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Conflict in the Middle East

Teaching Hatred

267 replies

UnSognoAVenezia · 27/12/2023 23:55

INTERNATIONAL LAW
The use and recruitment of children under the age of 15 as soldiers is not only illegal under international law, but is also defined as a war crime by the International Criminal Court.

This law applies both to state armed forces and non-state armed forces; in other words, Palestinian groups cannot claim innocence for using children in combat under the guise that their paramilitary groups are not acting on behalf of a sovereign nation.

In 2005, Amnesty International stated: “Palestinian armed groups have repeatedly shown total disregard for the most fundamental human rights, notably the right to life, by deliberately targeting Israeli civilians and by using Palestinian children in armed attacks.”

The psychological effects for child soldiers are devastating. Research conducted among Palestinian and Ugandan child soldiers found that 50 percent of former child soldiers experience post-traumatic stress disorder. Others suffer from major depressive disorder, hostility, sadness, low self-confidence, and an inability to cope with daily life.

HISTORY
The recruitment of minors for combat by Palestinian militants dates back to the final years of the Ottoman occupation of Palestine (1517-1917). Youths were at the forefront of the opposition against Jewish immigration, and an attitude developed that children had a “duty to sacrifice themselves.”

During the infamous 1929 Hebron Massacre, when 69 Jews were murdered and the most ancient continuous Jewish community in Palestine was decimated, Arab youths instigated the violence.

As relations between Nazi Germany and the Arab world developed, the powerful Husseini family founded the Palestinian Arab Party, modeled after the Nazi Party in Germany. Inspired by the Hitler Youth, the party created a Nazi-like scout group named “Al-Futuwwa.” That same year, the A-Futuwwa youth corps began Nazi-inspired military training. Al-Futuwwa adopted the following motto: “Liberty is my right; independence is my goal; Arabism is my principle; Palestine is my country and mine only. This I attest and God is a witness to my words.”

With the establishment of the Palestine Liberation Organization in 1964, the PLO created military training programs for boys and girls.

During the First Intifada (1987-1993), a culture of Palestinian youth stone-throwing emerged, quickly linking stone-throwing to martyrdom. During the Second Intifada (2000-2005), at least nine children carried out suicide bombings against Israelis.

TRAINING CAMPS
As stated above, the first militarized training camps for Palestinian children were established in the 1930s, inspired by the Hitler Youth. The group was known as Al-Futuwwa.

This practice resurged with the establishment of the PLO in 1964. Palestinian children were subjected to military training with the aim of “strengthening Palestinian national self-awareness” and upholding a “revolutionary culture.”

In 2000, 25,000 Palestinian boys were taught “kidnapping, ambushing, and using assault weapons” at a training camp run by former Palestinian Authority president Yasser Arafat’s staff.

In September 2012, Hamas, the Islamist, antisemitic, extremist terrorist organization that runs the Gaza Strip, instituted a new military training program for school boys in Gaza, also named Al-Futuwwa. The program implemented the following: (1) a two-week military training camp, (2) weekly “military” classes, and (3) “practical activities.” The curriculum targeted some 37,000 boys, who were taught to use Kalashnikov assault rifles, hand grenades, and other explosive devises.

SUICIDE BOMBINGS
During the Second Intifada (2000-2005), Palestinian groups recruited children as militants in a number of ways; most notably and devastatingly, at least nine suicide bombings were carried out by Palestinian children.

In 2004, the Israeli military intercepted an 11-year-old Palestinian boy carrying explosive devices on his person through a checkpoint in Nablus.

In 2000, the then Grand Mufti of Jerusalem Ekrima Sa'id Sabri made a statement in support of suicide attacks carried out by children: “The younger the martyr, the more I respect him.”

In 2003, the United Nations Secretary General stated: “We have witnessed both ends of these acts: children have been used as suicide bombers and children have been killed by suicide bombings. I call on the Palestinian authorities to do everything within their powers to stop all participation by children in this conflict.”

On December 25, 2023, the Israeli Defense Forces found child-sized suicide bomber vests in a building used to shelter civilians in the Gaza Strip.

During the Second Intifada (2000-2005), a photo of a "baby suicide bomber" sparked international outrage. The boy's uncle verified the authenticity of the photo, though the IDF believed there were no actual explosives in the belt.

INDOCTRINATION
Hamas runs both Shehab News and the Al-Aqsa Media Network. Al-Aqsa Media is known for its virulently antisemitic content; for example, the children’s program Tomorrow’s Pioneers, which ran from 2007 to 2009, quite literally encouraged Palestinian children to murder Jews. Children’s characters made statements such as: “We will annihilate the Jews,” and “[I] will finish off the Jews and eat them.”

Palestinian schoolbooks frequently espouse overt antisemitism, as well as demonization Jews, Israelis, and Israel. Hamas has repeatedly interfered with the curriculums of United Nations Relief and Works Agency schools, including the decision to suspend any education on the Holocaust in 2009. UNRWA teachers have also been caught posting explicitly antisemitic content online, such as content praising Hitler.

From 2002 to at least 2006, the Hamas-run biweekly online magazine for children, Al-Fatah (“The Conqueror”), praised suicide bombers and attacks on the “Jewish enemy.”

At least 20 UNRWA schoolteachers and staff praised the October 7 Hamas massacre of Israeli civilians, the deadliest antisemitic massacre since the Holocaust.

Here is a quote from Hamas MP Fathi Hamad:
"[The enemies of Allah] do not know that the Palestinian people has developed its [methods] of death and death-seeking. For the Palestinian people, death has become an industry, at which women excel, and so do all the people living on this land. The elderly excel at this, and so do the mujahideen and the children. This is why they have formed human shields of the women, the children, the elderly, and the mujahideen, in order to challenge the Zionist bombing machine. It is as if they were saying to the Zionist enemy: 'We desire death like you desire life.'"

IMPLICATIONS
First, a caveat: Israel too has been accused of “glorifying” military culture, with children being taught to look forward to their military draft. That said, the two situations are not remotely similar. First, Israel does not recruit minors for military operations. Israel does not fire from civilian-populated areas, and certainly not from areas populated by children. Independent studies have found that, while both Israeli and Palestinian school textbooks generally don’t offer a very sympathetic view of the other side, Palestinian textbooks overwhelmingly glorify martyrdom, whereas Israeli textbooks emphasize peace.

The militarization and radicalization of Palestinian children is a form of child abuse, and it has grave implications.

A clinical psychologist at Tel Aviv University, Shafiq Masalha, found that during the Second Intifada (2000-2005), 15 percent of Palestinian children dreamt of becoming suicide bombers. According to the director of the Gaza Community Mental Health Program, Eyad Sarraj, 36 percent of Palestinian children over the age of 12 aspire to die “a martyr’s death.”

A 2012 study on Israeli, Palestinian, and Arab Israeli children found that exposure to the conflict and violence increased aggressive behavior. It stated: "Palestinian children were at the greatest risk for exposure to violence across settings as well as at the highest level of aggressive behavior in comparison to the two other groups. Males were uniformly at greater risk than were females for all forms of exposure to violence as well as more aggressive."

(credit Rootsmetals)

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Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 14:47

@Humdingerydoo the Israeli intelligence minister is calling on emigration

That is certainly a permanent move so there's no reading in between the lines there

Emigration: the act of leaving one's own country to settle permanently in another

Humdingerydoo · 03/01/2024 14:43

Thanks @Parkingt111 I've already read that article. But other nationalities who have moved to Saudi Arabia for construction work have done so on a temporary basis, which is what lead to me asking the question. They often work there for a few years to send money home to their families, before going back home. So I was wondering if that was being discussed at all, or something along the lines of what's happened with Ukrainians.

I don't think reading between the lines is going to be particularly helpful at this point as it's important what words are being used, not what people infer. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying there is a chance you are.

I'm not interested in what two extreme right-wing individuals say, only in what is actually being discussed by the people in charge of that specific issue.

quantumbutterfly · 03/01/2024 14:42

It's one side of the story, whether Netanyahu has the mandate to do it is yet to be seen.

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 14:42

@quantumbutterfly Yes, could be. @Parkingt111 's article is very good and thorough, so maybe have a look at that.

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 14:39

That's a great article @Parkingt111 and makes it very clear. It appears Netanyahu is on board with 'voluntary migration' then.

quantumbutterfly · 03/01/2024 14:35

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 14:30

@Humdingerydoo I don't know much, but just re-pasting Ben Gvir's statement from Guardian -
'In a social media message posted overnight, Ben-Gvir said: “The US is our best friend, but first of all we will do what is best for the state of Israel: the migration of hundreds of thousands from Gaza will allow [Israeli] residents to return home and live in security and will protect the IDF.”
So his idea is to replace the Palestinians with Israeli residents. It definitely doesn't sound like he plans for the Gazans to return at any point.

I read that as Israelis returning home within the current borders of Israel, I understand that many Israelis have been displaced within Israel by this conflict.

Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 14:32

The article opening:
Senior official says Jerusalem working on post war resettlement of Palestinians from Strip; some ministers tout Saudi Arabia as destination for Gazans seeking construction work

Note the word resettlement which does not indicate a temporary move

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 14:30

@Humdingerydoo I don't know much, but just re-pasting Ben Gvir's statement from Guardian -
'In a social media message posted overnight, Ben-Gvir said: “The US is our best friend, but first of all we will do what is best for the state of Israel: the migration of hundreds of thousands from Gaza will allow [Israeli] residents to return home and live in security and will protect the IDF.”
So his idea is to replace the Palestinians with Israeli residents. It definitely doesn't sound like he plans for the Gazans to return at any point.

Gaza | World news | The Guardian

https://www.theguardian.com/world/gaza

Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 14:30

@Humdingerydoo the Times of Israel has an article on it published today. It seems to be the idea is for permanent migration when reading between the lines. For example smotrich's calls for settlements to be built in Gaza after the migration of the Palestinians. It's one of the reasons I think the US is being very open about why they oppose this. It was one of their 'red lines'
I think a temporary refugee status due to the war is a different matter but even then there would be concerns about being allowed to return.
I can link the article from which you could draw your own conclusions

Humdingerydoo · 03/01/2024 14:11

Genuine question here, but how is this voluntary migration thing different from when the Ukrainians were helped to leave? Is it because people are worried the Palestinians won't be allowed back when the war is over? And is that what the Israeli ministers are talking about - permanent migration? Or is it possible they're talking about a similar thing that's happened with Ukrainians where they were helped out of a war zone but are welcome to return home whenever they want?

I am only interested in hearing from people who actually know, not from people making assumptions based entirely in a biased opinion. This is, after all, a thread about taught hatred. So I want to leave any taught hatred from either side out.

Thanks.

Edited to add that to be clear, I'm not encouraging ethnic cleansing. I'm asking a question about the overall intentions of the politicians discussing it.

quantumbutterfly · 03/01/2024 14:04

do you think it constitutes teaching hatred?

Thereissomelight · 03/01/2024 13:27

By “doing it” I mean they’re making Gaza literally uninhabitable.

Thereissomelight · 03/01/2024 13:27

It’s not as if what they’re saying doesn’t match up with what Israel has been doing in Gaza for years, multiplied radically since Oct 7. They’re saying it, they’re doing it. What more evidence do we need?

Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 13:12

Yes, there's no smoke without fire. Sometimes government officials make these comments to judge public and international reaction to potential plans.
Sometimes it's because they just have extreme views and like to make headlines.
Ben Gvir and Smotrich although don't have the authority to carry out these actions even if they wanted to, the follow up this morning is concerning. I think if Netanyahu openly denounced it then it would help ease the matter once and for all

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 13:08

@Parkingt111 I think so too, and @Toothyfruity had a hard time for saying it was concerning, which I think is unfair.

Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 13:06

@stormy4319trevor I agree
That's a fair point
And it's being discussed in the open and on TV. It does seem now that these concerns are not baseless

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 13:05

@quantumbutterfly But my question is, who is doing these negotiations and why does Netanyahu allow it if it isn't his government's position, please?

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 13:04

Israel’s national security minister, Itamar Ben-Gvir, has been critical of US opposition to his previously stated push for the transfer of Palestinians out of Gaza.
In a social media message posted overnight, Ben-Gvir said: “The US is our best friend, but first of all we will do what is best for the state of Israel: the migration of hundreds of thousands from Gaza will allow [Israeli] residents to return home and live in security and will protect the IDF.”
The US state department has pushed back against suggestions that Israel could expel Palestinians from Gaza as part of a “day after” scenario for the war, saying “Gaza is Palestinian land and will remain Palestinian land.”
Israeli media this morning, meanwhile, has been reporting that Israel has been conducting negotiations with Congo and other African negotiations about taking Palestinians who would agree to a “voluntary” resettlement.
The report, initially carried by Hebrew news site Zman Israel, cited a senior source in the security cabinet saying “Congo will be willing to take in migrants, and we’re in talks with others”.
Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, has previously said it is not his government’s position to force “voluntary” resettlement of people of Gaza, and he has been critical of the finance minister, Bezalel Smotrich, and Ben-Gvir for supporting the idea of emptying Gaza of Palestinians in public, without going so far as to dismiss them from his government.

Gaza | World news | The Guardian

https://www.theguardian.com/world/gaza

quantumbutterfly · 03/01/2024 13:02

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 12:58

'Israeli media this morning, meanwhile, has been reporting that Israel has been conducting negotiations with Congo and other African negotiations about taking Palestinians who would agree to a “voluntary” resettlement'

From the Guardian. It does state that Netanyahu says previously said this isn't his government's position. So who is doing these negotiations and why is Netanyahu allowing it? I thought he would have the final say on any government negotiations.

citation needed

stormy4319trevor · 03/01/2024 12:58

'Israeli media this morning, meanwhile, has been reporting that Israel has been conducting negotiations with Congo and other African negotiations about taking Palestinians who would agree to a “voluntary” resettlement'

From the Guardian. It does state that Netanyahu says previously said this isn't his government's position. So who is doing these negotiations and why is Netanyahu allowing it? I thought he would have the final say on any government negotiations.

Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 12:07

@quantumbutterfly oh yes actually good idea

quantumbutterfly · 03/01/2024 12:06

Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 12:03

As its a more quieter thread can I ask a question for those who have knowledge on Israeli politics please.
It seems that Ben Gvir and Smotrich are also causing Netanyahu trouble with their inflammatory comments which on the face of it he disagrees with. I see they both doubled down today with even worse comments which I won't share on here but some of you may have seen.
For this reason can they not be sacked or replaced? Or can It only happen if there is another election

Have you tried asking israelilefty on their AMA thread?

Parkingt111 · 03/01/2024 12:03

As its a more quieter thread can I ask a question for those who have knowledge on Israeli politics please.
It seems that Ben Gvir and Smotrich are also causing Netanyahu trouble with their inflammatory comments which on the face of it he disagrees with. I see they both doubled down today with even worse comments which I won't share on here but some of you may have seen.
For this reason can they not be sacked or replaced? Or can It only happen if there is another election

quantumbutterfly · 03/01/2024 12:00

gingergran · 02/01/2024 16:55

@quantumbutterfly i agree with you but haters will always hate

Thank you for your reply, I was afraid my words were clumsy.

I have a lovely friend who is a committed Christian, when her 5 year old son told me we are all born as sinners it reminded me why I have not given my children the faith I grew up with, (though increasingly as I age I realise that they have also lost the positive sense of community and support that faith provides, and the cultural references).
I suppose my point is that children trust and believe and absorb their parents influence, we hurt them by teaching them to hate (themselves or others).

Which is how this thread started.

As it happens her children are well-adjusted, intelligent and delightful, I guess I shouldn't have hoiked up my judgey pants all those years ago.Grin

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