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Conflict in the Middle East

Do lots of people support Hamas?

691 replies

elprup · 03/12/2023 20:33

I just read this story and it is absolutely horrific

I saw ten Hamas terrorists beat and gang-rape an Israeli woman

https://mol.im/a/12820081

Is everyone on the pro-Palestine marches in London solely supporting the innocent civilians of Palestine (as I do too)? Or are there some people on these marches supporting the actions of Hamas as well?

I want to join the marches in support of innocent adults and kids in Gaza (and I would want to march for the same reasons on any pro Israel marches too), but I do not want to endorse Hamas in any shape or form. They are absolutely vile.

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ChickHenLittle · 11/12/2023 13:29

Trulywonderful · 11/12/2023 13:18

I don't like the use of Londonistan in the title of the article or when people use it in general. That is cheap and reeks of Islamophobia. However the information in the article is interesting

Agreed, the reference doesn't tie in to a Middle Eastern country either, none end in -istan. It's as if Muslims are just lumped together regardless of provenance/actual geographic location, and the use of such phrases has become fairly commonplace.

Trulywonderful · 11/12/2023 13:28

etmoiandme · 11/12/2023 13:22

Oh lo and behold - the world's unluckiest racist has "the closest ties"!

Surprise

Not

etmoiandme · 11/12/2023 13:23

Trulywonderful · 11/12/2023 13:18

I don't like the use of Londonistan in the title of the article or when people use it in general. That is cheap and reeks of Islamophobia. However the information in the article is interesting

Yes, that made me wince too.

etmoiandme · 11/12/2023 13:22

Trulywonderful · 11/12/2023 13:16

We all I think know there are definitely some Hamas supporters in London but apparently Hamas is in London as well

https://tps.co.il/articles/londonistan-hamas-base-of-operations-in-england/

Oh lo and behold - the world's unluckiest racist has "the closest ties"!

Trulywonderful · 11/12/2023 13:18

I don't like the use of Londonistan in the title of the article or when people use it in general. That is cheap and reeks of Islamophobia. However the information in the article is interesting

Trulywonderful · 11/12/2023 13:16

We all I think know there are definitely some Hamas supporters in London but apparently Hamas is in London as well

https://tps.co.il/articles/londonistan-hamas-base-of-operations-in-england/

» ‘Londonistan’: Hamas’ Base of Operations in England

https://tps.co.il/articles/londonistan-hamas-base-of-operations-in-england

Jupitersstorm · 10/12/2023 23:51

Trulywonderful · 10/12/2023 17:34

Since most the surrounding countries ethnic cleansing Jews from their countries over the last 100 years I don't think much will change in attitude towards Israel really.

Some non or less religious Arabs have softened in recent years but the more religious the Arab the more they think of Jews as dhimmi in the middle east. Therefore the idea of Jews being able to self determine and live free to be Jewish without any taxes or restrictions on that is not very excepted. Let alone the idea of a Jewish state in the middle east, which is largely rejected by millions and millions of Arabs.

Plus the young always want whatever they latest social justice that is seen as the think to support. Arab youth and twenty somethings are very similar to here in that respect. Most people do grow out of this in their late twenties and early thirties though. This is when most start taking a more logical and balanced view of current events. People are more willing to look at all the facts and the bigger picture for their country and others. Plus of course have more life experience to use when analysing a situation and be less likely to listen to any attempts at properganda or radicalisation. Not every twenty grows like this with age but the majority do, especially once they have families of their own to consider. In the case of the middle east less conflict means families and economies are safer. Future leaders will more than likely make decisions based on this rather than what a group of people their own countries have abused have or haven't done (Palestinians & Jews have been tortured, raped and killed in most the surrounding countries historically)

Well put Truly. Lots of posts on the boards warning how much worse things will be for Israel and world Jewry now. Fact of the matter is, things have always been challenging for Israel and world Jewry so it's a case of "as you were." Only this time, the current terrorist government in Gaza or its successor Gaza won't have much of an appetite to want to invade Israel/institute a Holocaust style pogrom as it is clear now that hell has no fury like a scorned Israel. Israel will always have its enemies but those enemies respect the military and will do so even more now. This post is not supposed to be an embrace of the IDF counter but rather pointing out the truth .

Trulywonderful · 10/12/2023 22:02

Hamas has warned that not a single hostage would leave the territory “alive” unless the group’s demands were met.

“Neither the fascist enemy and its arrogant leadership... nor its supporters... can take their prisoners alive without an exchange and negotiation and meeting the demands of the resistance,” Abu Obeida, spokesman for Hamas’s armed wing, said in a televised broadcast, referring to the release of Palestinian prisoners held by Israel.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/12/10/israel-hamas-war-latest-news-updates-gaza1/

Hamas says no hostage will leave alive unless group's demands met

Hamas has warned that not a single hostage would leave the territory “alive” unless the group’s demands were met.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/12/10/israel-hamas-war-latest-news-updates-gaza1

ChickHenLittle · 10/12/2023 20:30

@Katy231 Totally agree with your post. There is also a thread documenting/discussing the awful actions of the IDF. There was so much that there is now a second thread filling up fast, but the first is still around. A lot of it is distressing, if not surprising.

Trulywonderful · 10/12/2023 17:34

Parkingt111 · 10/12/2023 15:18

Not entirely about supporting Hamas but Qatar's PM made a statement today which I think is quite alarming for Israel and in general

He said due to the war there is a risk of a entire generation in the middle east becoming radicalised

I think when people talk of escalation and preventing it, the focus is on preventing it now.
What seems to be largely ignored is the impact in the region for years to come

Since most the surrounding countries ethnic cleansing Jews from their countries over the last 100 years I don't think much will change in attitude towards Israel really.

Some non or less religious Arabs have softened in recent years but the more religious the Arab the more they think of Jews as dhimmi in the middle east. Therefore the idea of Jews being able to self determine and live free to be Jewish without any taxes or restrictions on that is not very excepted. Let alone the idea of a Jewish state in the middle east, which is largely rejected by millions and millions of Arabs.

Plus the young always want whatever they latest social justice that is seen as the think to support. Arab youth and twenty somethings are very similar to here in that respect. Most people do grow out of this in their late twenties and early thirties though. This is when most start taking a more logical and balanced view of current events. People are more willing to look at all the facts and the bigger picture for their country and others. Plus of course have more life experience to use when analysing a situation and be less likely to listen to any attempts at properganda or radicalisation. Not every twenty grows like this with age but the majority do, especially once they have families of their own to consider. In the case of the middle east less conflict means families and economies are safer. Future leaders will more than likely make decisions based on this rather than what a group of people their own countries have abused have or haven't done (Palestinians & Jews have been tortured, raped and killed in most the surrounding countries historically)

Parkingt111 · 10/12/2023 15:18

Not entirely about supporting Hamas but Qatar's PM made a statement today which I think is quite alarming for Israel and in general

He said due to the war there is a risk of a entire generation in the middle east becoming radicalised

I think when people talk of escalation and preventing it, the focus is on preventing it now.
What seems to be largely ignored is the impact in the region for years to come

Trulywonderful · 10/12/2023 15:01

Jupitersstorm · 10/12/2023 12:26

Wow - even a thread title that is as clear as a bell attracts those who want to talk about the IDF.

Sshh

Just enjoy reading it keeping the thread title in mind

😂

backtowinter · 10/12/2023 14:57

Katy231 · 09/12/2023 23:47

Really interesting how the focus is on Hamas and not the IDF terrorist group who are throwing white phosphorus as we speak.

Does anyone condemn those actions? They are breaking international law, do you condemn these actions?

I wonder why that is

Jupitersstorm · 10/12/2023 12:26

Wow - even a thread title that is as clear as a bell attracts those who want to talk about the IDF.

marvellousceiling · 10/12/2023 08:33

Katy231 · 09/12/2023 23:47

Really interesting how the focus is on Hamas and not the IDF terrorist group who are throwing white phosphorus as we speak.

Does anyone condemn those actions? They are breaking international law, do you condemn these actions?

hear hear

Toothyfruity · 10/12/2023 07:39

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Exactly! Israel would never kill innocent children.

Oh wait...

HeidiInTheBigCity · 10/12/2023 01:04

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You are right, I apologise for my mistake!

The literal Nazi Eichmann got a trial!

Palestinian children who throw stones at tanks are just shot on the spot, no due process or anything like that!

That is much better, of course! Much more moral!

Bonkersworknonsense · 10/12/2023 00:48

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Trulywonderful · 10/12/2023 00:22

Call me crazy but I think the focus is on Hamas because of the thread title at a guess

Do lots of people support Hamas

JUST like most people talk about the IDF when the thread is about them etc

Katy231 · 09/12/2023 23:47

Really interesting how the focus is on Hamas and not the IDF terrorist group who are throwing white phosphorus as we speak.

Does anyone condemn those actions? They are breaking international law, do you condemn these actions?

Livinginanotherworld · 09/12/2023 23:44

Toothyfruity · 09/12/2023 23:22

I think those payments are because men typically earn money and if they're imprisoned or killed they can't earn and the family will fall into poverty. Republicans in Northern Ireland had a similar fund. I've never heard anyone refer to such a fund as "inciting terrorism".

Also it's quite insulting for you to suggest that Palestinians don't love their children as much as other people do. They've lost thousands of children in the last few months. They feel the same pain anyone else does when their child is harmed or killed.

It's very hard to understand how life for those who live in Gaza. We can't possibly imagine.

The payments are as @Toothyfruity says, to help his family if he can’t earn. Because Gaza is not allowed a proper army that’s all they can do to help.

Don’t the IDF get paid ? I’m sure they are earning a very good salary, what’s so different ?

twilightmoon3 · 09/12/2023 23:43

In 1947 most of the Zionists here when asked do you approve of hanging the British army troops in the olive Grove (Irgun) would have kept silent or said its difficult. Same for the bombing without warning of the King David's Hotel 93 dead , Sunak stayed there when he visited recently. Without these atrocities against the British there would have probably been a kinder Israel,but the terrorists won.

Limeandsodaontherocks · 09/12/2023 23:34

Kindatired · 09/12/2023 23:05

Sorry. I didn’t mean it to sound patronising.
For context, I was in the Congo and Rwanda in 1994 in the immediate aftermath of the genocide that was followed by a cholera outbreak that killed 12,000 that was in turn followed by a dysentery outbreak that led to more deaths.
I worked alongside some lovely Israelis who admitted to feeling that they had to confront 7 ethical dilemmas before breakfast about digging sanitation pits knowing the perpetrators would benefit. However, eventually the pits were dug, water and basic food provided and ultimately a peace process was put in place. Rwanda is now at peace, and I do believe that the UNHCR approach of meeting basic humanitarian needs of was ethically the right thing to do. The children had nothing to do with the genocide and were entitled to their lives, even if some perpetrators did dump in the same pits and ate some of the food.

Dealing with Hamas and letting the children of Gaza live are not mutually compatible so one or other has to give. It’s deeply upsetting that Hamas can’t be brought to justice immediately but you can’t really have both because the kids are actually starting to starve and they won’t be able to handle diarrhoea as well.

💯 agree . Thank you for the really helpful context.

Toothyfruity · 09/12/2023 23:22

Tryingmybestadhd · 09/12/2023 23:03

Foremost I want to say I hate to see any children die or hurt , doesn’t matter where they are from .
The part where I struggle with fully supporting Palestine is their idea that being a martyr is good . They even have a martyrdom payment where parents receive money if their child died in conflict or during a terrorist act . They also get paid if IDF arrest a family member and very high payments if it’s a terrorist act . To me it seems like inciting terrorism and as a parent who absolutely love my children above anything else I cannot and will never agree or understand the mindset of being proud of a child that is a martyr .I would never put my child in a position where they could be arrested or hurt purposefully. Having been to Palestine ( albeit quite a few years ago when it was easier to cross ) you constantly see children at cross points often very young .
You dont see any of this on the Israeli or Jordan side ,nobody lingers at cross points or throws stones at military , children are absolutely adored and cared for .
So yes I admit , I find very hard to believe Hamas is completely separate from general civilians , I think a large part of civilians are Hamas or connected to Hamas someway .
I would love all children in Palestine to be safe from hurt , but I also believe with Hamas in power children in Gaza will never have a chance of being happy , right now to me I see children as pawns to every adult around them . They need education , they need people around them who don’t promote Islam radicalism , who 100% value life above anything else . They will not get that with Hamas in power . If anyone comes up with a real solution that includes a ceasefire where this kids have a real chance then I’m all ears but I think simply stopping with Hamas in power will just lead to another October 7 th that will lead to another war again and again and again .

I think those payments are because men typically earn money and if they're imprisoned or killed they can't earn and the family will fall into poverty. Republicans in Northern Ireland had a similar fund. I've never heard anyone refer to such a fund as "inciting terrorism".

Also it's quite insulting for you to suggest that Palestinians don't love their children as much as other people do. They've lost thousands of children in the last few months. They feel the same pain anyone else does when their child is harmed or killed.

It's very hard to understand how life for those who live in Gaza. We can't possibly imagine.

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