Israel committing genocide in Gaza, world’s top scholars on the crime say

Do you have a link with actual access to the article, not just the headline?

direct orders given to IDF troops etc. That is intent.

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-06-27/ty-article-magazine/.premium/idf-soldiers-ordered-to-shoot-deliberately-at-unarmed-gazans-waiting-for-humanitarian-aid/00000197-ad8e-de01-a39f-ffbe33780000

Gosh, what a weak response.

Lol.

Actually, what’s happening in Gaza is not comparable to “private discussions” in WWII or Rwanda.

Again, these discussions weren’t “private”; they were your typical Government meetings discussing Government policy I.e. the extermination of the Jewish people or the Tutsi’s.

We are seeing public statements from multiple senior Israeli officials- Smotrich, Ben-Gvir, Gallant, Amichay Eliyahu, Vaturi- openly talking about starving 2 million people, erasing Gaza, bombing food and aid depots, and suggesting that there are “no uninvolved civilians.” These are not private musings; they’re published and reported. One can only imagine what they say behind closed doors!

This doesn’t meet the criteria for proving intent.

These are simply comments made by ministers who are not involved in the decision making process of the war. These comments don’t reflect Government policy that is being discussed and implemented.

It only matters what they are saying in public or behind closed doors, if these conversations are informing Goverment policy.

Meanwhile, the West Bank looks different because Israel has not implemented the same level of siege, starvation, and mass destruction there: yet. Annexation plans are being floated, but right now Gaza is experiencing complete blockade, destruction of neighborhoods, hospitals, schools, and daily civilian deaths.

The West Bank looks different because it did not carry out the 7/10 attack, and therefore Israel has no reason to go to war with the West Bank in the way it has with Gaza. Sure, Israel does have to deal with terrorism from the West Bank, but not on the scale of 7/10. No country has seen a terrorist attack on that scale before. It was rather unprecedented.

Intent to commit genocide doesn’t only exist on paper or in “minutes of meetings.” It can be inferred from the repeated, systematic, publicly stated targeting of a civilian population, coupled with actions that make survival impossible.

Inferring intent, rather than having actual evidence of intent, is an extremely high threshold to meet especially given the way Hamas have chosen to conduct the war with regards to their civilian population. Having actual evidence of intent, I.e. minutes of Government meetings, direct orders given etc would be essential.

Waiting to see if the West Bank suffers the same fate doesn’t negate what’s happening now. This isn’t speculation- it’s documented public intent combined with the ongoing mass killing and starvation of civilians.

If Israel intended to commit genocide of the Palestinian people, the West Bank wouldn’t be spared the same fate as Gaza.

Yet, it has.

Shhh. We just ignore those ones, those ones are brushed off as unimportant. So what if the minister for defence says genocidal things, hes just the minister for defence he doesn't actually count or something like that. So what if their Prime minister babbles on about the Amalek before displacing pretty much every Palestinian and then starving them he's just kidding around. What we should really be concerned about are people on boats trying to bring aid into Gaza and football matches displaying signs saying 'Stop killing children', they are the bad guys here.

Gaza's 2025 population is now estimated at 823,407. In 1950, the population of Gaza was 63,444. Gaza has grown by 22,771 in the last year, which represents a 2.84% annual change.These population estimates and projections come from the latest revision of the UN World Urbanization Prospects. These estimates represent the Urban agglomeration of Gaza, which typically includes Gaza's population in addition to adjacent suburban areas.

Gosh, what a weak response.

Actually, what’s happening in Gaza is not comparable to “private discussions” in WWII or Rwanda. We are seeing public statements from multiple senior Israeli officials- Smotrich, Ben-Gvir, Gallant, Amichay Eliyahu, Vaturi- openly talking about starving 2 million people, erasing Gaza, bombing food and aid depots, and suggesting that there are “no uninvolved civilians.” These are not private musings; they’re published and reported. One can only imagine what they say behind closed doors!

Meanwhile, the West Bank looks different because Israel has not implemented the same level of siege, starvation, and mass destruction there: yet. Annexation plans are being floated, but right now Gaza is experiencing complete blockade, destruction of neighborhoods, hospitals, schools, and daily civilian deaths.

Intent to commit genocide doesn’t only exist on paper or in “minutes of meetings.” It can be inferred from the repeated, systematic, publicly stated targeting of a civilian population, coupled with actions that make survival impossible. Waiting to see if the West Bank suffers the same fate doesn’t negate what’s happening now. This isn’t speculation- it’s documented public intent combined with the ongoing mass killing and starvation of civilians.

So it was discussed in private at a senior level?

No - I don’t think you quite get what I’m saying.

This was NOT discussed in private. This was Government policy - it was planned and implemented. That is intent to commit genocide.

As I said - not broadcast to the world openly.

What was happening to Jewish people during WW2 wasn’t a secret.

Nor was the mass slaughter of Tutsi’s in Rwanda.

Intent to commit genocide is clear - Minutes of meetings discussing the extermination of Palestinians, direct orders given to IDF troops etc. That is intent.

What isn’t intent to commit genocide, are comments made by ministers who have no decision making powers in the war.

If so, why are we not seeing what is happening in Gaza happen in the West Bank?

Let’s see what the WB looks like in a few months (in light of Smotrich’s quotes). There’s already talk of annexing most of it. Have a google and see for yourself.

Let’s wait and see isn’t a good enough answer.

No country in Europe was a place of safety for Jewish people during WW2.

Why we aren’t seeing in the West Bank what we are seeing in Gaza has a very straightforward answer - because there is no genocide of Palestinian people happening, and the war in Gaza is a direct response to 7/10 and years of documentation planning a genocide of Palestinians simply does not exist.

Changing the subject slightly here...(but of course, it's a bloody genocide) I just wanted to say I heard about the shindig below on the Off Air with Jane and Fi podcast and I was appalled because they are going and I kind of like(d) them.

Mumsnet is apparently being treated to a glitzy reception in Downing Street shortly to mark its 25th Anniversary. In the same week and in the same building where Starmer is set to be entertaining Israel's genocide-supporting president. I dearly hope that if members of the present Government are present that one or two guests might take it upon themselves to challenge any ministers present about its complicity with Israel and specifically, since we are dealing with Mumsnet here - the IDF's deliberate targeting and continuing murder of Palestinian children. I wouldn't want to set foot in Downing Street right now, so please, somebody, make the most of it. Perhaps Jane and Fi could have a go. (Unlikely).

The Nazi’s had many, many meetings with officials and officers at senior levels discussing the implementation of the final solution. It was well documented.

So it was discussed in private at a senior level? As I said - not broadcast to the world openly.

In Rwanda, documentation showed that the genocide had been planned for 4 years. In additional, instructions were given over radio broadcasts to kill.

Again, are these not private meetings that we now know about because of the benefit of time? I’m sure a lot will one day come out about what is happening in Gaza. Sadly, we don’t have the info now.

Hamas planned 7/10 - a genocide - and no one knew. Without hindsight, it’s hard to spot these things until it’s too late.

Genocide is a very specific act, which is planned. It’s not just deaths in war.
This we can agree on - there are different ways of going about this terrible aim though.

You think BN, Government officials and IDF officers are actually sitting down, discussing, planning and implementing the extermination of Palestinians?

Smotrich (Finance minister)

• Wants to “erase the Palestinian state” by “correcting” Israel’s withdrawal from the Gaza Strip and the northern West Bank during the 2005 Disengagement.
• “The people of Israel are correcting the sin of Gaza,” he said, referring to the push among settler activists to reestablish the Gush Katif settlement bloc
• “Gaza will be entirely destroyed, civilians will be sent to... the south to a humanitarian zone without Hamas or terrorism, and from there they will start to leave in great numbers to third countries”
• “No one in the world will allow us to starve 2 million people, even though it might be justified and moral in order to free the hostages.“
• “not even a grain of wheat” should be allowed into Gaza.
• re settler development in the West Bank: “This reality finally buries the idea of a Palestinian state, because there is nothing to recognise and no one to recognise.”

Defense Minister Yoav Gallant

• Israel was “fighting human animals,” in announcing a complete siege on Gaza.
• “I have ordered a complete siege on the Gaza Strip. There will be no electricity, no food, no fuel, everything is closed,”

Deputy Knesset speaker Nissim Vaturi

• Israelis had one common goal, “erasing the Gaza Strip from the face of the earth.”

Israeli Heritage Minister Amichay Eliyahu

• suggested that Israel drop a nuclear bomb on Gaza and said there were “no uninvolved civilians” in the territory.

Ben-Gvir - National Security Minister

• Talking about the US: “They expressed support for my very clear position on how to act in Gaza and that the food and aid depots should be bombed in order to create military and political pressure to bring our hostages home safely,”
• said the resumption of aid deliveries into Gaza was a “serious and grave mistake.”

These are a selection of things that have been shared publicly. There are many more examples but there’s only so much hatred I can take in one go. I would hate to think what is said in private meetings about what they’d like to do in Gaza and the WB

If so, why are we not seeing what is happening in Gaza happen in the West Bank?
Let’s see what the WB looks like in a few months (in light of Smotrich’s quotes). There’s already talk of annexing most of it. Have a google and see for yourself.

It’s not even hard to find quotes from Israeli government showing intent.

Exactly

Are we just going to ignore the 60,000+ civilians killed? Genocide isn’t about wiping out every last person- it’s about the intent to destroy a group in whole or in part. Killing tens of thousands, starving millions, bombing “safe zones,” and blocking aid fits the legal criteria far more than pointing to a static population figure does.

Yes I thought that was a bizarre comment Hamas and Iran are pretyy clear what they would like to do too.

No one tends to say “we’re going to commit genocide” - intent is never easy to find because there will always be multiple motives in war.

You’re joking, right?

The Nazi’s had many, many meetings with officials and officers at senior levels discussing the implementation of the final solution. It was well documented.

In Rwanda, documentation showed that the genocide had been planned for 4 years. In additional, instructions were given over radio broadcasts to kill.

Genocide is a very specific act, which is planned. It’s not just deaths in war.

You think BN, Government officials and IDF officers are actually sitting down, discussing, planning and implementing the extermination of Palestinians?

If so, why are we not seeing what is happening in Gaza happen in the West Bank?

The ICJ haven’t concluded anything. They’ve given Israel pretty strict guidelines re allowing aid into Gaza though (amongst other things. The case probably won’t conclude for a couple of years, at least. So that’s not enough reason to stop worrying.

I’ve written similar elsewhere but Israel would lose all respect/credibility if they just nuked Gaza. Their economy would tank. Their reputation would be destroyed. No one tends to say “we’re going to commit genocide” - intent is never easy to find because there will always be multiple motives in war. But starving a population, flattening Gaza and displacing almost its entire population, systematically destroying medical infrastructure, militarising aid: none of that suggests the current Israeli government have any regard for civilians in Gaza. Whether that’ll be legally confirmed as genocide, we shall see, but it should cause concern/outrage.

The definition of genocide is 'the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group.'
I understand that the International Court of Justice says Israel is not committing genocide.
If Israel wanted to eliminate Gazans, they could easily have done that by now.
Israel's stated aim is to eliminate Hamas, not Gazans. Hamas' stated aim is to eliminate Israel.

I find this statement disappointing to be honest. The ICJ proceeding are ongoing, with Israel submitting a response/evidence by Jan 26 (they asked for an extension I think). Referring to the proceedings as some sort of proof of lack of genocide doesn’t seem right when they haven’t actually concluded. I understand the ‘innocent until proven guilty’ idea but there’s no real consequence to Israel continuing as is and risking more innocent lives (including the poor hostages).

I worry that we’ll look back and realise the law could and should’ve been used to save many people’s lives rather than retrospectively confirm what a lot of people were worried about.

Yesterday, it seemed there was once again a possibility of a ceasefire. Today the IDF bombed the negotiators. What a surprise? The devil works hard, but not as hard as Netanyahu.

Its a genocide. One that Netanyahu will continue at any cost. One that he will go to any lengths to continuously sabotage any ceasefire deals. Because if a deal goes through he can't continue his genocide of the Palestinians.

Yes, it’s an ugly war (started by Hamas) but it’s never been a genocide. I’m glad the UK government has now acknowledged that.

I didn’t realise they were able to do a mid-war census to check the population. Where are the results online? Or at least a reliable death count so we know how the 2m might’ve been reduced during the conflict.