The future for Muslims in the UK is "bleak and dystopian"

Lucky you. It's humiliating and under mining in a professional context. And as I mentioned up thread, not being spoken to directly in boardroom meetings but via my (male) assistant. It's not appropriate behaviour in the UK to do that to women in the workplace.

Yes absolutely it does. Anyone who refuses to integrate - rejects the culture, actively ignores or tries to impose their culture and religion in another country and refuses to learn the language should not be welcome in that country.

Should I have said if 'one' is calling for?....I was answering your part about what the real far right would be doing ( as extremists), those who would consider themselves on 'the left' have done similar things in recent times.
I think it's important to discover what breeds extremism and deal with its cause not just its symptoms. I'm sure you'll feel free to disagree.

Is it just misogyny in the Muslim religion you have an issue with? Because it exists in most faiths. FWIW I have never know a Muslim man to have an issue with shaking my hand.

Oh wow, I don't know where to start with your comments.
I don't think there's any point really but I will just say that I work with about six Muslim men and we have a right laugh every day! Perfectly normal, friendly, respectful, funny, kind human interactions.

I see your edit.

The problem is you describe a set of horrible things that have happened. You then ask if they are the work of the "far right"?

I don't know any more. What do you mean by "far right"? It doesn't mean what it used to mean as people now use it to describe Reform and Conservative voters. So with that definition I would say no those horrible things are not done by the "far right" as your average conservative voter doesn't usually go rioting. So if it's not them then how do you describe the people do DID actually do those things? And I don't know the word to use any more.

I think other branches of other religions also condemn same sex relationships, abortion and sex equality. It's by no means confined to some Muslims. I do think it's important to maintain a British culture, based on tolerance and civic responsibility, and that it should be a requirement for all citizens to follow it. I suppose controversial religious views are a private matter, and as long as they are not publicly expressed or acted upon we have to accept that people of all religions may hold them.

Sorry so what are you saying? I don't want to misuderstand you. I described people who identify as far right and support far right groups and political parties who went on racist hunts of Muslims far right and you said if we call them that then what will we call the real far right when they come. I asked who they'd be and what they'd be doing you said they would be taking a dislike to the same group of people disliked by Mosley. If you didn't mean that the real far right would be attacking Jewish people and if they're not then I'm incorrectly applying the term far right what did you mind?

In the 80s did we not call people racist people who went around attacking foreigners and were members or supportive of far right groups far right? What did it mean instead in the 80s?

Isn't bleak and dystopian a natural result of strict sharia law, which is a fundamental principle of Islam?

But strange that a Muslim man will shake a man's hand in a work context without any problem at all....

No I'm not saying that. I can't make myself clearer. The first paragraph was answering your weird request for me to say what I think the far right would do.

My second was my point that people have over used the term far right to include reform and conservative voters and it has lost its power. Do we now need caveats? Do we need additional words? Eg "the "real" far right. The "actual " far right. The "far" far right?

The phrase used to mean something in the 80s. Now twats like Lineker have used it inappropriately and it has lost its power.

No I'm not saying that. I can't make myself clearer. The first paragraph was answering your weird request for me to say what I think the far right would do.

My second was my point that people have over used the term far right to include reform and conservative voters and it has lost its power. Do we now need caveats? Do we need additional words? Eg "the "real" far right. The "actual " far right. The "far" far right?

The phrase used to mean something in the 80s. Now twats like Lineker have used it inappropriately and it has lost its power.

I’m Spanish. No I don’t want to shake hands (or kisses) to strangers either. And I’m glad that Covid showed us that we can polite and have good manners without any physical contact.

Yes. It's better not to discuss this issue at all and tell everyone they are racist. It's working well in the UK. God knows what will happen when that weird stuff on Twitter comes out about Keir Starmer and Southport. I am actually really quite concerned.

So you're saying when far right violence is aimed at Jewish people we can call it far right but when it's aimed at Muslim people we can't call it far right (despite it being carried out by the same far right people)

Edited to add - I'm not Gary Linekar using it to describe the labour party. I'm using it to describe the people hunting and advocating hunting British Muslims and asylum seekers. You can take up however Gary uses it with him but you had an issue with me using it for people hunting down a group they've perceived as "other" and "enemy" .

Look, speaking as a random member of the British public, I appreciate there is a difference between Muslims and islamists.

However, without engaging in extensive conversation with people I can't tell the difference on sight and I am also aware that the majority of terror attacks are carried out by islamists.

Therefore I do draw back a bit and think about my safety when I see visible Muslims.

(I would never speak to a obviously Muslim man anyway as I'm aware that they have rules about not touching women they don't know and Muslim men have been known to refuse to shake hands or even speak with women in business contexts so I assume that they are best left alone)

Ok if you really want me to write down what I, not a member of the far right as far as I am aware, think they might do I will try. If we look historically at the far right in Europe they seem to focus on a particular religious group you are correct. Moseleys facists in the UK didn't like that group either.

I can't really continue with this because it's pointless. My original point was that the phrase "far right" is also being over used and it's now losing its power. If you use it like Gary Lineker for anyone not in the Labour Party how will you describe the real far right?

I think it is reasonable enough when you look at the current state of many Muslim majority countries and to not want to import those issues to western countries.

I’m sorry @Scirocco that your thread with a valid reason to be scared about has turned into a racist thread

Well we're a divided country, aren't we? Because I don't actually know anyone who has a problem with the marches in support of Palestine. Many white British people I know are actively participating. Guess what, an increasing number of Jewish people are joining in too!
These protests are taking place all over the world. Not everyone feels like standing back and watching in silence.

So you have no idea what the far right would be doing, and we are talking about the actions people who identify as far right or support far right groups but we cant describe them as far right in case there's a future imaginary far right that you're not sure what would be different about them but we need to save the words far right for them? 🤔 Ok...

Does this apply to British as well when they move abroad to live ? Because many of those living in my country haven’t assimilate it and many of them don’t know the language.

So like the rise of a far right political party that was supported en masse by the people that were hunting Muslims in the street? But we aren't allowed to describe any of them as far right until they are in power to actually enact their racist policies?
Where did I call for elimination or silencing of anyone? I'm literally engaging in a debate where I'm asking people to speak and explain their viewpoints so how am I doing that? Asking people to explain their stated position is examining their viewpoint, how is it now?

Editing to add - if someone corrects something incorrect a PP stated, that's not shouting them down. If you don't have anything to back up what you're saying that isn't you being silenced or treated unfairly.

I have no idea what the real far right would be doing. I don't know what the definition of "far right" is any more as it's regularly used for members of the Conservative party.