This is the reality of what Israel is doing (part 4)

@YoYoYoYo12345

I know you are not defending the settlers, but can you see that dismissing them as "just settlers", completely minimises what is actually happening - thousands of armed settlers terrorising Palestinians off their land, with the complete support of the State of Israel, the IDF and Knesset ministers.

This isn't about some random settlers, this is about policy and, let's be frank, violent apartheid.

The post I was referring to with the list of people has since been deleted. As I've said numerous times to deaf ears I'm not defended the actions of the settlers 🙄

It is kind of rude because the independent fact checking and bias monitor has found Al Jazeera to be as credible as say BBC or SkyNews or CNN.

Your assertion that they can’t be credible because of Qatar funding seems like an anti-Arab bias on your part.

It’s not one sided bashing, there is an equal Hamas thread concurrently running with this thread. In fact, on the Israeli hostages thread posters were told to start a different thread about Palestinian detainees for the same reason.

This reason is that any time a single thread was policed to be “balanced” it descended into bun fights and polarisation. Keeping these in separate threads is what was agreed on.

Now let's look at what Israel's adversaries in this conflict are doing to bodies shall we? What state do you think Hadar Goldin's and Shaul Oron's bodies are in? What happened to Shani Louk's body? Was that not dehumanising?

No. You cannot dehumanise a dead human body. Abuse of a dead body is called corpse desecration not dehumanisation. These are two very different things and you are mis-using dehumanisation to describe corpse desecration.

It is dehumanisation of an ethnic group that then leads to all sorts of war crimes, including desecration of corpses and graves.

There is a Hamas thread for their war crimes.
This is not a general war crime thread, this is a thread focussed on what Israel is doing.
The balance is on the board.

You could always read the 8 pages quoting genocidal rhetoric some of which included dehumanisation submitted to the ICJ by South Africa earlier this year?

I didn't see that post at the time, and have only just seen it now you've referenced it. I'm also not a moderator, so if you have concerns about a post breaching guidelines you'd need to flag to someone who is if you want it reviewed. Alternatively, you could ask the poster directly to explain their meaning. I'm happy to PM someone to discuss, as I think it's important to be clear that not all Israelis support the IDF and government in these acts, just as not all Palestinians support the terrorists responsible for 7/10 and not all Lebanese people support the terrorists responsible for the rocket attacks in the north of Israel. I have friends in and from Israel as well as in and from Palestine (and Lebanon), and worry about all of them. None of them are terrorists or would throw people (living or dead) off buildings.

@StupidFarang

Fair point you just made (sorry I can't quote a quote on the app) about recognition of settler violence and that it doesn't affect most Israelis so they just get on with their lives.

I think where posters like me get frustrated is the lack of the connection made between the apartheid treatment of Palestinians in the WB (I.e. "yes well we don't condone that") and the seeming disregard that it has any knock on effect wrt Gaza.

The two are interlinked, but I find on this board that (generalisation alert) many if not most pro-Israel supporters completely disregard that.

E.g. "yes that's all terrible", and then just focus on Palestinian extremism, as if Israeli extremism is irrelevant.

However, most people in Israel are not affected by it so just go with the daily lives. It's true, many people are not particularly interested either.
This is the point I was trying to make. Many in the population are indifferent to it. It is similar to the thoughts and prayers you hear in the States when there's been a mass shooting, no action to prevent it just more thoughts and prayers.

The apathy means it is allowed to continue but it is a stain on the reputation of Israel. As the saying goes for all the evils in the world apathy is the most dangerous. This is why I find people's words about being disgusted by it pretty meaningless.

There certainly is. Maybe you should take this up with one of the most prolific posters on this board who only yesterday stated “I believe Israel citizens last week or week before where throwing Palestinians off roofs. They’ve also been executing Palestinians.”

If you don't udnerstand why then, respectfully, you need to read a bit more about Israeli politics and society.

First this violence really only started around the time of the 2nd intifada. There were settlemetns before then but it wasn't anarchy like this. However, most people in Israel are not affected by it so just go with the daily lives. It's true, many people are not particularly interested either. The second intifada, 7/10 have all created an atmosphere where no one really wants to take the part of the Palestinians given what has happened other than some on the left and, of course, Arab Israelis. Otherwise, Israelis now are not interested in the WB and the injustices happening - Gaza and now the North are what is dominating the news.

What has happened which is worse is that Ben Gvir controls the police. He has completely taken it over and got rid of the more professional senior police officers and replaced them with yes-men and political appointees. He has told them to handle extremist settlers with kid gloves, yet uses the full force of the police (and then some) against protesters.

There is talk now of a 3rd intifada and it's basically only the PA which is stopping this happening. It potentially could all blow up (plus the Temple Mount issues which aren't helping)

I have no idea what is rude about saying that Qatari funded sources are not credible. They aren't. It's absolutely nothing to do with whether someone is concerned about loved ones in palestine, Lebanon, Jordan or Israel.

Well, apart from the thread down below, I have commented on Israel in Gaza in another thead, I have written quite lengthy posts about what I'd like to see happen.. So i don't do "nothing but one sided bashing" That said, there is SO much insane and unfair one sided bashing of Israel on here that I end up being reactive to that rather than being able to share more thoughtful considerations.

Where's the misinformation? If you don't like a source, that doesn't mean everything in it is automatically untrue, so what evidence do you have to counter the documented accounts of these trucks transporting dead bodies?

Personally, I would not dismiss the feelings of others the way you have done in your posts here. People with loved ones in Palestine (and now Lebanon) deserve consideration of how they're spoken to, just like people whose loved ones were caught up in 7/10 or displaced from northern Israel. If you wouldn't speak in such a way to someone worried about a missing loved one who's Israeli, then you shouldn't speak in such a way to someone worried about a missing loved one who's Palestinian or Lebanese or any other nationality. Quite simply, it's rude.

Fair enough I missed that but unfortunately as I said up thread we hear constantly that everyone disagrees with settler violence yet it is not stopped in fact it is helped and supported by the Israeli government and IDF so it's hard to believe that so many people are disgusted by it when it was d so openly allowed to continue.

Coming from someone who does nothing but one sided bashing this post is so lacking in self awareness

No this conflict does not exist in a vacuum and highlighting atrocities on both sides is fair, denying or not acknowledging them, not so much

Only down thread I wrote about extremist settler violence being terrorist. I've actually started very few posts which weren't in response to others but the few I have done is directly saying israeli extremist settler violence is terrorist.
There you go.

Apologise for what? Saying I don't believe Qatari funded sources?

This is an open website and I can counter misinformation. Labelling a thread "The Reality of what Israel is doing" is not "I would like sympathy because I am worried about a loved one", that's entirely different.

Good no one is condoning what is being done by Hamas, just as no one is condoning Israel on this thread either from what I can see. However, the one sided Israel bashing is nuts. This conflict does not exist in a vacuum and it is entirely reasonable to look at what the other side is doing. Shame that you perceive that as being attacked.

Many of us on this site are concerned about loved ones, friends and colleagues affected by the conflict and in harm's way.

Reads quite different doesn't it?
No it doesn't

So can we focus and talk about Israel returning decomposed bodies?

Yes, I know you only post about Israel's war crimes and not anyone else's in this conflict. Nice to have balance.
Point me to your posts on Israeli war crimes? I am assuming if you're accusing someone of not having balance you have evidence for yours

All Palestinians or just some?

There's a difference between saying that sort of thing about members of an organisation or saying it about a nationality/ethnicity in general.

Yes, I know you only post about Israel's war crimes and not anyone else's in this conflict. Nice to have balance.

I have no problem with credible sources even if i don't like what they report. There's a big difference.

Interesting lack of apology or respect there.

Nobody here has condoned or sought to excuse any of the horrendous things done by Hamas. So trying to suggest otherwise isn't going to work. Hamas should be held accountable for their crimes and nobody here has said otherwise, that I can see.

The hypocrisy I can see is that shown by the people who disregard the pain and suffering of innocent people in Palestine and of those of us who have innocent people we care about in Palestine. If you don't care about or don't believe reports about the actions of Israel in Palestine (and now Lebanon too), you are able to choose not to read threads where the title makes it clear that the content is going to be about that. There is no need to come on to attack, make digs at, or try to hurt those of us who do have loved ones in harm's way. It's telling that some people feel the need to choose that course of action.