Gazan GHF workers left to die at hospital where Doctors Without Borders is.

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Clearly, it seems the GHF and umming and ahhing about whether or not there's famine and genocide and illegal displacement taking place, are more important topics to discuss.

I believe my post about 6 million semitic people in the middle east (the large majority civilians) being murdered since 2003 was taken down.

So much has been fabricated and protected at all costs to support apartheid and the myths of the middle east and west's interests there.

Of which I've mentioned - the middle east and the conflict in Palestine-Israel.
You have to acknowledge that the media (not just the Daily Fail) are dubious.

Thanks for the tip, though. I don't think starting a thread will help if no one will listen IRL.

@CrimsonGlaze you seem to be upset and want to get things off your chest re the UK, our attitude to immigrants and the Daily Mail.

With respect, I think you should start a separate thread about these issues because this board is about conflict in the middle east.

@Twiglets1 👆

For now. It seems alt-right views are being not only tolerated, but celebrated too.

'1.3 million benefit claimants are immigrants' was the recent headline in the right wing press (The Daily Mail is the most read newspaper in the UK). Failing to mention that three quarters of those are EU passport holders, British tax payers, who were permitted to stay here in the run up to the day of Brexit.

There was also great deal of focus on the immigrant paedophiles who raped a 13 year old. There were however no articles on the prevalence of paedophilia, the epidemic of domestic violence against, or rape of adult females from white British males.

There were no reports on fervent supporters and funders of the Trump administration lobbying to lower the age of consent to 14.

There were no reports on the Epstein files and the damning footage, the 40 sex allegations against the fascist, the many felonies he's been accused of. No reports on the fact that UK citizens who dare criticise the man or his policies will not be allowed entry to the US. No reports on how the Trump campaign and subsequent administration have been funded by two evangelical pastors who are multi - billionaire oil tycoons.

How can you even trust the Daily Mail? The British mainstream media? The news channels? On anything, including the lack of coverage and factual reporting of the genocide. They're owned by fascists.

#silenceiscomplicity

By the way, H..a..*s was started by Net the Child killer. Ex Israeli PMs say so, ex soldiers too. I look forward to all these people testifying against him when he stands trial for war crimes at the Hague.

The UK is actually a very liberal country with good values.

Democracy
The rule of law
Individual liberty
Mutual respect
Tolerance of those of different faiths and beliefs.

I am an immigrant woman. Delete me, if you wish @MNHQ who's been traumatised by xenophobes and misogynists. Hatred is tolerated in the UK!

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Yes I agree that for those of us who are debating in good faith it does come down to personal opinion about what can or cannot be "justified".

I defend Israel a lot on MN but even I believe their response is disproportionate and I can criticise them for various things they've done I don't agree with, like the settlements and blockading aid when they did.

But ultimately, I guess I do think the war is the price that has to be paid to defeat Hamas. Hamas leaving Gaza would be the best thing for both Israelis and Gazans, as long as they get less extreme leaders to replace them.

I'm also not sure everyone who posts on here is anti Hamas btw. Some seem happy to spread Hamas lies and propaganda and never really criticise them. There are people who don't seem to be posting in good faith (not you of course).

Apology accepted. I can understand the frustration. I can also understand the frustration at air drops being used over other means as NGOs seem to suggest they’re not particularly efficient. Or the frustration with Israel’s tactics and some of their politicians’ views. I guess that’s why I may come across negative too - it’s all frustrating and upsetting.

I’m not saying it’s all absolutely justified but I think Israel get a lot of attention because the things they are getting ‘wrong’ are clearly causing so much harm. Widespread bombing, displacement of millions, stopping aid then limiting it, denying starvation against all the evidence from NGOs and medics, all in the name of stopping Hamas. Not to mention encouraging settlements and the horrendous things that have been said about Gaza.

I know we’ve discussed the idea of something being ‘justified’ before and I think that’s where a lot of people are split. A lot people, including myself, think that what the Israeli government are doing is causing too harm to civilians. Plenty of other people believe that it’s the price that has to be paid to defeat Hamas. I think pro-Palestinian people are trying to help vocalise the desperate situation for Palestinian people. They’re no pro- Hamas. They’re not saying Hamas should triumph over Israel. They understand that Hamas is a terrorist group and expect nothing more than terrible actions. They accept that Hamas need to go. But Israel’s also causing a lot of suffering. They have played a role in where we are now (long before 7/10) and have to be held accountable for their actions during the war. International law isn’t working, outcry from leaders isn’t working, so we have to keep reminding them that people are watching (in horror) at what is happening.

@PinkBobby Apologies for my tone. I get a little frustrated by the unrelenting remarks about what Israel is doing wrong - even when they are apparently trying to do a good thing like enabling aid drops - while most people seem to place no pressure whatsoever on what Hamas could do to help the situation.

Hamas could agree to the terms Israel are asked for. That is the thing (probably the only thing) that could stop the IDF taking Gaza city.

You said yesterday "Hamas surrendering tomorrow doesn’t really end this conflict" which of course it wouldn't overnight but it would be a big positive step. The things you mention like displacing 2 million people - that wouldn't happen. The world would be watching Israel very closely to see that they fulfilled their part of the ceasefire, even Trump would insist upon it.

All the horrible things that have happened in this war have been so avoidable. People need to stop letting Hamas off the hook by focusing all their energies on Israel while acting like Hamas are the invisible man (invisible terrorist group).

I’ll ignore the disappointing snide comment and reiterate that I don’t believe Hamas will surrender in the coming weeks so I don’t see that as a realistic positive that could happen in the coming months. It’s like me saying maybe the right wing government members will step down and Israel will be able to take a more moderate approach. Or the settlers in the WB will release that they are acting illegally and move back to Israel. Or Israel will flood Gaza with aid this week and stop widespread bombing. Lovely to think about and wish for but, in my opinion, totally unrealistic. The point, for me, is to think about what might actually happen not what I want to happen. As I said, call me negative but so far the war hasn’t exactly filled me with positivity.

And, to be clear re the coming weeks, they’re already bombing Gaza City. The date for people to clear out, as far as I can tell from the news, is when they will start a full ground operation. But the damage has already started. And it looks like people are already dying/being injured. You can’t bomb a densely populated area and not affect civilians too.

And even if all the innocent people decide to move (which means families walking for who knows how long with old, young and injured people) and people aren’t killed in the bombing and then the siege, displacing 2 million people once again after two years of conflict and losing their homes isn’t a win. Especially when the support, aid and shelter they are being promised hasn’t exactly been forthcoming throughout the conflict.

So again, call me negative but I personally think I’m just describing the situation as is it and trying to work out what realistically might happen next. I don’t see any point in false positivity when so many people are suffering.

Oh you got there in the end. Hamas could surrender to save Gaza city from being destroyed by the IDF.

The unrealistic (in my opinion) answer is that Hamas could surrender. But I think it’s extremely unlikely. It is more likely that they will fight until the bitter end because they have nothing to lose at this point. I think it is sadly inevitable that Gaza City will be taken - that is my opinion and I would be relieved to hear that that isn’t going to be the case.

And again, even if Gaza City can be ‘saved’, I think there’s enough pain and suffering for me to feel extremely negative about the situation overall. I’m sorry my negativity is frustrating or annoying but I just don’t see much hope left in this conflict. For the Palestinians, for the hostages and their families, for families of IDF soldiers. Perhaps I am too cynical / too negative - I don’t mind that criticism. As I said, I would be very relieved if that turns out to be the case.

It’s not inevitable that Gaza City will be taken though is it?

What do you think could be done to stop the IDF taking Gaza city?

I’m struggling to think of realistic positive steps in the coming months as there is going to be another escalation in violence as Gaza City is taken.

I agree with you about the Israel elections but they won’t happen until October 2026 at the earliest. And very likely wouldn’t happen even then unless the war is over by then.

What would you see as a positive first step over the next few months?

I think the best chance the Palestinians have is if the Israelis vote for chance in the 2026 elections and take the power away from the right wing elements of govt. They have a disproportionate amount of power at the moment and are the ones pushing hatred - the things they have said about Gaza and Palestine have been shared enough to make it clear that they see no future for Palestinians in Gaza. But an election could go either way - I know the protests are getting bigger but I don’t know if enough Israeli people are interested in moderate views at this time. This ain’t me saying all Israelis are extremists. I just don’t know enough about their views at the moment as there’s a lot of contradictory info. But ultimately, I think the make-up of the Israeli government will be instrumental in determining who Palestine is rebuilt for - refugees or settlers.

Another huge element will be who helps the Palestinians set up a new government. Recent history suggests plonking someone in charge that the Americans want (and ignoring what the people want) isn’t a recipe for success. Someone (poss on this thread) said Saudi or Qatar could be key.

Seriously though, what would you consider a step in the right direction? You surely can't think there is no hope for Gazans whether Hamas stay or go.

I’m sorry for my negativity but when a place has been flattened like Gaza has, millions of people have been displaced, malnutrition is setting in that could cause lifelong effects and members of the government who played a role in all this have made it clear that they don’t want Palestinians in that land, it is really quite hard to be positive about the future.

My comments were in response to the usual “if Hamas surrendered tomorrow, this would all be over”. I think that comment totally misses the fact that Palestinians will be suffering for a long time even once Hamas are gone and the worse it gets during the conflict (in terms of homes lost, key infrastructure lost, the number of injured or malnourished people etc.), the longer this all lasts for them.

So again, apologies for being a downer when it comes to the plight of the Palestinian. It is the opposite of what a hope will happen but I think we all have to be ready for more horrors to come.

There is nothing we can do to "act quickly to avert it". That's a meaningless soundbite.

Most of Gaza has already been destroyed so that can't be averted.

The parts that haven't will equally be destroyed if Hamas & Netanyahu can't agree a ceasefire deal soon.

It's not what I want but it is what will happen if we don't have a ceasefire before 7/10/25. Palestinians only have until that date to evacuate Gaza City, unless Netanyahu and Hamas can agree terms before then.

Prices plummet in Gaza as aid influx transforms markets

New internal data from the Israeli security establishment shows a sharp decline in the prices of basic goods in Gaza following the massive influx of humanitarian aid into the Gaza Strip in recent weeks.

According to the data, which was presented to decision-makers, prices of essential products in Gaza’s markets have dropped by dozens of percentage points.

Officials say the price cuts reflect the impact of continuous aid convoys, which have flooded the Strip with flour, rice, sugar, and other staples.

Here are some examples: A kilogram of flour, which cost between NIS 80-100 about three weeks ago, is now priced at NIS 18. A kilogram of sugar, which costs NIS 300, now costs NIS 50. A kilogram of pasta dropped from NIS 100 to NIS 10. A kilogram of rice, which was NIS 120 three weeks ago, now sells for NIS 30. Oil, lentils, and hummus, which previously went for NIS 90 per kilogram/liter, have now dropped to NIS 30, NIS 20, and NIS 10, respectively.

Although the data originates from the security establishment, it is also corroborated by international organizations and aid groups operating in the area.

Israeli officials say the influx of humanitarian aid will continue, and is expected to grow, in the coming weeks.

Despite the improvement, humanitarian organizations stress that Gaza’s overall humanitarian crisis remains severe. While food is becoming more accessible, challenges persist in areas such as medical supplies, clean water, fuel, and adequate shelter.

https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-864495

@PaxAeterna What about on an individual level? It makes a difference to the individuals receiving the aid. Aid drops are used in humanitarian crises not to solve malnutrition on a population level but to supplement other methods of aid distribution. Much more aid is getting into Gaza now by various means. There are NGOs distributing aid as well as the GHF - even the UN are distributing some.

161 packages containing food were airdropped on Sunday carried out by nine countries, according to the IDF.

The Jordanian Armed Forces said in a statement that about 106 tonnes of food and relief supplies were dropped during the operation.

On their own they are inadequate to solve the food shortages I agree, and also they can be dangerous. But the way some people talk, it would be better not to bother with them at all.

Obviously it is visible but if your family hasn't eaten for days you will do things that don't make sense like run at a falling pallet or jump on a tank or dodging bullets to get flour .
https://www.aljazeera.com/video/newsfeed/2025/8/10/palestinian-boy-crushed-to-death-by-falling-aid-pallet-in-gaza#flips-6376760539112:0

This is the video it shows the chaos and confusion of when it happened. I know it's Al Jazeera but it's the easiest to copy in.