US doctors letter : Death toll in Gaza likely close to 120k

Thank you @Kindatired

Today there’s an account of a survey of returned Healthcare in the New York Times. Sixty five of them surveyed in US after returning from Gaza.
44 doctors, nurses and paramedics saw multiple cases of preteen children who had been shot in the head or chest in Gaza.
63 doctors, nurses and paramedics observed severe malnutrition in patients, Palestinian medical workers and the general population.
52 doctors, nurses and paramedics observed nearly universal psychiatric distress in young children and saw some who were suicidal or said they wished they had
25 doctors, nurses and paramedics saw babies who had been born healthy return to hospitals and die from dehydration, starvation or infections caused by their malnourished mothers’ inability to breastfeed and a lack of infant formula and clean water.
53 doctors, nurses and paramedics saw many children suffering from easily preventable infections, some of whom died from them
64 doctors, nurses and paramedics observed that even the most basic medical necessities, like soap and gloves, were usually unavailable in Gaza

So this shows why the death toll will be so high when the final numbers are calculated. It also shows strong evidence for genocidal intent in the targeting of children from the group was noted independently by a number of those surveyed. No wonder Israel tries to return the bodies in an unidentified state.

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That's the most devastating and horrifying letter.

Thank you for sharing @EasterIssland

@SharonEllis I wrote politely and don't see a problem with it. Report to MN if you do? I do not wish to distract from the topic of the thread further.

Give over, everyone can see exactly what you wrote.

Can I also gently point out that Israel would not have invaded Lebanon if Israeli ministers had accepted a US-French mediated ceasefire with Hezbollah on 26 September?

“Western Diplomats: Israeli Ministers' Rejection of Hezbollah Cease-fire Could Lead to All-out War. Members of Netanyahu's cabinet have staunchly opposed the U.S.-French proposal for a 21-day cease-fire between Israel and Hezbollah, with his office dismissing reports of an imminent deal”
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-09-26/ty-article/.premium/ministers-blast-israel-hezbollah-cease-fire-netanyahu-war-to-continue-in-full-force/00000192-2d2d-db7a-a997-adbdbb5d0000

@SharonEllis I don't demand you express anything. As I said, it is your right if you choose to comment on how the figure of 120k dead might affect you. It's the subject of the thread.

American negotiators are saying Hamas don’t want a ceasefire.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/04/us/politics/sinwar-hamas-israel-hezbollah-iran.html

I would also gently point out that Israel is responding to aggression started by Hezbollah. If they hadn’t fired into Israel then Israel wouldn’t be there right now.

Sorry, what? You have no idea how often and how deeply I have expressed emotion for those who have died in Israel & Gaza. What right have you to demand how and when I should express it and why do you have to involved? My post was a response to someone's nonsensical post & now I have to jump to your tune?

@SharonEllis I agree that it isn't only democratic societies that cause death and destruction. It's a peculiar fact that humans have never grown out of war, despite great advances in other areas. I'm a little stunned that you express no emotion at death on such a huge scale in a relatively short period. I suppose you choose not to comment on it, which is your right, of course.

Its not a competition & I dont think the death of a Palestinian is more or less horrifying than the death of a Nigerian.

But my post was a response to the person claiming that 'democratic societies are the ones causing all this death and destruction around the world'. Which is clearly total nonsense.

I think that all the players in this conflict are indeed adopting 'an ends justify the means' approach.

I struggle to see how sniping preteen children, destroying the health infrastructure, blocking humanitarian aid (paid for by other countries), destroying wells and water treatment plants, refusing evacuation of civilian refugees, and refusing the entry of independent investigators and journalists are realistic means to the ends of defeating Hamas and rescuing the hostages.

The dots do not connect.

Terrible as those figures are, they are nowhere near 120k, and I think the figure itself is horrifying. Imagine a graveyard with all those graves marked - the scale must surely give pause for thought.

I agree, normally we would have war correspondents on the ground reporting what is going on. The CPJ issued a sobering report on the lack of access of journalists to Gaza, the detaining of them, and the killing of journalists by Israeli authorities.

On a per capita basis, Israeli authorities now hold the highest number of detained journalists in the world in a given year over the past two decades, followed by Turkey, Iran, and China.

More journalists and media workers [128] have died in the Israel-Gaza war than in any other year since CPJ began documenting journalist killings in 1992. By comparison, 56 journalists were killed in Iraq in 2006 – the next deadliest year. The targeted or indiscriminate killing of journalists, if committed deliberately or recklessly, is a war crime.

https://cpj.org/2024/10/one-year-and-climbing-israel-responsible-for-record-journalist-death-toll/

CPJ’s board of directors: https://cpj.org/about/board-of-directors/.

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It's been long-standing. People tend not to want it talked about though.

Yes, I think Israel and Hamas seem to both be using that 'ends justifying means' approach. Some of the objectives Israel stated at the start of the conflict seem things it would be hard for any reasonable person to oppose, such as seeking the release of hostages and the bringing to justice of terrorists, but I do struggle to see how the current actions are justifiable - not to the people making the decisions (who appear to think anything is acceptable), but to the people supporting them and keeping them in positions where they can continue to make such choices.

Personally, I feel that nothing - absolutely nothing - justifies either the atrocities of October 7th or the atrocities afterwards, including intentional targeting of children and the torture of detained healthcare workers. Yet people have passionately minimised and dismissed previous reports of these things. I suppose it's hard sometimes to see where some people's 'red lines' are in terms of what is acceptable and what isn't... what would it take for people to say "no, I can't stand alongside this while you do it"...? (that's not to say you've done that at all, as I don't think you have and I do appreciate your perspective).

These are important questions. There are far too many instances where the IDF have exceeded acceptable limits. The haunting story of little Hind is only one example.

Reading these letters made me cry.

Our reality is so different to those who are currently undergoing this onslaught of daily violence.

#CeasefireNow