now just saying in excess of 26.