Hamas and Gazans revolting

@Mylegishangingoff

"Are you implying that I support Hamas because it sounds that way?

You support Hamas is a pathetic way to argue your point at this stage"

At no point did I say that you personally support Hamas, only that there appears to be a greater level of support for Hamas from Western protesters than there is from actual Gazans.

But it's good to hear that you condemn Hamas and support their removal from power.

Given that we both share this view then I trust that you also agree that the only permanent way for this conflict to end is the removal of Hamas from power and the sooner the better.

@quantumbutterfly

"I wonder what an anti-hamas/pro-gazan rally would look like."

Perhaps ask @Mylegishangingoff on this?

@Mylegishangingoff

"Why at this point when Israel are purposefully starving little children to the point that 1000s of babies have reached a critical stage of starvation are you still here spreading propaganda? I don't get it, genuinely why do you feel the need to help the Israeli government along with their dehumanising of Palestinians after they have been clear that they plan to ethnically cleanse Palestinians from the area. Does it feel good playing a little part in that?"

I think we would all agree that ending this conflict is in the Palestinians, the Israelis and everyone's interests.

However if the conflict ends with Hamas still in power then the conflict will simply start again in a few years time. Hamas openly admits to using innocent Palestinian civilians as human shields and that the more Palestinian civilians that die the better for their cause.

The only way for this horrible conflict to end is for Hamas to be removed from power. Now this can be done through the current conflict with further loss of life on all sides or it can be done by ordinary Gazans (supported and encouraged by protesters in the West) to continue their opposition to Hamas and remove them from power.

It is truly a perplexing and depressing state of affairs that there seems to be more support for Hamas from western protesters than there is from ordinary Gazans.

@Mylegishangingoff

"Why at this point when Israel are purposefully starving little children to the point that 1000s of babies have reached a critical stage of starvation are you still here spreading propaganda? I don't get it, genuinely why do you feel the need to help the Israeli government along with their dehumanising of Palestinians after they have been clear that they plan to ethnically cleanse Palestinians from the area. Does it feel good playing a little part in that?"

I think we would all agree that ending this conflict is in the Palestinians, the Israelis and everyone's interests.

However if the conflict ends with Hamas still in power then the conflict will simply start again in a few years time. Hamas openly admits to using innocent Palestinian civilians as human shields and that the more Palestinian civilians that die the better for their cause.

The only way for this horrible conflict to end is for Hamas to be removed from power. Now this can be done through the current conflict with further loss of life on all sides or it can be done by ordinary Gazans (supported and encouraged by protesters in the West) to continue their opposition to Hamas and remove them from power.

It is truly a perplexing and depressing state of affairs that there seems to be more support for Hamas from western protesters than there is from ordinary Gazans.

Are you standing up for Hamas? I am confused

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4g71lk09npo

I think it's a real positive that brave Gazans are now protesting against Hamas openly demonstrating at least some of the population can see it is Hamas that has brought death and destruction to the enclave.

The irony is that war trodden Gazans are protesting in harsh conditions possibly risking death against Hamas while in your average 'Pro Palestine' March in London there are very limited signs with Hamas out. Should we start anti Hamas protests in the UK in solidarity with Gaza?

Confused in what way?

Are you standing up for Hamas? I am confused

That reminds me of the celebrated Palestinian author Ghassan Kanafani and member of the PFLP, who was assassinated by Mossad in Lebanon in 1972. He remains a revered figure throughout the Arab world.

Hamas took control of Gaza in 2007. With the funding it receives from international aid, Hamas could have built infrastructure, health care, and education systems for its population. Instead, it has created rockets and tunnels to attack Israel, turning Gaza into a wasteland and keeping the Palestinian population in poverty.

Meanwhile, Hamas leaders siphon billions of dollars in aid for personal enrichment. Hamas has failed the Palestinian citizens who hoped for peace and prosperity. This war will not stop all the while Hamas exists.

Senior Hamas official sparks outrage in Gaza after referring to war casualties as ‘material calculations’

A senior Hamas official has drawn widespread anger from Gaza residents after referring to the high death toll in the Strip as “material calculations.”

In a recent interview, Qatar-based Hamas senior official Sami Abu Zuhri remarked that the number of births in Gaza — around 50,000 — exceeds the number of war casualties, which he claimed demonstrates that the losses do not reflect the broader picture of the conflict.

He added, “The martyrs [killed in the war] — the wombs of Gaza’s women will give birth to twice as many. This is the price that must be paid. If we thought in material terms, we would not be able to hold onto our land.”

The interview, which originally aired in late March on a podcast, resurfaced in recent days and quickly went viral, prompting a wave of backlash from Gaza residents who viewed the comments as deeply disrespectful to the tens of thousands killed.

One Gaza resident filmed himself responding: “A man outside the Strip says that everyone who was killed can simply be replaced. This is someone deluded beyond reason — he’s not one of us.”

Another resident posted a video saying: “Hamas leadership says — so what if 60,000 people died? Someone else will take their place. Osama Abu Zuhri, you’re speaking from outside the Strip. Your children are outside the Strip. You ignite this war, and we are the fuel?!”
The outrage also spilled into the streets. During an anti-Hamas protest held yesterday in Khan Younis, demonstrators directly condemned Abu Zuhri’s remarks, chanting: “Oh Abu Zuhri, you disgrace, even the child wants to live.”

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/senior-hamas-official-sparks-outrage-in-gaza-after-referring-to-war-casualties-as-material-calculations/

Senior Hamas official sparks outrage in Gaza after referring to war casualties as ‘material calculations’

A senior Hamas official has drawn widespread anger from Gaza residents after referring to the high death toll in the Strip as “material calculations.”

In a recent interview, Qatar-based Hamas senior official Sami Abu Zuhri remarked that the number of births in Gaza — around 50,000 — exceeds the number of war casualties, which he claimed demonstrates that the losses do not reflect the broader picture of the conflict.

He added, “The martyrs [killed in the war] — the wombs of Gaza’s women will give birth to twice as many. This is the price that must be paid. If we thought in material terms, we would not be able to hold onto our land.”

The interview, which originally aired in late March on a podcast, resurfaced in recent days and quickly went viral, prompting a wave of backlash from Gaza residents who viewed the comments as deeply disrespectful to the tens of thousands killed.

One Gaza resident filmed himself responding: “A man outside the Strip says that everyone who was killed can simply be replaced. This is someone deluded beyond reason — he’s not one of us.”

Another resident posted a video saying: “Hamas leadership says — so what if 60,000 people died? Someone else will take their place. Osama Abu Zuhri, you’re speaking from outside the Strip. Your children are outside the Strip. You ignite this war, and we are the fuel?!”
The outrage also spilled into the streets. During an anti-Hamas protest held yesterday in Khan Younis, demonstrators directly condemned Abu Zuhri’s remarks, chanting: “Oh Abu Zuhri, you disgrace, even the child wants to live.”

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/senior-hamas-official-sparks-outrage-in-gaza-after-referring-to-war-casualties-as-material-calculations/

It might be called asylum seeking when/if they leave, that remains to be seen.

Perhaps it might normally be called ‘seeking asylum’ as a refugee with the hope of return, unless the offer ensures a house, resettling money and citizenship in a, friendly country and is freely chosen.

It’s just a poll @ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend

How you interpret the findings is up to you. I think it’s pretty obvious they are only saying they would leave Gaza due to the war not out of a free choice in the matter.

I don’t think saying “emigrating” gives an unrealistic view that they are doing it the way others might emigrate who aren’t living in a war zone.

There is a method here.

Hamas are haemorrhaging support since the blockade as their people are obviously angry and they can't support themselves through stealing good and seeking it on to support its troops.

The plan is for private companies to distribute aid so preventing Hamas from using the food for profit or to severe it towards its supporters. Alternative means of food distribution may be the death knell of Hamas and it's implosion would obviously lead to ad different political situation in terms of peace. As has been said many times before there can be no peace with Hamas.

Hamas want to protect the current food distribution route through relief agencies which they have penetrated so are more than willing to allow scene of deprivation to 'escape' Gaza to pressure foreign governments to sustain the current model. Let's face it PR is their only weapon in this war.

I think a lot of Palestinians do want to leave as simply the prospects of a sustainable peace ever where their families are safe is as remote as ever. I think in the West we are being a bit arrogant denying them this desire to leave as it doesn't suit the agenda of Palestinian resistance from some quarters. We haven't been in a Palestians shoes so can't relate to the utter human desire for safety that must the prevalent.

Reconstruction fund declarations at the moment are simply political rhetoric alongside calls for a two state solution. The objective reality I think is that the moment has passed for state negotiations and massive reconstruction. The antagonism between the combatants is just too high.

A hope for an internal revolt against Hamas does seem to me the only possible viable route to some.ceasefire but there would need to be a new government that would stamp down on terrorism.

Israeli government is ” Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part” - one of the conditions of genocide.

Amazing to see how pollsters can carry out opinion polls but food aid is blocked. What’s surprising is that the number of people who would remain and be starved and bombed while living in tents with no water or sanitation.

The article is by Joel C Rosenberg, American Israeli Zionist and former associate of Mr Netanyahu. “Allarab”news isn’t really an Arab either- it’s Christian Zionist US registered , run by said Rosenberg in Israel, and it’s one of those murky little “not for profits” . No doubt the poll will undergo amplification in the usual way onward into more mainstream media to create an illusion of support for the Trump proposal to ethically cleanse Gaza and resettle.Most people would not stay in their house if it had no sewage, water and the structure was unsafe, but it couldn’t be considered as leaving voluntarily