Hamas planned attacks on Jewish people in Europe

I mean, surely you know what you're saying is absolutely ridiculous, right? For so many reasons, but the one I'm going to focus on is the fact that it's Jews they'd be targeting, not Germans or Danes in general. Jews. I'm sure others would be affected as well but they'd be collateral damage, not the actual targets. The targets would be Jews. So your "logic" isn't exactly sound.

I’m a bit confused by this.

If you’re a target you mustn’t be killed but if you’re not a target it’s just collateral damage?

@Decibel1000 that's interesting and I wasn't aware. Will be more careful.

I mean, surely you know what you're saying is absolutely ridiculous, right? For so many reasons, but the one I'm going to focus on is the fact that it's Jews they'd be targeting, not Germans or Danes in general. Jews. I'm sure others would be affected as well but they'd be collateral damage, not the actual targets. The targets would be Jews. So your "logic" isn't exactly sound.

totally agree with this too.
it’s so much easier for people to act like it’s all happening in a vacuum though and trying to contextualise means you’re a bigot.

We keep getting told that civillians get killed in wars. That's what happens apparently. So if it happens in countries that are backing Israel and supporting this war then that's what happens in wars. It's no different than the 1000s of innocent Palestinians that have been killed and maimed. If you support war you might get dragged into it, civillians might get killed. I don't know why some posters who have been very vocal about the fact that civillians get killed that's just what happens suddenly seem to care that more civillians might get killed. Seems like double standards to me.

Hi @EasternStandard in my view it is Israel and it’s supporters that are pushing this false narrative. This article from Time summarises it quite well. I’m not doubting the Germans and Danes have arrested bad people, but I do not consider this to be indicative of some wider nefarious scheme or intent by Hamas to attack Europe and I think trying to claim so is highly convenient for those trying to deflect criticism and growing disgust at the increasing death toll and atrocities Israel is committing in Gaza.

https://time.com/6329776/hamas-isis-gaza/time.com/6329776/hamas-isis-gaza/

@Pizdietz you know perfectly well what my reply is, so I won't be repeating it:

Butchery of 1000 (or more) , whilst abhorrent, does not justify butchery of 20,000, the starvation of more, and the deprivation of state of all.

Nobody should feel they have the right to target a group of people based on their religion or ethnicity or race and I hope the hate and planned attacks towards Jewish people is stamped out quickly.
I think the police in England will be on high alert especially in the festive period

Agree with this completely @Desertrose2023
It would only increase the risks to us all if we use this as a reason NOT to push for a ceasefire and sideline diplomatic efforts to reach a sustainable peaceful solution for all in the Middle East.

That was my reaction too.

It does not help to reduce the risks towards all of us if we see the difficulties in Western countries happening in silo from what is happening in the Gaza and the West Bank.

@Desertrose2023 you mentioned a false narrative in a pp.

Given the links to quotes from Danish and German spokespeople / PMs do you think they are setting up this false narrative?

I am actually interested in discussing this - I just get rounded on by people for having an opposing viewpoint every time I post and it descends into trading barbs.

I do not believe that prior to the current conflict Hamas presented any form of threat to Europe. This objective doesn’t align to their most recent manifesto. Do I think the current conflict has raised the threat in Europe? Potentially yes because society is becoming more polarized as a result of what’s happening and we’ve seen significant rises in hate crime both against Muslims and Jews. European political support / endorsement for Israel’s actions is also deeply unpopular with many. The tensions are also not being helped by the rhetoric of the Israeli government who are trying their hardest to position this as some kind of a religious conflict - see BN’s delightful references to Amalek and others talking about the reestablishment of settlements in Gaza etc.

What I hate more than anything in the world is the bombing, intentional starvation and forced displacement of children, and those who continue to rationalize and defend it. I haven’t said anywhere I don’t think Hamas are bad, the opposite actually if you’d read my posts on other threads. It’s much easier for you to go with your lazy and prejudiced assumptions though, and that’s entirely on you.

This is worrying. Seeing some obviously pro hamas placards, chants and a couple of anti hamas individuals being surrounded and shut down on marches might make some think striking out is a good move. Terrorists are vile and want to cause confusion and division and they are making a great job of it

Hamas always had support. That's why they remained in power. That's why people celebrated while wearing green headbands when Hamas slaughtered, maimed and kidnapped so many people in Israel just over two months ago. It's just that now people don't feel the need to pretend they don't support Hamas as now it is deemed acceptable. The support has always been there. Abbas won't even condemn Hamas' actions and he's supposedly in opposition to them.

And before you all descend - I'm not saying all Palestinians support Hamas. I'm saying they've always had support. Not from everyone, but from enough people to keep them in power

So for the threat to Europe there are lots of stories out there. Not many seem interested though and instead bring other threads here etc.

Guessing either some don't believe hamas are a threat to people in Europe (until one attack succeeds) or would rather just slate Israel on every thread.

There have been threats flagged in Germany, Denmark and the Netherlands as per links posted earlier in thread for anyone interested. I see the UK also concerned.

Their supporters who generally hate Jewish people or westerners are a current threat.

Yes, I really understand what you're saying here and empathise with it.

Apart from "It's time for Israel to let the rest of the world in on its clever plan."

You really think they have a clever plan and were not forced into this horrible situation? What would your clever plan be, if you were in their shoes?

Of course.

Good luck with that in any war situation, though.

That's why sane governments do their best to avoid war rather than deliberately starting them.

But that's like saying all Palestinians are responsible for Hamas.

What's this news source ? Have there actually been any attacks ? I would have thought Hammas are pretty occupied with being annihilated along with the population of Gaza.

Violence begets violence . Plus look at support for Hamas trebling in the recent poll talked about on here
Israel's response is endangering us all along with the US and it's no red lines. What's the end game? It time for Israel to let the rest of the world in on its clever plan.
As I said before having the Oxbridge educated, UK born, Israeli spokesman deny killing children, deny the casualty statistics, deny any humanitarian problems in Gaza whilst immediately expressing fear for the safety of his UK friends and families due to rising anti Semitism is enough to frustrate a very moderate person never mind a half radicalised one.

This is an example of gaslighting @Pizdietz. for future reference check out this poster. She’ll teach you well.