Hezbollah and Iran 'poised to attack Israel this week'

I've often seen "I hope Israel get what it deserves" posted on this board so I guess that extends to the sentiment that death, injury and destruction inflicted upon innocent people is acceptable and justifiable as long as it's Jews, followed by the predictable outrage when the Israelis take steps to prevent Iran and its proxies attacking

You stated I've often seen "I hope Israel get what it deserves" posted on this board which would suggest you are referring to people that post on this board with your further statement of so I guess that extends to the sentiment that death, injury and destruction inflicted upon innocent people is acceptable and justifiable as long as it's Jews,

If you don't mean posters on these boards you might want to delete and rephrase your post.

It's interesting that although I never mentioned the "Pro-Palestinian posters", you automatically assumed that's who I was referring to and felt the need to jump to such an elaborate defence.

Don't worry , I've been educated.
I mainly posted because @ScrollingLeaves made a comment about ordinary people using the term to refer to extremists and I believe this is correct.
The comment is ,IMO, correct. Not that people are correct to hold that view.

It shows just how successful the anti-Israel propaganda is and proves that the word has, in fact, been misappropriated.

Hopefully you have taken onboard what we're saying and you and others on here can now use the word correctly moving forward. The last thing the world needs is more hateful propaganda being spread.

To be clear - being a Zionist means you believe in the right for Jewish self-determination in a (predominantly) Jewish state in the ancestral Jewish homeland. It does NOT mean you don't believe in a two state solution. As such, if someone says they're anti-Zionist, what they're actually saying is they are against Jewish self-determination and against the existence of the state of Israel. It means you don't think Jewish people should have the same rights as you think everyone else is entitled to. Being anti-Zionist is being racist, so seeing "anti-Zionism" placards at the recent "anti-racism" marches was spectacularly mind-blowing.

I'm a Zionist who wants a peaceful two-state solution.

@ScrollingLeaves I've not been on this board before but I've been reading the comments about the interpretation of the word Zionist.
I'm embarrassed to say that my understanding was what you describe and that I had the idea that Zionism = extremism.
You're not wrong in saying that this is a common misconception.

Who will end this bloodshed!

I get the impression Hezbollah aren't particularly committed to peace (neither with Israel nor in Lebanon) so probably not them.

this is awful. It’s all just chaos. And look how many Palestinians have been killed. It is all just out of control and inhumane at this point.

Who will end this bloodshed!

It seems a shame that the response to Jews who've taken the time to politely explain the meaning of what a Zionist is and what the term means to them is that you'll be continuing to redefine and misappropriate that term because you know better how it's perceived by "ordinary people" and therefore it now espouses far-right extremism rather than the belief in Jewish self-determination in their own homeland. Telling a Zionist that someone with their beliefs is not considered a Zionist due to its meaning being reclassified by a group of ordinary people who are avowedly anti-Zionist and therefore actively seek to invalidate Zionism,* *as if that's a totally reasonable thing to do to a particular minority group regarding their own terms, beliefs and definitions.

People struggle with the concept of Zionist Jews believing Palestinians also have the right to their own state if it clashes with their own preferred definition of Zionist Jews being exclusively extremist right wing land grabbers, which is a definition anti-Zionists have worked very hard to make the dominating narrative. If you can acknowledge it's a misconception, why aren't you doing anything to challenge it rather than reinforce it?

No I personally do not think you share Ben-Givr’s beliefs on other issues just because you are both Zionists. Not that I would have known you were a Zionist.

Misconception though it may be, ordinary people would think Ben-Givr epitomised Zionism, while thinking someone with your beliefs is not a Zionist.
You may call that disingenuous at best but I am not sure why. It is ignorance at best.

Another poster on here once explained to me that indeed someone who believes Israel is their homeland, can also believe that Palestinians should have their own state, and be a Zionist.

I respect what she said and was grateful for the explanation. Nevertheless I don’t use the term ‘Zionist’ because its meaning in common use seems to have become unclear in practice so it can be confusing.

The extreme far-right beliefs of a certain faction seem to be associated with an idea that all the land is theirs, including the West Bank. That unfortunately is perceived as Zionism.

It is unfortunate that that far right extreme group have so much power.

Hezbollah said they have completed their retaliation for the assassination and have finished now.

I'll bet they did. And they really, really mean it this time.

And the many rockets Hezbollah has been firing into Israel for 10 months now was for what?

That's great news. I hope that calm stays.

For anyone who has not seen it, BBC TV news on just now reported that Hezbollah said they have completed their retaliation for the assassination and have finished now. The report also said the atmosphere is calmer than it had been after a month of suspense.

I assumed it was a guess because you said it was.

No, like I said I have seen pro Palestinian posters here consistently condemn violence, I have seen them consistently look for legal justice, I have seen nothing that would indicate suddenly after months of being loudly anti war and anti violence that that stance would change.

Right, so whatever an Israeli spokesperson says is incontrovertibly the truth if it involves a show of force whilst simultaneously being a lie about the reasons for that show of force. Whatever a Hezbollah spokesperson says, they're trying to save face and they didn't really mean it despite the fact they've been saying for weeks they were going to attack Israel. And then attacked Israel. But the timing was just coincidental. And it will come as a complete surprise to everyone when they do it again because they never said that.

Give me strength.

Have you got anything solid to back up your 'guess'?

It's not a guess, I'm quite sure you've been all over the board long enough to see it for yourself.

it would be good if you could link to the threads or posts where your 'guess' is coming from

It's not a guess but feel free to trawl through the hundreds of threads to prove me wrong as I've no plans to do that to prove I'm right, I know what I saw.

Maybe Hezbollah are trying to save face. They were planning to retaliate for the assignations Israel had carried out. They had not done so yet. (They said at one point they were waiting for the ceasefire/hostage release negotiations.)

Then Israel beat them to it last night, staying (in their own words) this was preemptive.
Then Hezbollah shot off all their rockets at northern Israel.

Hezbolllah are probably trying to say they had the last word - that this was their planned attack, so Israel’s attempt at a preemptive strike had not stopped them.

It seems all like a deadly honour/show of force in tit for tat.

Oh, and by the way, in his televised address, Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah warned that "the group [Hezbollah] will respond again if the results are deemed to be not enough" so stay tuned for more "Israel started it!".

This is a really nasty, serious accusation. Have you got anything solid to back up your 'guess'? Pro Palestinian posters on this board tend to be very anti-violence and have been hoping for a ceasefire for a long time as well as hoping for a deescalation of violence in the region in general. Lots of posters have spoken about how they hope that Israel are held to account for any breaches of international law and laws of humanity with lots of support being shown for the ICJ and the ICC, and hope that the suspected crimes will be investigated fully by independent bodies so the correct people can be brought before those courts and charged. It would appear to me that support for these courts is rather lacking on the 'Pro Israel' posters with lots of condemnation towards these legal methods of justice but I haven't ever seen a 'pro Palestinian' poster here who isn't in favour of legal justice.

I guess that extends to the sentiment that death, injury and destruction inflicted upon innocent people is acceptable and justifiable as long as it's Jews
^^ this seems like a rather large leap to me but it would be good if you could link to the threads or posts where your 'guess' is coming from because like I said I have only seen calls for a ceasing of violence and real want for legal justice to be brought against those violating laws and your accusations that people are wishing death, destruction and more on Jews specifically is really quite startling.

What do you call the views of Ben-Givr, Smotrich, etc? They are people particularly causing trouble. Are they or are they not Zionists? Maybe you think not, but people see them and their views and think that is what Zionism is, even if in reality there are Jewish people who are not at all like them, who would say they are Zionists but who simply understand this as meaning Israel is their home.

I don’t think people think all Jewish Israelis are like Ben-Givr ( and other far right extremism actors), but unfortunately his excesses, and influence in the coalition government and Netanyahu, may be affecting how Israel is perceived.

I wonder why.

That wasn't prompted by the Israeli airstrike, it was pre-planned and initiated by Hezbollah. You seemed to have missed Hezbollah's statement, so I'll repeat it for you:

Hezbollah has said it hit 11 Israeli military sites, fired more than 320 rockets and sent drones flying into northern Israel on Sunday as part of the “first phase” of its response to Israel’s killing of the movement’s top commander in a strike on Beirut last month.

Hezbollah said its attack involved more than 320 Katyusha rockets aimed at multiple sites in Israel and a “large number” of drones.
It later announced the military operation was “completed” for the day. The Lebanese group denied that Israel’s pre-emptive strikes, launched just before its own attack, affected its own operation. “The enemy’s claims about the pre-emptive action it carried out, the targets it struck and its disruption of the resistance’s [Hezbollah’s] attack, are empty,” Hezbollah’s statement read. It added that all drones were launched as scheduled “towards the desired targets”.'

You can read about it in the Guardian if you like.