The future for Muslims in the UK is "bleak and dystopian"

Bloody hell you've all dragged every topic you can think of into one post to stick it to the Muslims haven't you. @Scirocco I came on to write something from a muslim perspective but this is one of those threads I can see has now become a muslim bashing one. Speaks for itself really.

I'm also wondering what dystopian means in the context of the article

This isn't so much about the personal to me, I'm pretty much nice to everyone as interactions go and find the same in return but I do feel strongly that some non western countries are not for women and girls in a way I would want for my dd or any dc here.

It is a difficult topic to approach

And lose the client.

This is the quandary women face. Let's hope that all men behave in future and we don't start going backwards.

I would call out someone who did that and ask them to explain the reasons why he won’t shake a woman’s hand (preferably in front of other people)

No reason why we should have to just accept this - at least make him look ridiculous!

If I complained about a client not shaking my hand, could he accuse me of religious discrimination? Or could I accused him of sexual discrimination? We would lose the client due to his bad manners I suppose. Do I make a stand? Women have to I know. Men don't have this problem. As usual...

I am not minimising your experience but you don't have to accept how you are being treated in the workplace whether they are your clients or not. Every workplace should have their own respect and dignity policy which outlines their values and how employees should and should not be treated. That is in your power. I don't think equating all Muslim men with your experience appropriate.

But we can't keep politics out of it when there are far right political groups who are courting these people and driving their racism through propaganda and in turn those people are then supporting and voting or donating to those political groups. They aren't just racist criminal thugs with no political home which is what you're trying to suggest as they're entwined. The telegram channels they are grouping on for example aren't just them discussing racist rhetoric, they also have ideals they would like enforced politically. I didn't call them right wing, I called them far right. They're not the same so I don't know why you and @quantumbutterfly are trying to turn the discussion to right wing parties or the conservatives as they're not the topic.

Well, if you pray silently in your head against abortion and you live in an exclusion zone around an abortion clinic, you can be arrested. No joke!

https://www.thefp.com/p/abortion-buffer-zones-united-kingdom-free-speech-arrested-for-praying-in-her-head

oops! 😮

I'm sorry I don't really understand what you're saying here. Who is calling for that and how?

I think it's important to discover what breeds extremism and deal with its cause not just its symptoms. I'm sure you'll feel free to disagree.

I don't disagree with that at all. I think people saying why they believe something is important as most of it is based on misinformation and propaganda hence correcting any spread on this thread yet you've implied that doing that silencing people?

In their tweed..

Yes, that's not ok either.

ikr, those right wing thugs that rioted in Croydon a few years back...typical tory voters.

Do most Muslim men happily shake a woman's hand? From my lived experience (and don't minimise it please) no not all. I see upthread that some people have experienced a refusal to shake hands too. This needs to be called out. And it is clients not work staff. The Muslims who worked in my firm were well mannered and would never be so rude as to refuse to shake a woman's hand in the UK.

Are we talking about the same Keir Starmer who recieved huge backlash by the Hindu community for serving beef and beer at the annual diwali party hosted for British Hindus?

The trick.is (and Starmer should take note if he's feverishly reading mumsnet posts) is to keep politics out of it. They don't need to be "right wing" or "left wing" in the way they see how the economy is run (which is essentially the political difference). They are just racist criminal thugs. That describes them perfectly well in my opinion. If you want to add an economic edge to it, go for it but it seems counter productive.

I'd fully favour your home country passing whatever laws they felt appropriate. I lived overseas and learned their language despite 'everyone speaking English' and tried to assimilate into their culture with no desire to change it.

Me neither, my Muslim colleagues shake womens hands all the time.
And anyway we have different customs for treating men and women in the west too. Even amongst my very liberal, western friends, the blokes will usually greet their female friends with a peck on the cheek and the men get a slap on the back. All cultures have slightly different customs for men and women.

No it is not so address it in your workplace, don't assume all Muslim men are the same.

But I didn't call the conservatives party far right. I'm calling the thugs who attacked Muslims as far right (many of whom identify as far right and clearly engage in telegram channels that are far right) and you're telling me not to use those words as the "real far right" may come. I've asked you to define who they would be and what they'd be doing that's different to the far right actions we already have going on (othering and blaming and inviting hate and violence against a particular ethnic group) and you haven't said. I have repeated quite a few times who I'm calling far right so I'm not sure why you are asking me who I'm referring to when I say far right as you clealry know who because you are critiquing me for calling them far right.