Israeli movements against Settlements?

It means the people who immediately come to the defence of Hamas whenever someone criticises them - they are by definition "like you" as that is exactly what you did by implying that Hamas not holding elections (since 2006!) are no worse than Ukraine who haven't held an election since being at war.

Why don't you just accept that Hamas lack of democracy is awful without immediately trying to change the subject to what the Ukraine government are doing.

Certainly that is the argument made when discussing palestians and Hamas. Although Israel’s last election wasn’t nearly 20 years ago.

Wow. In the nicest possible way I can ask. What part of this hard to understand? The Hamas and Israeli leadership should be investigated by the ICC. So no it’s not simply “Hamas first”. Somehow it seems only Hamas that should be criticised but not the Israeli leadership and its military.

Edited to add: If Israel does not agree to stick to border plans and does not agree to a two-state solution, even with the absence of Hamas and the return of hostages, how is it going to help the peace process if Israel continues with its annexation plans and continues to illegally expand?

For those of you hasn’t Yuval Abraham’s tweet in March. He wrote this: קבוצת מתנחלים תקפה את הבית של חמדן בלל, שביים איתי את הסרט אין ארץ אחרת שזכה באוסקר. הכו אותו בראש ובכל הגוף. בעוד פצוע ומדמם, חיילים נכנסו לאמבולנס שהזמין, ועצרו אותו. מאז נעלם ולא ברור אם הוא מקבל טיפול רפואי ומה קורה לו.

This is the translation: A group of settlers attacked the home of Hamdan Bilal, who co-directed the Oscar-winning film No Other Land with me. They beat him in the head and all over his body. While wounded and bleeding, soldiers entered the ambulance he had called and arrested him. He has since disappeared and it is unclear whether he is receiving medical treatment or what is happening to him.

Why isn't it as simple as Hamas should go? Do you actually want them to stay? Why shouldn't Hamas surrender, hand over hostages, accept PA authority over Gaza, make the first step towards a meaningful peace process?

Wouldn't that be better for the civilians in Gaza? You think they are better off under Hamas than the PA?

I can't think of any single one reason for Hamas to stay. Can you?

@Twiglets1 Someone like you rushing to defend them? Someone like me? What on earth does that mean? When have I defended Hamas? I simply pointed out that Ukraine has not had any elections during wartime. How does that defend Hamas? It’s very obvious that Israel has been illegally expanding way before 2006. That is not a defence of Hamas. Criticising Israel and the IDF does not mean it somehow is a defence of Hamas. To even think that is very bizarre.

How so? It makes perfect sense to ask. When exactly are the elections meant to even held? Even without Hamas in power, Israel was already illegally expanding so no I don’t expect the absence of Hamas to stop the IDF and Israeli government from bulldozing homes, assaulting people at checkpoints etc. @dairydebris Please stop casting aspersions. I am not furious, but I am sad when I see any loss of life.

I feel sad when I see unwarranted acts of violence. When I read about the settler violence and a village being raided for no apparent reason I was so shocked and dismayed. When I saw a recent tweet by Yuval, the Israeli co-director of the documentary, No Other Land, I couldn’t believe it at first.

When I saw that 25 year old Fatima’s dreams of exhibiting her photos abroad might stop simply because she chose to participate in an upcoming documentary, Your Soul on Your Hand and Walk, my heart shattered. Fatima was killed alongside her family. She was so young. She wanted to exhibit her photos in an exhibition called the Story Remains. The title seems so poignant.

So no I’m not furious. I am sad that the depth of pain and destruction of innocent life is somehow dismissed simply by saying “Hamas first”. I believe there can be peaceful coexistence. I believe that there can be collaboration and No Other Land showed just that.

I don’t think removing Hamas will prevent the Israeli military from their wanton acts of destruction and abuse etc. There needs to be more transparency and accountability. The Hamas and Israeli leadership should be investigated by the ICC. So no it’s not simply “Hamas first”.

Good points.

Mainly hope, I guess.

Israeli friends saying he's not popular.

But given the rise of nationalism in lots of places you're right and it could go the other way.

The world feels like a dark place at the moment and I sometimes wonder if it's always been like this but I just wasn't aware.

Despite elections in Israel, Netanyahu has been in power for a total of seventeen years. Just about as long as Hamas has. Hamas has held onto power without holding elections. Netanyahu has been voted in numerous times.

She's asking to be pointed in the direction of information which will allow her to take an informed view. Why wouldn't you provide that, if there is any?

And you are making a claim by implication - your claim is that the view 'few Israelis object to the Settlements' is incorrect.

Ukraine hasn’t held an election during wartime but Hamas hasn’t held an election since 2006 when they were voted in.

Do you really think the two things are the same @ExitPursuedByAPolarBear ?

Why can’t Hamas be criticised without someone like you rushing in to defend them? Would you like to see the same government in power since 2006 in your country with no opportunity to vote in nearly 20 years?

Why is there the assumption that Netanyahu being voted out will automatically mean a more moderate leader will come in his place? Netanyahu is not the only extremist politician in Israel and there's just as good a chance that someone just as extreme will replace him. If Trump goes tomorrow are we assuming a more moderate will take over? Highly unlikely - America will most probably get Vance who is in my opinion is worst.

OK then. Just substitute Hamas for Fatah, Black September or any other Palestinian leadership that has favored violence rather than talking to achieve its political aims. Same shit, different name.

This is quite an unhinged post.

Ukraine's constitution doesn't allow elections during war time, but even so, what's the relevance? Would you prefer we not criticize Hamas? Surely not?

All of the above, checkpoints, homes being bulldozed etc would have to stop as part of a peace process yes, which would I assume happen in stages.

That peace process can't start with Hamas in power. So yes, they have to go. What's to argue with?

Israel can get rid of Netanyahu next year if it wishes. What can Gazan Palestinians do? Hamas are literally out on the streets murdering dissenters!

You sound like you're furious with Israel for doing something you believe it might do in the future. I prefer to have belief that there's hope once the extremists are out of power.

It is very interesting that access to military records to the first years of Israel’s military rule over Palestinians in Jerusalem, the West Bank and Gaza is often denied. There isn’t any used denying that there was historic abuse and somehow it must be Hamas’s fault. When there has been decades of distrust and clear human rights violations and illegal expansion of territory in Israel etc. It can’t just simply be a matter of “Hamas first”.

Ukraine has not held an election during wartime and yet somehow only Hamas is only criticised? This isn’t a chess game where it’s “Hamas first” even with the absence of Hamas, it doesn’t stop Israel’s illegal presence in Occupied Palestinian Territory. It doesn’t stop the checkpoints and the targeting of journalists etc. does it? Even when Hamas aren’t in the West Bank, it doesn’t prevent innocent civilians from losing their lives inside their own homes. There isn’t any justification. But sure Hamas first. As though this will somehow prevent Israel’s genocidal actions and somehow Netyanhu will continue to evade the ICC for his war crimes. Drones attacking residential properties to maximise damage cannot be blamed solely on Hamas. Will homes stop being bulldozed once Hamas leave? Will the checkpoints magically vanish out of thin air? Or perhaps it’s time to admit to even with the absence of Hamas, Palestinians will continue to live in an apartheid state.

Exactly.

Hamas first because Netanyahu can be voted out democratically and very likely will be but Hamas won't hold elections so have to be ousted some other way.

It’s been over a decade since this took place and yet we haven’t been getting any closer to the two-state solution. The UN Partition Plan tried to divide the country according to demographic concentrations, so it clearly wasn’t ideal, however this was what Israel was created with those border lines in place and yet it hasn’t prevented Israel’s illegal presence in Occupied Palestinian Territory so what will stop Israel and who will they actually listen to?

No. I don't blame them at all. They are the real victims in all this, growing up in a society that glorifies hate and violence, constantly oppressed by both Israel and their own government. It's no wonder there's so much hatred on both sides given the violence that's taking place everyday. That's only human.

Whats needed is for both Hamas and Netanyahu to go.

Hamas first.

@dairydebris The average age of Palestinians in Gaza is 19 years old. Benjamin Netyanhu time and time again has rejected the two-state solution and Israeli lawmakers have voted to back his rejection. To ask the average Palestinian who doesn’t have a power to change anything is being disingenuous. Israel has been illegally encroaching on Palestinian Territory and yet Netyanhu does not want to go back to the 1967 border lines according to the UN partition plan so he clearly does not want a Palestinian state based on 1967 lines and has not proposed a viable solution. Instead he’s quite happy to condone settler violence, believes the IDF is the world’s most moral army, is bulldozing Palestinians’ ancestral villages, having more and more checkpoints to herd the innocent Palestinians like sheep etc. And we have to ask the Gazans, who have little to no legal recourse (it’s even illegal to rebuild their own homes, they’re simply allowed to “return”), very little food, water and fuel etc., what they want as a solution? If all they’ve known is death and destruction, can you blame them for not trusting the Israeli government?

Too many people holding extremist views on both sides.

I share your hope for more moderate voices on both sides asap @dairydebris

I dont believe you're posting in good faith. In particular your third paragraph seems quite disconnected to reality.

You don't believe it's common for Palestians to want to remove Israelis from the land? But yet Gaza voted for Hamas? I know that was a while ago. I've linked to a much more recent poll by the Guardian showing significant not majority support for Hamas. In particular note this part-

When it comes to long-term political futures in Gaza, slightly less than half (48%) of Palestinians remain supportive of some form of a two-state solution. Others said the more realistic scenarios for ending the conflict involve the displacement of Jews from the region (20%), or the establishment of one state under strict sharia law (27%), in which Jews would have fewer rights. Only 5% believed in a one-state solution with coexistence under equal rights.

Whole article here-

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/feb/21/people-gaza-future-hamas-poll

What is Hamas if not a national movement to remove Jews from the land?

The extremists on both sides are responsible for the ongoing slaughter.

Let's hope for more moderate voices on both sides asap.

I believe that Israelis and Palestinians can co-exist. I do not agree with the actions of Hamas nor the IDF, but even without the existence of Hamas, the Israeli government has been persecuting innocent Palestinians for decades so I do believe it’s a complex situation where Palestinians do have a right to defend themselves, they have a right to protect themselves from genocide. Israel is attacking ambulances, hospitals, schools, blocking aid etc. and this has been going on for far longer than 7/10 so I believe the Israeli government should be held accountable for its actions as well as its human rights violations not to mention blocking aid time and time again. Armed settlers attacking communities might be on the rise, but settler violence isn’t anything new. Villages are constantly being bulldozed or destroyed but the Palestinians are not allowed to rebuild and so if your home is destroyed, to fix and rebuild and construct a new home is considered illegal.

@2024onwardsandup The context and intent matters. For instance, someone who supports the IDF, the “world’s most moral army”, and the current Israeli government, it might seem as though there is genocidal intent. But to many innocent Palestinians and those who are in favour of human rights, would argue that it means something completely different and that it simply means that Palestinians have a right to self-determination, to not live an apartheid state, to live in their homeland as free and equal citizens, neither dominated by others nor dominating them.