Do lots of people support Hamas?

I think we can all agree that this person fully supports Hamas

When I said OP, (a few posts up), I was referring to the original post, not the original poster. I did not think you were the original poster, in case you are confused.

Yes it was when it started. They didn’t respond to rocket fire with rocket fire. They scrambled fighter jets and did air strikes. Strikes which hit residential areas killing the first few hundred Palestinian civilians.

Yes it is reasonable to ask, but it is also reasonable for me to decline that particular derail.

Sure, you say you witnessed overt support for Hamas, I believe you on that as I know there are extremists of all types in London. It was more sweeping generalisation that everyone waving a Palestinian flag must be Hamas supporters because it was before Israel started their retaliation, when such timing could not have happened here in London. They’d have to have been in the streets from 04:45am to 06:45am (GMT).

But that wasn’t when the “bombardment of Gaza” began and it’s a bit disingenuous to frame it as such. Israel was literally under attack on Oct 7th, they responded to Hamas rocket fire with rocket fire. I think it’s quite reasonable to ask what you think they should have done under the circumstances? Many people celebrated Hamas’ attack that day, visibly and gleefully.

Just to mention I am not the OP and I don't think the OP has posted anything in quite a while

So.....

I thought the bombing was much later - my mistake.
But even so - the people celebrating in my part of London that evening were cheering and chanting about what Hamas did on Oct 7th. It’s still shocking - not sure how the timing changes that .

🙃

@BabaBarrio Apparently now discussing the OP is derailing, confusing.

You do all realise that it makes no difference that Israel fired at Hamas rocket lurchers because Hamas started firing rockets during the pogrom don't you?

The thing that started this argument was that Hamas supporters in London were out celebrating the pogrom. Which is backed up by videos available on YouTube. They were waving flags in the street and lighting flares in multiple places around London. All this happened straight after the pogrom before any intense bombing happened. Even then Hamas supporters were out in the streets of London, so nothing to argue about there. It happened there are videos and lots of posters and people on twitter saw it.

I’m responding to your posts. This is a public forum. There is no talk guideline of speak only when spoken to (tagged).

I agree that is what the thread seemed to have progressed on to from what I could tell as well.

I responded to posts I was tagged on and others I was involved in

I didn't start this, so again you seem desperate to derail and also accus me of things I haven't done

Trust me if I was to call you out you or any individual out it would be done very clearly and properly. You would know it happened. Now stop tagging me for no reason other than to derail

Yes. 06:45am (GMT) is 09:45am local time for Israel.
This isn’t about what should have happened, this is about posters claiming that people waving Palestinian flags in London the evening of Oct 7th to “a mere 48hrs later” or before “Oct 17th” were doing so before Israel began it’s retaliation.

These claims are temporally impossible. No one was waving Palestinian flags on the streets of London before Israel began its bombardment of Gaza.

@BabaBarrio I too have not read every page so if I missed some slating of Israel I apologise. But our recent posts are in context of the wider thread and the natural discussion. They're not supporting Israel but discussing why some posters might be unfairly branded as Hamas supporters. Which of course relates to the OP. Just a natural progression of the discussion of the OP.

You mean all your laughy emojis and character assassination posts? Those in glass houses should not throw stones.

At 6:30am on Oct 7th, Hamas fired a barrage of rockets at Southern Israel from Gaza (Hamas claimed they fired 5000, IDF claimed it was half that), under the cover of which they launched their ground attack. I can’t find in the Al Jazeera report where it says the IDF returned fire at 6:45am, this Reuters report has a very comprehensive timeline and says it was 9:45am. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/how-hamas-attack-israel-unfolded-2023-10-07/

Timings aside, if Hamas fires large numbers of rockets at Israel, the IDF responds with… a large number of rockets. The IDF were bombing positions the Hamas rockets originated from, as they were still being fired from Gaza into Israel. What should the IDF response have been?

Edited my terrible punctuation.

I haven’t been on the entire thread, but I saw enough to see that initial posts saying they don’t know of anyone who supports Hamas’ but there may be a few extremists out there that do was met with claim that pro-Palestinian protests were full of Hamas supporters, which was met with people who were at the marches saying that’s not that they saw, most people just want a ceasefire to save lives, and most of the handfuls arrested were usually far right counter protesters, not Hamas/terrorism supporters, various faulty memories of Oct 7th have been used to pull the protests out of context alleging they began before Israel started its retaliation so must be celebrating Oct 7th (temporally impossible).

The thread moved on to allegations towards posters on MN for being ‘silent Hamas supporters’ and ‘antisemites’ for not condemning Hamas frequently enough, on every thread, every day since Oct 7th. So then of course, posters are being a defensive, myself included, as this is a tired old smear and MN should consider treating it like the banned troll hunting so closely resembles.

Yes - let’s talk about 1984 instead …

You forgot to mention multiple posts off topic to derail the thread

This whole thread is about how much support Hamas has / or hasn’t got .
So … interesting to see who chooses to come on this thread to spend far more time condemning Israel than condemning Hamas.
Sometimes that reads like an attempt to suggest that Hamas’ actions are acceptable ( in the context of Israeli oppression. )
Re - “What people don’t say “…. Some ridiculous comments about it being like 1984. This is a discussion on Mumsnet . Of course silence / lack of comment can be as eloquent as words . That is basic emotional intelligence.

@ohforheavenssakedearcomeonnow yes I've read it, thanks for the patronising "explanation" though.

Hence I recognised the Orwellian nature of the PP's thought process and agreed when @BabaBarrio pointed it out.

No, sorry, but you are incorrect. The thought police monitored both what people said and did and also the lack of what the State thought they should say and do.

You really need to read 1984 in its entirety to understand the Orwellian thought police. It’s so much more than the single sentence you have lifted from Wiki. The film based on the book doesn’t even cover everything in the book.

Maybe we could get Mumsnet to make a little I Condemn Hamas Tag to put by everyone's user name or something

However that would end up looking as eeekk as twitter with various other Tag. So probably not a good idea