To wish those in Israel safety in these coming times

So, moving forwards, what is your proposal?

There is no doubt that mass displacement has tragically affected many peoples, including during the India–Pakistan partition. But comparing that to the Palestinian Nakba oversimplifies and distorts what makes the Palestinian case unique and ongoing.

First, most displaced communities from other conflicts were eventually absorbed into surrounding societies. Palestinians, by contrast, have been deliberately denied that opportunity. That is not only due to restrictive citizenship laws in the region, but more importantly because of Israel’s refusal to allow their return or compensate them, in clear violation of international law. That is a critical difference.

More importantly, the Palestinian displacement is not a one-time historical event. It continues through settlement expansion, forced evictions in East Jerusalem, demolitions in the West Bank, and the blockade of Gaza. The right of return is not about nostalgia or symbolism. It is about millions of people still living in statelessness and limbo, often just a few miles from the homes their families were forced out of. The keys they carry are not simply emotional gestures. They are reminders of a legal claim that remains unresolved.

You are right to point out the failures of Arab states in supporting Palestinians, and that criticism is entirely valid. But shifting the entire burden onto host countries conveniently lets Israel, the party that created the refugee crisis, off the hook. The fact that Palestinians face injustice elsewhere does not erase the root injustice that created their statelessness in the first place.

As for Egypt, yes, its handling of the Rafah crossing has been appalling. But again, focusing on Egypt’s failure to take in refugees does not change the fact that Israel has dropped tens of thousands of bombs on one of the most densely populated areas on earth. Israel is the actor inflicting the violence, so it bears primary responsibility.

If we are going to talk about accountability, we should be consistent. Israel should not be exempt from international norms simply because others also behave badly.

Have to say this is true, many current day Indians and Pakistanis lost their homes (people literally just took what they could carry) during partition, a lot were lucky just to survive it. You don’t see hindus and sikhs demanding they be given their homes back in Lahore. You don’t see Pakistanis carrying a key around for 70 years so they can go back to their home in Jalandhar.

Displacement is an unfortunate but not rare experience for many people across the globe. They start again and crack on building lives. Part of the problem is how restrictive citizenship laws in the middle east are. It is extremely difficult to obtain citizenship and most arab countries don’t automatically pass citizenship on through the mother, the father has to be a citizen. So yeah it as an extremely difficult position to be in. Even if they want to move forward many are scuppered by the country they live in, it is quite shit.

Personally given the support for Palestinians across the middle east I’m always surprised that arab countries don’t offer a fast track to citizenship for Palestinians who want it (ofcourse some wouldn’t want it but if you truly believe that they are in need then like in the west refugees should be offered the option).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Palestinian_nationality

I do increasingly think that many middle eastern countries quite like having an impoverished cohort of Palestinians (most of the Palestinians I have met are well educated and very middle class, but I’ve lived in places where you only get in with a work visa) around so they can point at Israel and call them bastards while carefully not mentioning how they treat refugees.

it’s a bit like this rafah crossing convoy thing, Egypt will talk about a genocide but then keep the doors firmly shut. If you genuinely believe that a people are being genocided you let them in (Germanys welcome of Syrian’s comes to mind). I mean seriously if the UK believed French people were being genocided I genuinely think British people would be helping them exit. Not blocking them. Which means the Egyptians government don’t actually believe a genocide is occurring.

Here’s a strange though typical piece of divisive rhetoric from You Tuber and professional shit-stirrer Owen Jones.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/jun/18/iraq-afghanistan-libya-warmongers-always-wrong-iran-attacks-nothing-change-minds

Interesting take from a Jewish person. Oh well.

"I thought antisemitism was imagined on this forum." @Dangermoo

At last ! We agree on something.

I thought antisemitism was imagined on this forum. No, I don't have a problem with the Jewish community, I'm just surprised at your earlier post.

ETA: in your question as to whether you sniffed antisemitism @mouthpipette

@purpletablet

Are you pretending I didn't address your first points?

The displacements in 1947 only started after the Arabs started a civil war against the Jews, following the UN vote. Up to then not one person had been displaced.

But I'll go a step further, even population transfers where it made sense wouldn't have been the end of the world. That's what happened for example when Pakistan was founded round about the same time.

As to the refugees remaining stateless, well that's just because the entire Arab world failed them. Why are the great grandchildren of original refugees not yet citizens of Syria, Lebanon etc?

Every other refugee in the world managed to resettle. What's special about the Palestinians that they remain stateless for eternity?

Do you have a problem with that ?

Do I sniff antisemitism?

I is.

Did I see you state earlier you are Jewish?

You’re repeating a familiar but highly misleading narrative. The idea that Palestinians could have simply accepted the creation of Israel and gone on to live peacefully “under the Israeli flag” ignores what was actually happening on the ground in 1947 to 1949.

More than 700,000 Palestinians were displaced during this period. Some were expelled at gunpoint, others fled in fear of violence, and almost all were later barred from returning. Their villages were destroyed, their homes confiscated, and their legal right of return ignored. This violated both UN Resolution 194 and the Fourth Geneva Convention. To call that a “small percentage” of the population is simply false. It was around half of all Palestinians in Mandate Palestine.

You claim this was just a consequence of war, but that does not hold up to historical scrutiny. Large-scale expulsions were already taking place in cities like Haifa, Jaffa, and Lydda before the Arab armies invaded. Entire communities were displaced long before a Palestinian state could have existed, and regardless of whether political leaders accepted partition.

More importantly, the refugees were civilians, not military commanders or political elites. Rejecting a political plan does not justify the collective punishment of hundreds of thousands of people. And there is no evidence that accepting the Jewish state would have guaranteed protection for Arab villagers. In fact, many areas that were assigned to the Arab state under the UN partition plan were invaded and depopulated by Zionist militias. This strongly suggests that the goal was not just defense, but territorial expansion beyond the proposed borders.

It is true that some Palestinians remained and became citizens of Israel. But they lived under military rule until 1966 and still face structural discrimination today. This is well documented by both international human rights groups and Israeli civil society organisations.

As for the argument that Palestinians should simply “move on,” many remain stateless to this day. Millions live in refugee camps and have been denied the right to return, the right to resettle, and the right to reparations. Unlike Jewish refugees from Europe, who were largely absorbed into new states, Palestinians have been left in political limbo. This is not just a historical grievance. It is an ongoing violation of international law.

Stop trying to determine whether or not @purpletablet defends Hamas and instead read what she has to say and address that.

What she writes is factually correct, clearly laid out and the arguments are well presented. (God, this sounds like a school report !)

This crap between Israel and its neighbours will continue until the fundamental issue, a Palestinian state, is at least addressed.

Thank you Purps for expressing very clearly, what I think , but would be unable to write so lucidly.

And around in circles we go once more.

The founding of the Jewish state wasn't contingent on expelling any Arab inhabitants of the land. They could have gone on to live happily under the Israeli flag.

Those who were expelled (a small percentage of the total displaced), was in response to violence and waging war against the Jews. A war of hatred that was totally unnecessary and ended up dearly costing those who started it.

It's a simple as that.

As to the Arabs living under military law for some years, that is true. It took time for Israel to get over the trauma of having been attacked by the many Arab nations hell bent on annihilating it. However, once that passed, the Arabs got full citizenship and are treated equal under the law.

As to Palestinian identity, my point was that the only thing one loses when the flag of their country changes, is their identity. If Ireland were to become united, people of Northern Ireland wouldn't lose their homes, only their national identity. And that is something many would object to. Understandably.

But with Israel, there was no Palestinian identity at the time. Meaning an Arab living in Tel Aviv wasn't standing to lose anything by his town being part of Israel. So why wage war against the Jews?

Yet wage war they did, and lost. Tough. Stop harping on about it 80 years in.

BTW there were many people in the last century who lost property. They aren't harping on about a right to return, they just moved on. A huge number of Jews from Europe lost their houses during WWII. You don't see them going on about it. They moved on to different countries, resettled in rebuilt their lives. There are no Jews now who are 'refugees' from Poland etc. Certainly not their great grandchildren.

Rightly or wrongly, if some Arabs lost their property 80 years ago, it's time for their descendants to move on.

Which government websites? UK.gov has it as a proscribed terrorist group (no mention of 'resistance'), EU consider it a proscribed terrorist group.

It is. I'm assuming when all else fails personally attack. Not sure what the point of posting here is if you aren't interested in anyone else's opinion

Because I was responding to your post? I thought that was the point of these threads- to discuss things.

What this?
I literally don’t care about your opinion at all, no idea why you keep tagging me.

See Above.

Who mentioned winning a war?
Well if someone loses a war, as you mentioned, it means there's a winner. I'm sure the poster took that understanding as a given

I literally don’t care about your opinion at all, no idea why you keep tagging me.

What they did on 7/10 was not resistance.
Agree I never said it was I was referring to the mainstream description of Hamas which is on most government websites that is how Hamas are described. Not sure what dodgy ground you think I'm on.

This comes as across as dismissive of Palestinian concerns and suffering.

Israel is illegally occupying their land according to international law. Is it surprising that Palestinians have not readily accepted this? I wonder what the position would be in the ME had Palestinians the same military might as has been bestowed on Israel.

I find it really depressing that the Palestinians and the Israelis just can’t come to an agreement on the land. Partition of land is painful of course and it involves people often having to leave their homes but it enables complete self governance for both with zero obligation to each other. Then you can build a massive fuck off wall, mine it and then just ignore each other.

But yes I wish all civilians in the region peace and safety absolutely. I don’t care much if they are Israeli, Palestinian, Iranian, Syrian etc. I think there is so much dehumanising around and I have to say as someone who is not as emotionally invested as some of you are that Israelis are people too. Some Israelis are horrible, some will be practically saints, most will be normal people but the level of hatred levelled at Israelis I see just wouldn’t be ok if it was levelled at Palestinians.

Theres a viciousness on the pro Palestinian side which is something to behold. They will scream about dead Palestinian children but barely spare a thought for dead Israeli children.

I don’t think thats morality I think thats ideology.

Who mentioned winning a war?

The pattern being noted was

Start a war.
Lose the war.
Complain about direct consequences of said war.