UK government - sanctions against Israeli cabinet members

@Jujujudo Views can change. Peace obviously seems impossible right now. But if we look at the history Bosnia, Northern Ireland, Rwanda, even Germany and France. There are so many examples of where hearts and minds change over time and through a reconciliation process. This isn’t about demonising ordinary people.

It’s obviously not representative of the people you know. And I do hope the poll itself is flawed.

I just think that generalisations are not an accurate way of assessing opinion. That’s basically what racism is no? People/parties in power are voted in based on their personal propaganda to garner votes, not really for the benefit of the general public. I mean just because Trump is supported by a large number of Americans, doesn’t mean it’s possible to make sweeping statements about ALL Americans. I also don’t think discussing what Israelis or Jews support or think or don’t think is even relevant to anything. It is a war, conducted by rich, powerful men, controlling the narrative and actions of their citizens and military.
Discussing what Jews or Israelis believe, think, support is moot. Because it just fuels hatred and marginalisation and tries to use those opinions to justify racism or demonisation,
I am not crazy about pro-Palestinian marches. Of course I stand up for their rights of freedom of speech and to protest. But if I started making comments about polls, or opinions then I could say: 67% of protesters support Oct 7th. Or the protesters are all terror sympathisers, etc etc. That would be wrong.

@Jujujudo

I am sorry this is distressing. That is clear.
It sounds like the poll is in no way reflective of people that you know and comes as a surprise. The findings really surprised me and it may be that people are just angry and upset, and actually would not like these things to happen. People may also say things on a telephone call that they may not say face to face.

The Pew Centre uses a panel of about 4000 people to understand views of U.S. population. A far smaller proportion of the U.S. total population.

https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2025/04/SR_25.04.08_us-views-of-israel_methodology.pdf

Just read the link. Maybe you should too.. it states that the poll was of Israeli right wingers, 56% of whom thought they were the chosen people. Right wingers as in Ben Gvir (vomit), the Haredim (more vomit) and the coalition extremists (triple vomit). If you’re going to continue with this ridiculous point you’re trying to make to justify hating Israelis then go right ahead.

I can’t comment on Ha’aratz’s poll - it’s actually an extreme left wing publication and I very much doubt that it’s read by most Israelis, although I know it’s popular among a lot of my friends. As regards being the chosen people, why they even ask that is strange! Also, so what? So there are Jews and Israelis who think they’re the chosen people. Does that justify demonising them? Being racist towards them? I know Christian’s who believe Christ is their saviour. I mean, H1tler used the “chosen people” thing as an excuse to get rid of us all.
This whole argument is strange.

How do you know how I live? Mining I’ve said here on any of these comments indicates that I live in a bubble. Is it because I support the state of Israel existing and want a peaceful region for every citizen? What bubble? That I defend the demonisation of Israelis and Jews?

I agree but my point wasn’t that. The person who commented made out that all Israelis are supporting a genocide etc which clearly isn’t the case at all, because surveying 0.01% of Israelis is not inductive of the entire population. It’s exhausting having to constantly defend against this kind of demonisation.

So rarely hear the words 'release the hostages' and 'disarm hamas' alongside calls for a ceasefire.

There are some interesting regimes in the region in terms of how they exercise their power. Mahmoud Abbas is apparently in his 19th year of a 4 year term and occasionally pulled up on his government's human rights record and treatment of hamasniks under his jurisdiction- those scamps do like to defy authority - but he's the best option so far.
There is a danger that a weakened hamas will be replaced with another violent gang (as has happened in Syria - where some ethnic cleansing of minorities is going on under their new ex-daesh leader).

Obviously they don't want Israel involved. Maybe the emir of Qatar could send some troops to help keep order for the new moderate Abbas government.
'The West' has been happy enough to ignore human rights abuses in Qatar for a while so that should help international relations.

Haaretz an Israeli newspaper found that 56% of Israelis who responded to their poll answered that they were the chosen people!
https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/2018-09-15/ty-article/.premium/79-percent-of-right-wingers-believe-jews-are-the-chosen-people-are-you-for-real/0000017f-f000-d487-abff-f3fef8be0000

The video at the end of my post from Gideon Levy is also really interesting, a jewish Israeli who has similar thoughts to me.

The Guardian are doing a weekly series on Palestine and Israel - the tv presenter asks many people about the line between Palestine and Israel within Jerusalem and many Israelis respond that it is all Israel. A man shouts at him walking past when he is talking about Palestine to say there is no Palestine it is Israel. Also watch The Settlers on BBC!

Also I do not knowingly buy goods from the countries you have listed. Though it is hard when some things are made in China and then the final assembly happens in the EU and they put misleading labels on but I do try and avoid it! We try our best to avoid goods from any countries committing human rights atrocities, governments allow misleading labels which is a whole
other conversation.

Tell us you live in a bubble without saying it.

I cannot argue with you.

I mean I am open to hearing criticism of how this poll was conducted. I do find the results astounding. But generally we do use polling of random small % of a group and assume the results to be representative of the whole group. That is essentially how polling works.

I’m not sure anyone is demonising Israelis here. I think it shows that economic sanctions are needed because we need to give Israel a reason to agree a ceasefire and most importantly let life saving aid flow freely into Gaza. Internal pressure from within Israel will not be enough.

Like you mention, this is not without costs on both sides to do this. But thousands of lives are at stake.

What are you talking about?

Eh? What are you so angry about?

Am I not speaking clearly? I don’t care who they interviewed.. taking the opinions of 0.01% of ANY population then using the results to justify the demonisation of that population is ridiculous. Please. You seem like an intelligent person, enough now.

@Jujujudo

“I don’t know one Israeli that took part in this survey. Not one.”

“This survey interviewed 1000 Israelis. There are around 10m of them. That’s 0.01% of the population. But you know that, which is why it’s even more sinister that you’re using it as any viable indicator of how Israelis actually think.
But it’s so easy to believe that 47% of Jews Israelis want a genocide. Because you see us as inhuman. Rats. Insert alternative trope”

The methodology:

Method: Dedicated online survey
Population: 1,000 Jewish Israeli adults aged 18 and over
Sampling Frame: Nationally representative sample of internet users in Israel
Demographics Collected:

• Gender: Male, Female, Other
• Year of Birth: Respondents select from a list
• Region of Residence: Central, Sharon, Jerusalem and surroundings, South, North
• Religious Identity: Secular, Traditional (non-religious), Traditional (religious), National Religious, Ultra-Orthodox

Polls don’t intend to interview everyone- they are a meant to be a representative sample.

The poll was done in Hebrew by an Israeli company with expertise in polling.

https://www.geokg.com/en/phone-surveys/

True.:(

Juju I hope you can have a good evening with your family or a good book, and forget about this shitshow for a while.

Actually, we are all sick of Israel government supporters responding to EVERY accusation with “me me me”. ENOUGH.

Again. It surveyed 1000 People from a population of 10m. Stop already.

I’d like to see them go much further. That government is Israel are despicable and behave illegally. They are literally criminals and are now hiring criminals to work for them in Gaza, as they have been forced to admit.

Not just Muslims sadly. What a world we live in where it’s perfectly acceptable to justify racism against Jews because of Israel. But perfectly abominable to try to justify any other kind of racism.

Uhuh. What about the actual crimes of humanity against the Israeli citizens? Or are they all just expendable demons in this little propaganda bubble you’ve created for yourself?

This survey interviewed 1000 Israelis. There are around 10m of them. That’s 0.01% of the population. But you know that, which is why it’s even more sinister that you’re using it as any viable indicator of how Israelis actually think.
But it’s so easy to believe that 47% of Jews Israelis want a genocide. Because you see us as inhuman. Rats. Insert alternative trope

The sanctions are long overdue.
Shame the government is so late and so supportive of war crimes and crimes against humanity.

Muslims wishing (economic, and every other kind of) destruction on Israel? Stop the presses. That's a new one.

Israeli Citizens are targeted by Houthi missiles EVERY day. They are fired into the centre of the country towards densely populated civilian towns. Every single day. The only reason tens of thousands of Israelis aren’t dying is because of an excellent defence system and safe rooms.