War Hezbollah and Israel

This is some info on the back ground of those running Israel and currently the IDF themselves are talking about Jewish terrorism running with free rein in the West bank
Otzma Yehudit, or “Jewish Power,” is, in fact, just the newest face of the old Kach party, the radical movement founded decades ago by the late Rabbi Meir Kahane, the most infamous Jewish extremist of the latter 20th century. By offering them a shot at government, Netanyahu is giving the stamp of approval to a party as rooted in terrorism as Hamas.That’s only been reinforced by his declaration on April 7 that he would annex the West Bank settlements — seen by Otzma Yehudit as part of Israel’s divine mandate.

Netanyahu’s Far-Right Partners Were Birthed by U.S. Terrorists – Foreign Policy

No, I have a problem with it not even being seen as shameful to support illegal occupiers who commit apartheid and have been breaking international law for decades. To support anyone that spout genocidal rhetoric, I clearly said that both sides should be loudly condemned.

I am saying that anyone, no matter the country or organisation, that breaks International law shouldn't be supported by our governments and our citizens.

No I for one don't expect Israel to turn the other cheek, but nor do I expect government ministers to publicly make frankly maniacal statements which just inflame an already catastrophic situation.

It isn't fair game to break international law though is it? I haven't seen any posters here calling Hezbollah or Hamas 'audacious'. I haven't seen people making jokes about blown up Israelis. They aren't supported by our governments, we aren't arming them and funding them and that's the right thing to do. It's the right thing to stop arming and funding anyone who breaks international law.

No other people would be required to turn the other cheek quite as much as Israel is expected to.

I think Palestinians, the people who have been living under apartheid and illegal occupation for decades and who aren't allowed an army to defend themselves, would very much disagree with your assessment.

What makes one side 'truly genocidal maniacs' and the other not? Both side spout genocidal rhetoric, both sides kill civillians, both sides break International law. It's not hard to see why illegal occupiers who have run a horrific apartheid regime for decades might not be popular with their neighbours. Just like it isn't hard to see why Hamas or Hezbollah may not be popular. They are all awful and that should be recognised.

@SharonEllis I am struggling to see the difference between Israel and Hamas/Hezbollah these days.

Could we just be clear - you are suggesting that there is some sort of equivalence between Israel and Hamas/Hezbollah - is that right?

It's illegal to support one 'side' but it isn't even seen as shameful to support the other.

And you have a problem with it being illegal to support the proscribed terrorist groups Hamas and Hezbollah - is that right?

@WonkyWay2 How do you see Israel turning its other cheek?

You are talking about Hamas/Hezbollah right and the lack of support for Israel? After all if you put Iran instead of “the West” you’d have hit the nail on the head.

Israel are repeatedly targeted by truly genocidal maniacs whose sole purpose is their destruction. No other people would be required to turn the other cheek quite as much as Israel is expected to. You can talk about a thin red line, but when the other side views it as fair game to break all international laws, Israel don’t have much choice. Or perhaps you could go there to police both sides and see where the levels of naivety being purported lead?

I think the problem people have is that yes both sides spout horrific rhetoric, both sides commit awful acts but one of those 'sides' is being armed by the West, one of those 'sides' is being openly supported.

It's disgusting and no doubt distressing for some to have to listen to people openly supporting a country whose elected government spouts genocidal rhetoric towards their families and friends. It's illegal to support one 'side' but it isn't even seen as shameful to support the other. How can people feel safe in a country where their government supports and arms a country that openly talks about committing wiping out people like them. People would be a lot less loud about it if both sides were treated the same way, if both sides were condemned by everyone and if arms sales to both were outlawed. The narrative needs to change, no matter who 'started it' or who is committing it, genocidal rhetoric, breeches of International law need to be a red line. Support of countries or organisations that do those things needs to be questioned and condemned by everyone, no excuses.

Yes reading it on bbc now. So frightening for people

www.bbc.com/news/live/c5y32qew9z2t

Ori Goldberg in +972 magazine Sept 20 2024

What Israelis don’t want to hear about Iran and Hezbollah
For years, Israeli expert Ori Goldberg has tried to challenge commonly-held assumptions about the Islamic Republic and its allies. Will anyone listen?

https://www.972mag.com/iran-israel-hezbollah-ori-goldberg/

(I do not know enough outside the general idea of fundamentalist Iran being a bad thing to comment on this but thought it was interesting.)

Thousands of people are receiving phonecalls and messages that they need to leave areas, including reports of parents receiving messages about their children's schools. People in Lebanon are scared - they've already seen how this unfolds.

I have just listened to the News at one on Radio 4. I urge you to listen to it. It should be available on BBC sounds.
It is chilling.

The statements coming from the current Israeli government (that I very much oppose) are terrible, but the rhetoric on both sides is like this. The focus on these statements, while overlooking the simple fact that Hizbollah started the violence, and have the power to stop the conflict on the Lebanese border tomorrow is very strange...

...but it is all so easy to solve. There is no occupation here, no control over borders. The negotiations aren't even requiring Hizbollah to move back to the Litani river in compliance with the (legally binding) Security Council resolution.

Hizbollah opened fire on October 8, supporting Iran's interests.

Don't think it's Israels role to decide what states should and shouldn't exist

Sorry - link

www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-09-22/ty-article/.premium/israeli-minister-claims-lebanon-is-not-a-sovereign-state-in-series-of-social-media-post/00000192-1a0f-dda5-a1d2-5b9f40ee0000

Haaretz

Israeli Minister Claims Lebanon Cannot Be Defined as State, IDF Should Establish 'Buffer Zone' Inside Its Territory
Israel's Diaspora Affairs Minister Amichai Chikli said that given the Lebanese government's 'failure to exercise its sovereignty over Hezbollah-controlled southern Lebanon,' the IDF had the right to 'take over' areas from which missiles could be fired into Israel

"Can't be defined as a state" sounds familiar.

And "create a buffer zone" on their land sounds familiar.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/30544300/israel-invasion-lebanon-hezbollah-war-pagers-bombs/

The Sun (not a great source by any means) has an article quoting an ex-Mossad person who suggests creating a "10km death zone" in another country is a reasonable thing to do.

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnewsvideo/s/yYsTm22Qxf

@MonoSilly a quick search of the quote brought up this video.

That's shocking. Do you have a reputable source @Auvergne63?

I have listened to an interview with the Israeli minister for education ( I don't know how to post the link ,sorry) who stated, and I quote, "Lebanon is going to be annihilated." The interviewer then asked him if he was aware that the term, in Hebrew, has heavy connotations. He apologised and said, and I quote again," Lebanon will cease to exist as we know it".
He didn't say Hezbollah will be annihilated, he didn't differentiate between terrorists and civilians.
I fear for the Lebanese people.