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Conflict in the Middle East

Heartbreaking news report from Gaza - Dr receives bodies of her children

786 replies

Applenation · 24/05/2025 23:27

Many of you will already have read about this. Paediatric specialist Dr Alaa al-Najjar was on duty when the bodies of nine of her 10 children were received by her in the hospital, after a strike in Khan Younis hit her home.

This report just stopped me in my tracks. I don't know what to say beyond this. I cannot stop thinking about this poor woman tonight.

er children killed by a strike in Khan Younis. Guardian link

OP posts:
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38
ssd · 03/06/2025 21:02

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:59

I suspect that the IDF simply has not told him. I know you won't believe this, but Israel doesn't really prioritise this type of media handling. But he was terrible even taking that into account.

Oh right so he didn't realise then...

Pull the other one, its got bells on.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:59

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:54

No, i thought the Israeli spokesman was brilliant. He parroted everything Krishnan expected him to say and couldn't answer any questions Krishnan put to him eg. If the IDF opened fire on people trying to get aid because these people were acting in a threatening manor, did the people have weapons? No? Then what exactly constitutes a threatening manor? Of course the spokesman couldn't answer because there is no answer.

I suspect that the IDF simply has not told him. I know you won't believe this, but Israel doesn't really prioritise this type of media handling. But he was terrible even taking that into account.

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:59

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:51

  1. For some reason, people feel compassion for the Palestinians killed by Israel but not for Palestinians killed in Syria. Or people dying in Yeman. Or so on. It is almost as if they care only when Jews do it.
  2. The reporting should apply some journalistic integrity rather than just broadcast Hamas propaganda as Channel 4, for example, did today.

Ha, so now ch4 news is broadcasting hamas propaganda...this is exactly what the spokesman tried saying to KG-M and he completely closed him down.

I recommend watching this interview, excellent journalism by an experienced professional.

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:54

No, i thought the Israeli spokesman was brilliant. He parroted everything Krishnan expected him to say and couldn't answer any questions Krishnan put to him eg. If the IDF opened fire on people trying to get aid because these people were acting in a threatening manor, did the people have weapons? No? Then what exactly constitutes a threatening manor? Of course the spokesman couldn't answer because there is no answer.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:51

Stripes56 · 03/06/2025 19:16

The problem is that it is hard to defend what Israel has done in Gaza. We can await till the ICC follow the necessary processes but this takes many years.

Most humans don’t see it in terms of what may be legal or otherwise, but see it through a lens of compassion for their fellow humans.

It might seem the reporting is antisemitic- but newspapers are just reporting what they witness from a human angle.

I don’t think they would aim to defend Hamas nor Israel - and that’s not really their job is it? It’s just to report what they see.

If people around the world hate what they see-
dont blame the messenger

  1. For some reason, people feel compassion for the Palestinians killed by Israel but not for Palestinians killed in Syria. Or people dying in Yeman. Or so on. It is almost as if they care only when Jews do it.
  2. The reporting should apply some journalistic integrity rather than just broadcast Hamas propaganda as Channel 4, for example, did today.
Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:41

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:22

Hope you all seen the interview on ch4 news tonight with Krishnan Guru-Murthy and an spokesman for Israel. Krishnan absolutely roasts him. The spokesman is initially but hamas but hamas...then eventually saying should Israel be treated differently because it has a jewish population. Exactly the sort of rhetoric we hear on here all the time.

It's well worth a watch, it was on ch4 at 7pm.

It is a disgrace. Quoting deaths numbers without validating, broadcasting Hamas-affilated video, claiming that this is the third shooting by the IDF this week despite the denial, claiming that Israel lies and is lying as a fact at so on. Doing Hamas's work for it. Hamas wants the aid process to fail as they have been cut out of it.

But dear god, the Israeli spokesperson was terrible and I can see why people don't believe him.

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:22

Hope you all seen the interview on ch4 news tonight with Krishnan Guru-Murthy and an spokesman for Israel. Krishnan absolutely roasts him. The spokesman is initially but hamas but hamas...then eventually saying should Israel be treated differently because it has a jewish population. Exactly the sort of rhetoric we hear on here all the time.

It's well worth a watch, it was on ch4 at 7pm.

RandomWordsThrownTogether · 03/06/2025 20:03

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 17:41

It's an interesting article, I hope people on here read it.

You are free to point out it could be biased which you have done. However, I didn't notice any obvious misreporting in that article.

I do wonder did you not study the difference between a quality newspaper/broadsheet and a Tabloid - the difference between news reporting and opinion pieces? I learned these distinctions first in Primary school, and then in more detail secondary. These are opinion pieces and would not be printed in a broadsheet.

RandomWordsThrownTogether · 03/06/2025 19:44

It is the current strategy to deny war crimes - attack the international press! The other day it was the children are child soldiers, before that they are human shields, now the press are all in bed with Hamas - liars the lot of them!

Deny - we didn’t do it, Fake news!!
Attack - Victims are all Hamas, child soldiers, human shields, international broadsheets and news channels are all biased
Reverse Victim and Offender - Anti Semitic, thousands of years of oppression, attacking Israel because everyone always singles out Israel.

Can you deny the countless photos of dead bodies, starving babies, children with missing legs??? The Economist estimate that 1 in 20 of Gaza’s population has been killed. They believe the death toll is grossly UNDER reported and is actually between 77k and 109k dead. This is because people aren’t included in the figures if they are still under rubble or are unidentifiable. These figures do not include people who succumb to their injuries at a later date, or get sepsis, or starve or die due to the embargo denying them medication like insulin. They explained how the analysed and compared data to arrive at these numbers.

How is it the multiple western governments, major international aid agencies, the UN, the ICC are all under the mistaken belief that people are being unjustly and cruelly slaughtered, that war crimes are being committed. But you have some insight that these major agencies didn’t uncover in the investigations - you should probably contact them and give them your overwhelming body of evidence. There is a genocide trial on the horizon, I am sure they would love to hear your proof!

Over a year ago Irish Barrister Blinne Ní Ghrálaigh gave a powerful speech at the ICJ, I know the figures are now higher but it gives an insight into the loss of life, dignity and human rights - here is an extract from the last section:

“On the basis of the current figures, on average 247 Palestinians are being killed and are at risk of being killed each day, many of them literally blown to pieces. They include 48 mothers each day, two every hour and over 117 children each day, leaving Unicef to call Israel’s actions a war on children.”

“On current rates, which show no sign of abating, each day over 3 medics, 2 teachers, more than one UN employee and more than one journalist will be killed, many while at work or in what appeared to be targeted attacks on their family homes or where they are sheltered.”

“The risk of famine will increase each day. Each day, an average of 629 people will be wounded, some multiple times over as they move from place to place desperately seeking sanctuary.”

“Each day over 10 Palestinian children will have one or both legs amputated, many without anaesthetic. Each day, on current rates, an average 3900 Palestinian homes will be damaged or destroyed, more mass graves will be dug, more cemeteries will be bulldozed and bombed, denying even the dead any dignity or peace.”

"Each day ambulances, hospitals and medics will continue to be attacked and killed. The first responders who have spent three months without international assistance trying to dig families out of the rubble with their bare hands will continue to be targeted. On current figures, one will be killed almost every second day, sometimes in attacks launched against those attending the scene to rescue the wounded.”

“Each day yet more desperate people will be forced to relocate from where they are sheltering or will be bombed in places they have been told to evacuate to. Entire multigenerational families will be obliterated.”

Speech at the ICJ:

Economist Article on the Real Death Toll:
https://www.economist.com/interactive/middle-east-and-africa/2025/05/08/how-many-people-have-died-in-gaza

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Stripes56 · 03/06/2025 19:28

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 13:08

For the benefit of @Whatsinanamehey & @RandomWordsThrownTogether

Every time the media such as Sky News reports a story including says Hamas-run Gaza health ministry, that means it has come from Hamas.

27 Palestinians killed by Israeli fire while waiting for aid distribution, says Hamas-run Gaza health ministry

And the figures are thought to be an underestimate of all those who have died and remain under the rubble. Israel has previously considered the figures from the Hamas run health ministry as fairly accurate.

There’s even an article from Times of Israel.
You can also find articles prio 7/10 when it has been shown retrospectively that the Gazan / Hamas Ministry of Health figures have been accurate.
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/les-decodeurs/article/2024/10/13/why-the-gaza-health-ministry-s-death-count-is-considered-reliable_6729264_8.html

www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/idf-officials-15000-likely-killed-in-gaza-since-start-of-war-5000-of-them-are-hamas/

Why the Gaza Health Ministry's death count is considered reliable

Since the start of the war between Israel and Hamas on October 7, 2023, the credibility of the figures published by the Hamas-run administration has been regularly questioned.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/les-decodeurs/article/2024/10/13/why-the-gaza-health-ministry-s-death-count-is-considered-reliable_6729264_8.html

Stripes56 · 03/06/2025 19:16

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 16:58

Thank you.

The second article was very interesting. I tend to agree that Israel would be better to let journalists in with the IDF, though I can see why they don't.

The Spectator one I couldn't read as I don't have an account and am wary of subscribing to too many news sources. I just subscribed to Reuters the other day.

The problem is that it is hard to defend what Israel has done in Gaza. We can await till the ICC follow the necessary processes but this takes many years.

Most humans don’t see it in terms of what may be legal or otherwise, but see it through a lens of compassion for their fellow humans.

It might seem the reporting is antisemitic- but newspapers are just reporting what they witness from a human angle.

I don’t think they would aim to defend Hamas nor Israel - and that’s not really their job is it? It’s just to report what they see.

If people around the world hate what they see-
dont blame the messenger

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 18:00

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 17:36

Go to N Korea and ask a person whether they support the regime.

Not much point debating this further with you there appears to be a lack of some basic criteria thinking skills

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 17:59

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 17:41

It's an interesting article, I hope people on here read it.

You are free to point out it could be biased which you have done. However, I didn't notice any obvious misreporting in that article.

I did read it.

You are free to point out it could be biased
It is.

I didn't notice any obvious misreporting in that article.
It's a biased opinion piece not a news article.

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 17:41

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 17:23

Not concerned about Jake Williams Simons bias, the editor of the Jewish Chronicle? Interesting

It's an interesting article, I hope people on here read it.

You are free to point out it could be biased which you have done. However, I didn't notice any obvious misreporting in that article.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 17:36

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 16:15

There are independent sources within Gaza - eye witnesses, medical professionals aid workers and so on. It is the task of professional war correspondents to sieve through different sources to build a picture (think I'm repeating myself here). Is it perfect and faultless? No but at the moment it's the best we've got.
Suggesting everything we're quoting is just Hamas is frankly wrong and simplistic. I don't think you really believe all the news sites we've been relying on for decades for our news are now simply repeating Hamas propaganda with zero interrogation

Go to N Korea and ask a person whether they support the regime.

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 17:23

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 16:58

Thank you.

The second article was very interesting. I tend to agree that Israel would be better to let journalists in with the IDF, though I can see why they don't.

The Spectator one I couldn't read as I don't have an account and am wary of subscribing to too many news sources. I just subscribed to Reuters the other day.

Not concerned about Jake Williams Simons bias, the editor of the Jewish Chronicle? Interesting

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 16:58

AIBUHere · 03/06/2025 15:53

I do understand Israel’s rationale in not letting in ‘independent media’ into Gaza. From what we’ve seen so far, how would unbiased reporting be ensured when most of the media was, from the beginning of the war, and still is taking Hamas truth as THE truth and would it be feasible to let journalists be left to wander freely around Gaza with terrorists hiding on every corner? How can they report without bias if they don’t know if they’re speaking to members/supporters of Hamas and the other terrorist groups when they are dressed as civilians or under duress? Who would they blame if they were killed or injured (considering the atrocities carried out on Oct 7th) when Israel is held responsible for their protection under international law. If they’re embedded with the IDF for protection, there will be cries of bias. This is not a normal war being fought under normal rules of engagement from Hamas’s side because they are err……. a terrorist organisation!

They have let military experts in though, who can give much more of expert opinion on how the war is being fought than a journalist, but few media sites seem interested in what they have to say funnily enough, I mean have they even been reported in MSM?

These articles are interesting. Especially the 2nd one.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-rush-to-blame-israel-is-bad-for-journalism/

https://jakewallissimons.substack.com/p/israel-should-let-reporters-into

Edited

Thank you.

The second article was very interesting. I tend to agree that Israel would be better to let journalists in with the IDF, though I can see why they don't.

The Spectator one I couldn't read as I don't have an account and am wary of subscribing to too many news sources. I just subscribed to Reuters the other day.

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 16:15

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 15:38

There is no evidence independent of Hamas (or the IDF) coming out of the Gaza Strip

There are independent sources within Gaza - eye witnesses, medical professionals aid workers and so on. It is the task of professional war correspondents to sieve through different sources to build a picture (think I'm repeating myself here). Is it perfect and faultless? No but at the moment it's the best we've got.
Suggesting everything we're quoting is just Hamas is frankly wrong and simplistic. I don't think you really believe all the news sites we've been relying on for decades for our news are now simply repeating Hamas propaganda with zero interrogation

AIBUHere · 03/06/2025 15:53

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 15:02

People complain that independent media is not allowed into the Gaza Strip.

People agree that Hamas are a terrible oppressive organisation

But they refused to accept that news coming out of Gaza is from Hamas???

Presumably they think that it is the toothfairy

I do understand Israel’s rationale in not letting in ‘independent media’ into Gaza. From what we’ve seen so far, how would unbiased reporting be ensured when most of the media was, from the beginning of the war, and still is taking Hamas truth as THE truth and would it be feasible to let journalists be left to wander freely around Gaza with terrorists hiding on every corner? How can they report without bias if they don’t know if they’re speaking to members/supporters of Hamas and the other terrorist groups when they are dressed as civilians or under duress? Who would they blame if they were killed or injured (considering the atrocities carried out on Oct 7th) when Israel is held responsible for their protection under international law. If they’re embedded with the IDF for protection, there will be cries of bias. This is not a normal war being fought under normal rules of engagement from Hamas’s side because they are err……. a terrorist organisation!

They have let military experts in though, who can give much more of expert opinion on how the war is being fought than a journalist, but few media sites seem interested in what they have to say funnily enough, I mean have they even been reported in MSM?

These articles are interesting. Especially the 2nd one.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-rush-to-blame-israel-is-bad-for-journalism/

https://jakewallissimons.substack.com/p/israel-should-let-reporters-into

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 15:38

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 15:31

People complain that independent media is not allowed into the Gaza Strip.
Absolutely

People agree that Hamas are a terrible oppressive organisation
Yes

But they refused to accept that news coming out of Gaza is from Hamas???
Do they? Or are you oversimplifying things?

Presumably they think that it is the toothfairy
Pretty patronising

The majority of posters get their news from msm sources whether it be news radio or broadsheets. They trust these sources because they adhere to the journalist code of ethics. They trust them to pull together all evidence available to form a picture of what happened. Are you suggesting the only source people can trust is the IDF and Israeli government? Because if you are do you not find it slightly suspicious that the Israeli government have set it up that way and are discrediting all other sources?

There is no evidence independent of Hamas (or the IDF) coming out of the Gaza Strip

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 15:31

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 15:02

People complain that independent media is not allowed into the Gaza Strip.

People agree that Hamas are a terrible oppressive organisation

But they refused to accept that news coming out of Gaza is from Hamas???

Presumably they think that it is the toothfairy

People complain that independent media is not allowed into the Gaza Strip.
Absolutely

People agree that Hamas are a terrible oppressive organisation
Yes

But they refused to accept that news coming out of Gaza is from Hamas???
Do they? Or are you oversimplifying things?

Presumably they think that it is the toothfairy
Pretty patronising

The majority of posters get their news from msm sources whether it be news radio or broadsheets. They trust these sources because they adhere to the journalist code of ethics. They trust them to pull together all evidence available to form a picture of what happened. Are you suggesting the only source people can trust is the IDF and Israeli government? Because if you are do you not find it slightly suspicious that the Israeli government have set it up that way and are discrediting all other sources?

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 15:22

Whatsinanamehey · 03/06/2025 15:11

some sources we like to think are factual like The Guardian are just parroting what they say.

I was disagreeing with this. I do read the guardian and they certainly don't just parrot what Hamas says. Their reporting includes a wide range of sources including many Israeli sources.

Well not all their reports about Gaza include a wide range of sources and if they did I would not have cancelled my financial support to The Guardian.

And sometimes they have reported incidents as caused by Israel when they don’t know who caused them because no one does.

Whatsinanamehey · 03/06/2025 15:11

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 13:08

For the benefit of @Whatsinanamehey & @RandomWordsThrownTogether

Every time the media such as Sky News reports a story including says Hamas-run Gaza health ministry, that means it has come from Hamas.

27 Palestinians killed by Israeli fire while waiting for aid distribution, says Hamas-run Gaza health ministry

some sources we like to think are factual like The Guardian are just parroting what they say.

I was disagreeing with this. I do read the guardian and they certainly don't just parrot what Hamas says. Their reporting includes a wide range of sources including many Israeli sources.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 15:02

People complain that independent media is not allowed into the Gaza Strip.

People agree that Hamas are a terrible oppressive organisation

But they refused to accept that news coming out of Gaza is from Hamas???

Presumably they think that it is the toothfairy

AIBUHere · 03/06/2025 14:43

RandomWordsThrownTogether · 03/06/2025 11:52

I haven’t seen anyone reference Hamas or any Hamas affiliated sites as a news source - I have seen some questionable Zionist sites like that “honest reporting” shared on one of the boards but most people who post in support of Palestinians’ human rights have shared links like the BBC, the Independent, the Guardian, Washington Post etc… these are all respected international broadsheets that have very strict guidelines when it comes to reporting and verifying sources.

Everything that comes out Gaza on the Palestinian side is sourced from Hamas or their supporters, so they are the source.

I see you referred to ‘questionable Zionist sites’. Not sure what you mean by that but the use of the word ‘Zionist’ in that context rather gives your game away.

Honest Reporting is exactly that btw, it was set up to do that, backed up with facts. Please point out where it’s reporting has been incorrect like the sources you quoted has been.

The BBC has strict guidelines when reporting and verifying sources? Are you having a laugh?

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/03/05/how-much-hamas-official-son-paid-for-bbc-gaza-documentary/