Israels plan for Gazas future

And the plans go on:

The plan remains on the table because Netanyahu wants it implemented.
He is upset with the army because it seems that while the army is not outright rejecting it, it is not offering practical solutions or ways to implement it.
For now, there will be some back and forth, and Netanyahu has instructed the army to come to the table again and present a different plan, one with a shorter timeline and a smaller budget.
International actors have said this would amount to war crimes, and possibly crimes against humanity – even genocide.
So there will be no outside funding for this concentration. Israel has to figure out how to do this on its own.

There's a great interview with Mandy Patinkin (Princess Bride, Homeland and Broadway actor) where he and his wife talk about Gaza.

Interviewer: Are you thinking or feeling any differently about what it means for you to be Jewish in in this moment?

Kathryn Grody: I hate the way some people are using anti-semitism as a claim for anybody that is critical about a certain policy. You know, as far as I am concerned, compassion for every person in Gaza, you know, is very Jewish. And the fact that I abhor the policies of the leader of that country does not mean I'm a self-hating Jew or I'm anti-Semitic.

Interviewer: You mean Netanyahu when you say the the leader of that country,

Kathryn Grody: Netanyahu? Yes. I uh I I feel this is the behavior the politics of what he's doing is the worst thing for Jewish people. It's like lighting a candle for
anybody that has any anti-semitic feelings. It's creating a generation of wounded and hurt kids who will understandably be very angry. So that is how I feel and I feel um I really feel deeply troubled and horrified by what is happening in my
name.

Mandy Patinkin: 15 years ago I was in Philadelphia and then I go up to the hotel room. Katherine was in the hotel room and uh the movie was on. She was watching The Princess Bride and just as I walked in the room is that final scene in the movie where Inigo is sitting by the window with the man in black and the man in black asks Enigo would he like to be the next Dread Pirate Robertson. And the Enigo Montoya actor who was me said these words which I did not really know what they meant that William Goldman wrote which I think are the singular greatest words I've ever read. You know, I have been in the revenge business so long.Now that it's over, I do not know what to do with the rest of my life. And I ask Jews all over the world to consider what this man, Benjamin Netanyahu, and his right-wing government is doing to the Jewish people all over the world. They are endangering not only the state of Israel, which I care deeply about and want to exist, but they are endangering the Jewish population all over the world. He is the most dangerous thing, not just since October 7th. It is it has
been a a a deeply troubled situation and endangering the Jews by endangering
those in Gaza. and to watch what is happening for the Jewish people. To allow this to happen to children and civilians of all ages in Gaza for whatever reason is unconscionable and unthinkable. And I ask you Jews everywhere all over the world to spend some time alone and think is this acceptable and sustainable?
How could it be done to you and your ancestors?

Here is the video, their emotion, frustration and humanity is clearly palpable.

There is no winning over the ‘hearts and minds’ of the Palestinians.
Hence they find themselves is this position.

https://www.middleeasteye.net/live-blog/live-blog-update/israel-boosts-propaganda-funding-150-million-sway-global-opinion-against

Any tactical gains that the Israelis made militarily in Gaza are being erased by what we are seeing on a daily basis and are highly counterproductive.
“The essence of effective counterinsurgency is to win hearts and minds of the population and we see day after day that is not what is happening

HEAR. HEAR

Israel dont allowed journalists in, oooh we all wonder why? Err no actually we don't wonder we know its because they dont want independent verification by the press of their war crimes. But allowing press and other international organisations into Gaza would give us much more accurate information dont you agree? Might show Israel in an even worse light though.... So we won't hold our breath eh?

"HonestReporting or Honest Reporting is an Israeli media advocacy group. A pro-Israel media watchdog, it describes its mission as "combat[ting] ideological prejudice in journalism and the media, as it impacts Israel".

Media bias has rated them:

Analysis / Bias
In review, HonestReporting reports on the news where they perceive that Israel was portrayed unfairly. Many stories are negative toward Palestine and attempt to portray Israel as a victim, such as this Reuters Ignores Palestinian Rejectionism and Violence as Cause of Conflict.

We are not saying they are wrong, simply that the opinion may be biased based on where one stands. With that said, this website is 100% biased in favor of Israel and generally favors the political right with stories such as this HR Supports ADL Against Far-Left Cancel Culture. This story is credibly sourced to the ADL, Forward, and Washington Post.

Editorially, they hold pro-Israel nationalist positions in favor of Benjamin Netanyahu and the current nationalist parties. Some might call them a propaganda source.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/honest-reporting/

A pro-Israel pressure group fronting as a watchdog. Far from unbiased and ‘honest’.

It’s made up of 1000s of volunteers who trawl media and organise online campaigns of bullying and pile-ons to silence legitimate and evidence-based criticism of Israel. E.g. They’ve led online campaigns to smear the British Medical Journal for producing evidence on incidence on specific targeting of children in low risk contexts by Israeli military ops.

Who are honest reporting?

Agree, it is such a specific figure that logically does not make sense in any society with a normal age/sex distribution.

I think we’re beginning to see across various threads where some posters are getting their information from. And it’s not reputable unbiased sources. And there’s clearly no cross checking going on. At least we know now

Just adding these tweets from Honest Reporting as the above didn't mention the 40 beheaded babies, the below show where they linked to the original i24 news report.

Honest reporting repeated the 40 beheaded babies lie.

After claiming "most" were women and children, we finally established this was bull shit and now the UN confirms ~72% of all reported deaths are men, most aged 16 to 39 - the prime fighting age

Can we have a verifiable official UN source for this figure? The only sources available appear to be from the outfits called honest reporting and the Henry Jackson Society both highly biased prone to misrepresenting data.

After claiming "most" were women and children, we finally established this was bull shit and now the UN confirms ~72% of all reported deaths are men, most aged 16 to 39 - the prime fighting age

@ForgesOfEmpires could I ask where you got this data from the UN from?

OK, I’ll reflect on that.
Similarly, I can’t imagine having opinions strong enough to think intentionally starving 50-100 Palestinians to death - mostly infants and those with complex special needs - is not enough to make a stink about just in case it hurts Israel’s rep…

Anyway, yes they did say that: and here is evidence^: https://law4palestine.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/Database-of-Israeli-Incitement-to-Genocide-LEGISLATORS.pdf^
I’ve included some below to save you trawling the doc.

Gotlieb:
“Bring down buildings!! Bomb without distinction!! Stop with this impotence. You have ability There is worldwide legitimacy! Flatten Gaza. Without mercy! This time, there is no room for mercy!”

Feiglin:
”It is not Hamas that should be eliminated. Gaza should be razed and Israel's rule should be restored to the place. This is our country.”

Atbaryan:
”Erase all of Gaza from the face of the earth. That the Gazan monsters will fly to the southern fence & try to enter Egyptian territory or they will die & their death will be evil. Gaza should be erased!"
"Hate the enemy. Hate the monsters. Any vestige of internal bickering is a maddeningly stupid waste of energy. Invest this energy in one thing; Erasing all of Gaza from the face of the earth. That the Gazan monsters will fly to the southern fence and try to enter Egyptian territory. Or they will die and their death will be evil. Gaza should be erased."

Smotrich:
“Within a few months, we will be able to declare that we have won. Gaza will be totally destroyed,”

”They will be totally despairing, understanding that there is no hope and nothing to look for in Gaza, and will be looking for relocation to begin a new life in other places.”
“it’s morale and justified to let 2million people die of hunger until the hostages are returned home”

Hamas should release the hostages. So should Israel - they have 1000s living in similar conditions. I see no evidence that the Israeli gov cares whether the hostages live or die. They are being used to justify a means to an ends now. They’re starving and bombing them too.

These politicians mean to incite and deliver genocide. There’s plenty of evidence. That is why members of the Knesset are either sanctioned or have warrants out for their arrests from the ICC, just like Hamas. I can’t see your point in wanting to blanche words of criminal intent by the far right.

Is the news done by crystal ball? Hamas does not release data so the only facts available are:

• Hamas claims 55000 to 58000 casualties
• They refuse to confirm how many are combatants
• After claiming "most" were women and children, we finally established this was bull shit and now the UN confirms ~72% of all reported deaths are men, most aged 16 to 39 - the prime fighting age.
• Israel claims as of early 2025, to have killed at least 14,000 to 15,000 Hamas and other militant operatives.

Neither Israel nor Hamas has yet offered evidence, but as Hamas refuses to share the combatants ratio and was already caught lying about them being mostly women and children, I think they've proved themselves wildly unreliable.

So you don't know how many civilians have been killed because you saw it on the news. Nobody knows this. You'll have to wait for it to be investigated.

You didn't answer my questions? And why did you claim Israel have only killed around 30k civilians? Seems like you are very poorly informed. Try watching the news.

The lack of independent journalists allowed in Gaza and the killing of over 200 by the IDF means some people are resorting to propaganda. They believe it either because it fits their narrative or because there’s nothing else available. This makes views more extreme and we end up with threads like this ( and a lot of others atm ) lots of people with no concept or acceptance of peace for all or / and no empathy. A direct result of shutting out the truth.

Goodness me.Have you all come over from the Anit-Semitic thread because you have nothing better to do.

The minimisation on the severity of child deaths in Gaza is quite something on this thread. Would you be trying to spin excuses if it was thousands of Israeli children who were dying cruel deaths through relentless bombs being dropped on them?

I know. really?