Is Israel on its way to being a "Failed State?"

Thanks, that's what I thought. Glad to have it confirmed. 👍

@Scirocco the name 'pharaoh' is linked to ancient Egyptians.

Should she also add the bit about what Israel does to Palestinian demonstrators?

https://www.hrw.org/news/2018/06/13/israel-apparent-war-crimes-gaza

Excusing myself from what?
Flipping what switch?
I am pretty sure I have always been Middle Eastern, thanks.

Please. B I will never apologise for when I think that is the case, and A I never said they were lying, I said they conveniently left out that they are also white. It’s a pet peeve of mine people conveniently rolling out brown as and when they’re called out.

Because you've accused someone of a) lying about their ethnicity and b) weaponising their ethnicity.

Why?

Honestly, just stop! You're making it worse! Those are outrageous accusations and you're just doubling down when you should.be withdrawing your comments and apologising!

What I find outrageous is to be accused to be anti semitic if I dare criticising the actions of the Israeli government/IDF.
Israel has the right to exist but not to behave like a terrorist state.

A bit off topic, but does anyone know when the last Egyptian royalty were referred to as pharaohs?

That poster is well aware that they are never going to be seen in the same way that Arabs who are considered poc and not white are seen. They are perfectly happy to weaponise that.

🤷🏿‍♀️

This is an outrageous accusation.

Thats the difference between Singapore and Israel.

Singapore sees itself as a country for all its inhabitants, regardless of race, language and religion, even though the proportion of ethnically chinese citizen is the same as the proportion of Jewish people in Israel- 70%. But it would never call itself a Chinese State. Singapore school children recite daily:
We, the citizens of Singapore, pledge ourselves as one united people, regardless of race, language or religion, to build a democratic society based on justice and equality so as to achieve happiness, prosperity and progress for our nation."

Israel sees itself as a Jewish state but 30% of its inhabitants are not Jewish. This is a problem in a sense that while it was set up to be a Jewish state, this narrative is not conductive to peace in such a volatile region. I am not saying i am against the concept of a Jewish state. But it can be a barrier if the other people see themselves as being oppressed by the Jewish majority or feel that their own interests are not respected.

But thats the thing- nation states are separate from ethnoreligions. Or at least successful nation states should be. The inability to separate the two or at least reconcile the two is problematic for those who do not regard themselves as part of the ethnoreligion.

Blackface is mocking the appearance of black people .Rejecting zionism can be antisemitic if you criticise zionism but sympathise with other movements of ethnocentric self determination. There are definitely people like that, i am not condoning that.

But like i said before, i separate criticism of the country from criticism of an entire people/culture. the latter is definitely not ok.

Poland and Hungary have very high scores on the freedom index. Poland scores about the same as France. That's very free, as the world goes.

Maybe add a section to your article on what Hamas does to Palestinian Protestors!

Here's just a taste to keep you busy!

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2015/05/gaza-palestinians-tortured-summarily-killed-by-hamas-forces-during-2014-conflict/

Singaporeans haven't been through Millenia of been accused of evil deeds, or endured multiple pogroms, genocides or human rights abuses based on wide-spread belief that their race is uniquely evil and deserving of being wiped off the planet. I observed today several tweets on X rejoicing in the idea of Jews being wiped from existence. I am sure you did not see that about Singaporeans today. Because people do not feel that hostility towards Singaporeans, and they do not make silly threads about them.

When you look at racism, you must look at it through the prism of the victim. For example, Blackface. A deeply insensitive white person (of which there are many) might bemoan being told they can't darken their skin with makeup to portray a Black person. "I wouldn't mind if you did whiteface" they will cry because they cannot show empathy and respect. But of course they are missing that racism and prejudice is always through the prism of it's victim.

I have listened to Black people describe how such behavior makes them feel dehumanised, that it perpetuates harmful racial stereotypes stripping them of their humanity and dignity. I listen when they tell me that, and as such would never do something like that. Even if I personally would not mind my own physical appearance being treated similarly, that does not deny their experience, because my race and identity has not historically been dehumanised in the same way as theirs has and they deserve better.

I struggle with why people seem to have this blind spot surrounding Jews.

If you call Hungary/Poland free. It is about as free as that.

Which is freer than most countries in the world but ben Gurion would be rolling in his grave.

I always wonder for israelis(who have other passports) what is the point of it all. You devote your life and energy to defending this country which sends your sons to war, doesn't care about you beyond your ability to produce jewish babies and who is happy to tax you heavily to fund people studying in yeshiva. You end up in your 30s renting and far behind financially relative to your peers in UK/USA/Europe and if you get taken hostage, the government doesn't care enough about you to negotiate properly for a release.

People who defend israel's actions unquestioningly, all that is just a license for the Israeli government to break the social contract with your relatives in Israel to an even greater degree cos the enemy is obviously external.

I can see it clearly only because my relatives in Israel are of limited means so it is clearer to me how crap the whole thing is and how they have basically wasted their 20s and early 30s. It is time they would never get back.

It is a tragedy.

This is interesting AnnieSnap.

Do Iran, North Korea, Russia, Saudi Arabia "oppress and kill people without compunction" that they are in active conflict with - or do they do it to their own actual citizens whilst not in an active conflict?

So, for example, are all countries at war a Pariah state? Or just Israel?

I'm not going to argue with such obvious delusions.

Off to write an article about how Israel has been testing new weapons on Palestinian protesters for decades instead.

well I am sure singaporeans wouldn't accuse you of being racist if you set up a thread saying- would singapore be a failed state.

It just wouldn't be very convincing as i am not sure what articles by any academics you can find which would propose the possibility of singapore as a failed state in the next 100 years.

I found you quite a few including from haaretz which is an Israeli paper.

Singapore did take good lessons from Israel - in the words of the First PM, Israel trained its army in the early years and we learnt how to be strong but also how not to use their strength. Sometimes a negative role model is as useful as a positive one given that Singapore is also surrounded by less than friendly neighbours.

And Israel is still a free, democratic country. If Palestine makes peace with it, it can be a free, democratic country if it chooses to be.

😂How do you know Spain isn't? Morocco? Ireland? Canada? Greenland? Singapore? New Zealand?

There is no evidence Israel resembles the situation in Venezuela. "How do you know it won't one day" is not an argument.

Anywhere could one day

Yes. Palestine is occupied by Israel. I think everyone knows this.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/06/israel-military-courts-palestinians-law-uk