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Conflict in the Middle East
Original poster

Yemen, Yemen make us proud, turn another ship around!

480 replies

noblegiraffe · 14/01/2024 21:40

"Yemen, Yemen make us proud, turn another ship around!" was being chanted on the streets of London yesterday and last week.

I'm just interested in whether people think this is a reasonable thing to be chanting or not, because there were quite a few people chanting it. So a quick poll:

OP posts:
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Original poster
noblegiraffe · 24/01/2024 22:51

And I thought the reason that they didn't want to accept refugees was because it doesn't believe they'd be allowed back and they'd be stuck with them, and also they would potentially destabilise their own population.

Arguments which make more sense than 'puppets of the West'.

Given that the West's supposed aim is ethnic cleansing of Gaza, you'd have thought that they'd be leaning on the neighbouring 'puppet' countries to take as many as they could leaving Gaza free for Israel. So that's not really a coherent argument.

OP posts:
SamFisherman · 24/01/2024 22:34

quantumbutterfly · 24/01/2024 22:27

Yes I expected that response.

Sure you did.

How about El-Sisi? Iraq's current gov't? Afghanistan (technically Asia)? Iran until the people decided they didn't want to be puppets?

UAE has huge amounts of Western investment and key agreements with Western nations for military bases. Saudi Arabia and the US are intertwined and have been working to bomb Yemen, the poorest ME nation, for literally over a decade, including doing a good war crime or two to the point that the Obama administration had to hush up the US involvement with double-tap revenge strikes in civilian areas controlled by Houthi rebels.

I mean, I guess it's far fetched to think the US would try and muscle in on oil rich places for power plays. They certainly never interfered in Hawaii, Cuba, Guatemala, Congo, South Vietnam, Chile, Nicaragua...

quantumbutterfly · 24/01/2024 22:27

Yes I expected that response.

SamFisherman · 24/01/2024 22:26

quantumbutterfly · 24/01/2024 22:25

You've obviously done much study on this issue, perhaps you could cite some of your publications so we could gen up and be as well informed as you.

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Nah. Then I'd be having to deal with more comments like this. I'm good.

quantumbutterfly · 24/01/2024 22:25

SamFisherman · 24/01/2024 22:19

The majority of the states in the ME are Western backed ones that have had leaders literally put in place by said Western nations in many instances. It's not some mystery here.

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You've obviously done much study on this issue, perhaps you could cite some of your publications so we could gen up and be as well informed as you.

SamFisherman · 24/01/2024 22:19

Papyrophile · 24/01/2024 12:39

Ask yourselves, Houthi and Hamas apologists, why are NONE of the Gulf states (except Qatar, which limits its hospitality to the biggest cheeses) offering sanctuary to their co-religionists?

The majority of the states in the ME are Western backed ones that have had leaders literally put in place by said Western nations in many instances. It's not some mystery here.

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 15:40

hogmanayhoolie · 24/01/2024 13:26

@Saschka Sorry wasn't clear to me either

I think it was your use of "...but".

Yeah, but no, but…

Original poster
noblegiraffe · 24/01/2024 13:31

Saschka · 24/01/2024 12:42

Neither. I’m saying they are terrorists, but this particular terrorist action was prompted by what is going on in Gaza. Not just for the fun of it.

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Why are you so reluctant to specify exactly what the problem is that’s going on in Gaza that has prompted Houthi action?

It’s not the plight of the poor Palestinians is it? The Houthis don’t give a shit about the victims of war or famine in their own country so they certainly wouldn’t give a shit about those in other countries.

It’s because Hamas are being attacked by Israel. It is Israel and the West that the Houthis have a problem with. Hence they are attacking Western ships.

OP posts:
hogmanayhoolie · 24/01/2024 13:26

@Saschka Sorry wasn't clear to me either

I think it was your use of "...but".

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 13:12

They have a reason, so that makes them not so Evil Terrorists Who Enjoy Indiscriminate Violence For No Reason?

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 13:07

But they aren’t
just Evil Terrorists Who Enjoy Indiscriminate Violence For No Reason

and you understand that “prompted” them?

Saschka · 24/01/2024 13:02

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 13:01

So, not justified.

Are you going to condemn what they are doing if it’s not justified?

Yep, sure. Happy to condemn it.

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 13:01

So, not justified.

Are you going to condemn what they are doing if it’s not justified?

Saschka · 24/01/2024 12:56

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 12:54

So it’s justified then? According to you?

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No. I’m not sure how clearer I can be about that.

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 12:54

Saschka · 24/01/2024 12:42

Neither. I’m saying they are terrorists, but this particular terrorist action was prompted by what is going on in Gaza. Not just for the fun of it.

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So it’s justified then? According to you?

Saschka · 24/01/2024 12:42

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 11:47

To be clear, I’m disagreeing with the people saying the Houthi action has nothing to do with Gaza, they are just Evil Terrorists Who Enjoy Indiscriminate Violence For No Reason.

Hang on, let me try and unpack this. So are you saying they aren’t terrorists, or are you saying it’s ok if they are because they are noble terrorists?

Neither. I’m saying they are terrorists, but this particular terrorist action was prompted by what is going on in Gaza. Not just for the fun of it.

Papyrophile · 24/01/2024 12:39

Ask yourselves, Houthi and Hamas apologists, why are NONE of the Gulf states (except Qatar, which limits its hospitality to the biggest cheeses) offering sanctuary to their co-religionists?

Papyrophile · 24/01/2024 12:28

Iran is stirring up hatred and aiming to encircle and strangle Israel, which is by all measures, the freest, wealthiest democratic state in the region. Israel is the thorn a powerful Islamist regime with nuclear capacity wishes to eliminate -- by any means possible. The timing of the Hamas massacre of Israelis was to coincide with the rapprochement between Israel and the KSA, and the beginning of formal diplomatic relations.

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 11:51

quantumbutterfly · 24/01/2024 11:41

That last quote perfectly sums up so many arguments..Grin

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I’ve been saying this all
along.

it’s a development of the bad boy fantasy.

utter madness.

ChardonnaysBeastlyCat · 24/01/2024 11:47

To be clear, I’m disagreeing with the people saying the Houthi action has nothing to do with Gaza, they are just Evil Terrorists Who Enjoy Indiscriminate Violence For No Reason.

Hang on, let me try and unpack this. So are you saying they aren’t terrorists, or are you saying it’s ok if they are because they are noble terrorists?

quantumbutterfly · 24/01/2024 11:41

hogmanayhoolie · 24/01/2024 09:57

I don't get it, I really don't

Do they have some sort of romantic Pirates of the Caribbean fantasies?

These are murdering scums terrorists that have terrorised their own country and are now targetting the global food chain

But, muuh, Israel

To misquote Ricky Gervais, being stupid is like being dead. You're not aware of it and it's incredibly painful for everyone else

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That last quote perfectly sums up so many arguments..Grin

Original poster
noblegiraffe · 24/01/2024 11:34

To be clear, I’m disagreeing with the people saying the Houthi action has nothing to do with Gaza, they are just Evil Terrorists Who Enjoy Indiscriminate Violence For No Reason.

Who is saying that Houthis are indiscriminately attacking international shipping for no reason? Or is that a strawman?

I’m saying it almost certainly is to do with Gaza.

I think you'll find that it's more likely to do with Israel and the West. Because the Houthis helpfully have DEATH TO ISRAEL and A CURSE UPON JEWS and DEATH TO AMERICA on their flag, you know.

OP posts:
Saschka · 24/01/2024 11:26

Saschka · 24/01/2024 11:19

Well yes, which is presumably why they are acting in support of Hamas. I don’t think it is purely out of a sense of moral indignation.

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To be clear, I’m disagreeing with the people saying the Houthi action has nothing to do with Gaza, they are just Evil Terrorists Who Enjoy Indiscriminate Violence For No Reason.

I’m saying it almost certainly is to do with Gaza. And sorting out Gaza would probably stop it, though fuck knows how you do that at this stage. That’s not the same as supporting Houthis, or Hamas.

Saschka · 24/01/2024 11:19

XRAYTHIS · 24/01/2024 11:17

Is it also obvious why they are taking hostages, people from a range of nationalities? Details posted upthread by another person.

Iran backed and supplied with weapons just like Hamas. Blurred lines.

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Well yes, which is presumably why they are acting in support of Hamas. I don’t think it is purely out of a sense of moral indignation.

XRAYTHIS · 24/01/2024 11:17

Saschka · 24/01/2024 11:12

I don’t think anyone is disputing that they’ve fired on non-Israeli ships, or that they are funded by Iran.

Once you have committed to carrying out an act of terror to convince the international community to put pressure on Israel to agree to a ceasefire, obviously you attack international shipping. Just attacking Israeli shipping wouldn’t work, Israel isn’t going to back down. You disrupt the entire shipppng lane, and that causes enough economic disruption that other countries pressure Israel.

I do not support that action, but the rationale makes perfect sense. Sinking the odd Israeli vessel would have been completely ignored, whereas disrupting international shipping has everyone sitting up and taking notice. Again, I am not in favour of it, but in terms of achieving their goals, it is obvious why they are attacking non-Israeli ships.

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Is it also obvious why they are taking hostages, people from a range of nationalities? Details posted upthread by another person.

Iran backed and supplied with weapons just like Hamas. Blurred lines.