Has anyone changed their mind from what they have read on here?

Not at all.
You're either pro-israeli or pro-palestinian ( labeled anti-semetic & pro-hamas) on here. In fact I'm shocked at the number of apparently so called 'professional' long standing posters on her who are happy to espouse their support for attacking Palestine. I'm absolutely perturbed at the lack of balance & rational argument by these particular members. I've grown up in a Jewish area with Jewish friends & parents who were real admirers of the way that Jewish families stuck together ( we're Catholics). I'm trying not to tar all Jews with the same brush. But I can't align the total lack of conscience by the Israeli government with the Jewish undividuals I know.

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No. I have been truly shocked by some of the posts I've read on Mumsnet since 7th October. They have only served to strengthen my ongoing viewpoint.

It's really not true though. Funding settlers and defending settlers is not 'living in peace'. It may be for Israelis but it certainly isn't for Palestinians. Being under blockade is not living in peace again it may be for Israelis but it isn't for Palestinians. Having to go through checkpoints every day where Israeli soldiers humilate people and leave them waiting for hours on a whim is not living in peace, it may be for Israelis but it isn't for Palestinians. I could go on and on but the point is you are completely disregarding Palestinians, they haven't been left to live in peace, Israel have never left them to live in peace. So long as this isn't acknowledged peace is a long way away.

@Scirocco thank you for your post. It is very disheartening to see how Palestinians are generally labelled by some as feral war mongers who somehow need to be tamed.
There are so many lovely, kind and also highly educated people living there who are disadvantaged simply for being born where they are.

I do resonate with you in the fear for my children too. It's not something I feel i can talk openly about on here but I do sometimes with family and friends who have similar concerns. Really hope and pray things improve soon.

Thank you @stormy4319trevor .

@Scirocco So sorry for what you and friends are going through. The situation in Gaza, and the West Bank is like a nightmare replayed every day. It gets worse and worse. Someone just posted on another thread that a Christian church has been attacked and a sniper killed 2 women in the church. The others are trapped.

Many Palestinians don’t value their own lives

Eh?

Also Jews, Arabs and other minorities already live & work peacefully together in Israel, with equal rights. Israeli Arabs hold elected office & were also victims of Hamas on October 7th. One Arab Israeli family risked their lives saving Israeli Jews from Hamas. Thousands of Palestinians used to enter Israel every day to work, my cousin employed 3 Palestinians prior to October 7th but they can’t enter and do their jobs or collect their salaries thanks to Hamas. We can live in peace, we have shown we can do it. We just need the terrorists to F off, for UNRWRA to stop indoctrinating Palestinian kids, and for useful idiots in the west to stop feeding them the unachievable pipe dream they can wipe out Israel and all the Jews one day.

No. Pro Hamas. And there’s plenty of them

Let me guess. Criticising Israel, putting some of the blame on Israel’s corrupt government and refusing to sweep the high death toll in Gaza under the carpet makes you pro Hamas.

@LeaveBritneyAlone I don't personally live in Gaza at the moment. I have and had friends and colleagues there. Brave and kind people. Some who went there to perform life-saving surgeries, to help relief agencies, to visit family there. It's chance that I'm not there. I fear for my child here in the West, from the people supporting the genocide.

To many people, the blood of innocent people in Gaza is abstract, or just worth less than the blood of Israelis. But not to me. Not to my colleagues who happened to be out in Gaza at the time. Not to my friends trapped there.

I happen to think that indiscriminate bombing, shooting unarmed civilians, murder, flattening hospitals, etc should be considered wrong whoever is doing it. It's a sad state of affairs where that's not a more widely held view.

Err it is a nuts comparison. I personally think both sides should be have been able to live alongside each other sharing safety and prosperity many years ago.

There is clear evidence of the insidious ideology and terrorist strategy that persists in preventing this from the Palestinian side as seen from the live streamed footage of the atrocities that took place on Oct 7th and this is nothing new.

The reason the comparison is nuts is as I’ve previously stated is that the harsh truth is that many Palestinians and their government don’t value their own lives and their own people’s lives as highly as Israelis value their own lives and their own peoples lives which is why there is a never ending conflict.

They would have built bomb shelters instead of terrorist tunnels for a start, never elected a government with a clear mandate to annihilate it’s neighbour and it’s citizens and refuse to engage in any peace agreements, and Oct 7th would never have happened.

almost ALL pro-Palestinians supports support the exile and de-armament of Jewish people, and tell us that the very recent history of Jewish genocide isn’t relevant
🙄

So you are saying that no one wants Palestinians and no one wants Jews?

Surely then you can see that Palestinians would want to protect their land and people too? They are in danger everyday. Everyday Israeli settlers take more and more land. On average Israel killed almost 1 Palestinian every day of this year prior to October, including small children. If what you say is true and no one else wants them what choice do they have but to stay put and try and fight the occupation as best they can so that one day they and their children can be safe. Was a terrorist attack killing 700 civillians the right way to do that, I don't think so. Equally I don't think Israel is going the right way about it either.

I agree with this.

Every argument under the sun as to why Israel should continue murdering thousands of innocent children, maiming and orphaning thousands more, depriving 1.5 million people of homes, medical care, schools, water, shelter and food.

Who wants this? Can you point out who wants this?

Ill ask you - what is Israel supposed to do that ensures the protection of its people and its home? Given how much anti-semitism there is in the world and especially around this issue, if Israel surrendered how would you deal with the consequences? What would you do to stop Hamas?

Why does Israel need to stop Hamas on their own and on their own terms ? Why haven’t they seek international help in order to finish with Hamas whilst protecting the citizens?

also, do you really think this will finish with Hamas?

@LeaveBritneyAlone I have learnt alot about anti-semitism and the unfortunate rise in it from many posters on mumsnet. And i think if it wasn't for the many people on here who have educated me on the matter then there would be a lot of anti-semitism in real life that i wouldnt maybe register and i am very thankful to them. But after reading many of your posts which clearly show a disdain and contempt for many Palestinians, you are not one of those who i would listen to on the subject

If you live in a war zone and I got it wrong I apologise.

But what do you expect Israel to do that will protect their land and people and ensure they are not, yet again, exiled to danger? Nothing is being done to stop Hamas - what should they do?

Another thing maybe is I think some non-Jewish people really have had their eyes opened to what Israelis and diaspora Jews have been going through for the last however many years.

How their supposed comrades have been going along with Jewish history being re-written and misrepresented for the benefit of those who want to wipe us out.

For every new antisemite since October 7 I think we have also gained a much treasured ally.

Seeing non-Jews making the case against the demonisation and dehumanisation of Israelis for once is really nice. Welcome, friends 😊

Every argument under the sun as to why Israel should continue murdering thousands of innocent children, maiming and orphaning thousands more, depriving 1.5 million people of homes, medical care, schools, water, shelter and food.

Also every argument under the sun as to why it has been ok to let settlers violently and progressively steal homes and land.

Anyone who protests is “victim blaming” “pro Hamas” “anti-Semitic” “doesn’t care about the Holocaust”.

It’s not just me who’s sick to the stomach of this. The vast majority of world leaders have stated - and voted - that they want it to stop. Only the US government wants to continue protecting its aircraft carrier in the Middle East.

@LeaveBritneyAlone
Please read my post earlier in the thread if you think I live in a happy mc bubble.

I live in a world where people actively want my child, me, my friends and family dead, tortured or worse.

The bombs landing in Gaza? The murders in the West Bank? Some of those killed have been my friends. Some of those left scarred for life have been their children.

My family and I will be dealing with this trauma for the rest of our lives.

And yet somehow I don't think more hate and genocide can be the answer.

Can you prove me wrong then?

Im not using it as a reason to commit genocide - I’m stating a fact.

Excellent post. Especially when you consider Judaism is the only major religion with ONE country to call its own.

When you factor in the fact that the modern day definition of Zionism came about because, you know….six million Jewish people were murdered and those that were lucky enough to survive spent years pushing their dead relatives around in wheelbarrows to put on fires, being starved, tortured, enslaved and beaten (not because of their choice but because of their blood - age grist Jews were still murderers in the Holocaust)….and they were liberated and STILL hated with a passion and excluded from societies the world over….they thought “We don’t really like this. It’s a bit shit. We are rational in worrying about it happening again. We’d quite like a place to call our own, where we can be together and be away from the people who still hate us and supported the Holocaust”. Is Zionism REALLY such an awful concept?

Anti-Zionists are anti-semites and I’m afraid I will die on that hill.

From engaging on Mumsnet what’s really stood out to me is how much false propaganda and lies get swallowed by ordinary people who completely believe them. It’s made me distrustful of some of the obviously biased information being shared on both sides, seeing people state as fact things which have been discounted and fact-checked as false or dismiss reputable sources as spreading lies etc has made me realise how many people are just believing what they want to believe and what suits their side of the narrative. It’s been interesting to see people accuse one side of lying and giving false figures and distorting facts whilst completely believing everything that suits their side’s agenda. I don’t really know what to believe, I think the truth of what happened on October 7th and the truth of what has happened and continues to happen in Gaza since won’t really come out for decades and that makes it very difficult for me to choose a firm side.