Please or to access all these features

Conflict in the Middle East
Thread gallery
41
ChickHenLittle · 06/11/2023 20:02

@Newbutoldfather Of course it isn't imagined, if even one Jewish person feels unsafe that's not okay. Of course I can't experience antisemitism myself, but I don't doubt your experiences one bit.
I don't see antisemitism in the responses to you, just criticism of the government.
If you do see antisemitism on here, please report it. I have done so with islamophobic comments I've come across and MNHQ are usually on the ball with quickly reviewing and deleting any such posts.

MrTiddlesTheCat · 06/11/2023 20:01

RafaistheKingofClay · 06/11/2023 18:35

It’s an absolutely enormous number in such a short space of time. Can you find me a war in which 10,000 civilians have been killed in under a month?

When the brits bombed Dresden they killed 25,000 civilians in one night.

Lovepeaceunderstanding · 06/11/2023 19:59

PurpleChrayne · 06/11/2023 13:17

I presume you're aware that Al Jazeera is the mouthpiece of Qatar, and their source is the "Palestinian Health Ministry", which is Hamas.

@PurpleChrayne , exactly but many people don’t let the truth get in the way of their prejudice.

AllWeWantToDo · 06/11/2023 19:51

MrTiddlesTheCat · 06/11/2023 19:48

If it happened in the UK, they would tell the hospital to evacuate as best they could and then go in and deal with the terrorist. They absolutely wouldn't leave the terrorist at large to continue their attack. It's madness to suggest they would.

Well yes, going in and dealing with terrorists on the ground to try and prevent loss of civilian lives is what would happen.

savvy7 · 06/11/2023 19:51

There was a story on the news yesterday that really touched me about a bomb that had been dropped.on Palestine that had killed Palestinians and ripped apart their donkey and cart. It just highlighted the difference between the two nations one with military might, no doubt supported by the US, and one of very limited means, oppressed for decades.

MrTiddlesTheCat · 06/11/2023 19:48

OuiOuiKitty · 06/11/2023 18:02

Or you know Israel could stop dropping bombs. It really isn't usual that if someone uses someone as a 'human shield' you say fuck it and kill them all. If a terrorist attack happened in the UK and the terrorist ran into a hospital or a shopping centre I hope you would be just as happy for Sunak to order the whole hospital be blown up. I mean they are just human shields right, not actual people with lives and families and hopes and dreams.

If it happened in the UK, they would tell the hospital to evacuate as best they could and then go in and deal with the terrorist. They absolutely wouldn't leave the terrorist at large to continue their attack. It's madness to suggest they would.

FOJN · 06/11/2023 19:47

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:35

@ChickHenLittle ,

Criticising Israel and its policies is not per se antisemitic. I am no fan of Netanyahu and deplore some of the creeping Apartheid and settlements in the occupied territories.

But…

I am just seeing very little empathy on here for Israelis and how they must have felt seeing their fellow citizens murdered in cold blood and their corpses desecrated. And, for me, as someone of Jewish descent, it is this that is troubling.

Friends I know are afraid to go out wearing their Kippahs and Jewish schools are telling their pupils to not wear uniform travelling to and from school.

I am not imagining the antisemitism.

You should feel reassured, my principles do not change depending on someone's ethnicity or religion. I have and will continue to call out antisemitism.

I will not waste my breath condemning Hamas again, it doesn't seem to make any difference.

I agree antisemitism is a problem but insisting that all criticism of the Israeli government is a cover for antisemitism is wrong.

HeidiInTheBigCity · 06/11/2023 19:46

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:35

@ChickHenLittle ,

Criticising Israel and its policies is not per se antisemitic. I am no fan of Netanyahu and deplore some of the creeping Apartheid and settlements in the occupied territories.

But…

I am just seeing very little empathy on here for Israelis and how they must have felt seeing their fellow citizens murdered in cold blood and their corpses desecrated. And, for me, as someone of Jewish descent, it is this that is troubling.

Friends I know are afraid to go out wearing their Kippahs and Jewish schools are telling their pupils to not wear uniform travelling to and from school.

I am not imagining the antisemitism.

See, I can actually get on board when you say it like this!

I, too, am horrified at the utter loss of empathy we are seeing! You would say - from your presumed perspective - that I am "Pro-Palestinian" (actually, more complicated: I happen to generally not like nationalism ... but, not the point right now!).

I cried my eyes out over 7 October! And, again, when it was confirmed Shani Louk was dead.

I agree with you over it being utterly horrific when Jewish people feel unsafe, given how heated the discussion has become.

As a matter of fact: I have personally asked a colleague "can you please ping XY and ask him how he is - because, in case you were not aware, XY is Jewish, and he might not be okay. But also: I may not be the right person to reach out, given that he knows about my politics!"

But also: my Egyptian-born, Germany-based colleague, whom I have had over for a meeting, does not feel safe either, given the climate of "general suspicion" against anyone vaguely "Arab" or "Muslim" that has embroiled Germany over all of this. I have, literally, offered the guy to make up some spurious "business need" to be at the London office for a while if things got too much. Coptic Christian person, by the way - hardly likely to take up arms for the khalifa!

We have all got to try and stop dehumanisation whereever we see it happen! And push for political solutions.

Because if we do not, it will happen again. And again, and again, and again, and again. And eventually, it may be us and our children!

THAT is why!

EasterIssland · 06/11/2023 19:43

howdoesyourgardengrowinmay · 06/11/2023 19:42

How many Israeli's murdered by hammas?

This chart shows up to 2020

Number of Palestinians killed in Israeli attacks on Gaza over 10,000 😡
howdoesyourgardengrowinmay · 06/11/2023 19:42

Ohlalalalala · 06/11/2023 13:10

How many Israeli's murdered by hammas?

Solider · 06/11/2023 19:39

If any muslim is fighting for their freedom he is a terrorist.but if any person belongs to other religions is killing innocents and using nuclear weapons then he is a brave person

FOJN · 06/11/2023 19:38

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:22

The clear antisemitism on this thread is shocking.

Israel had men, women and children slaughtered in a terrorist act by a terrorist organisation (as decreed by our government),

And people think Israel going after Hamas is awful. I just didn’t get the same vibe when the western world went after two whole nations to get to Al Qaeda. Yes, there were protests, but nothing like the same anger. When Jews are killed, people always look for justification and lack empathy: it is tragic.

Israel can’t afford to go in softly given Hezbollah on their other border and Hamas hiding among civilians.

It is a tiny country with a population of only 9 million.

No one has an issue with Israel dealing with Hamas. Apart from a few deranged individuals most people see them as the terrorists they are.

Can you tell me why objecting to the deaths of thousands of civilians, who have no means of escaping the bombing, is antisemitic?

Is it antisemitic to say that depriving civilians of food, water and basic medical care is a crime against humanity?

I would argue that your accusation of antisemitism in response to these criticisms of the Israeli government is antisemitic itself.

Wonderously · 06/11/2023 19:38

It’s horrifying that Israel has now broken multiple international laws, murdered 10k innocents and yet we are only requesting a pause.

lotus786 · 06/11/2023 19:35

savvy7 · 06/11/2023 19:28

If someone doesn't agree with what the Israeli state is doing, does that make them anti -semitic?

No Jewish people blocked off a train station in london during a protest and have been coming out in full force condemning what is happening in Palestine. It's definitely not antisemitic. It's just easy for that to be used to keep people quiet and from speaking up. Many of the Jews speaking up lost family members in the holocaust. For decent human beings, this isn't about race or religion. It is about right and wrong.

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:35

@ChickHenLittle ,

Criticising Israel and its policies is not per se antisemitic. I am no fan of Netanyahu and deplore some of the creeping Apartheid and settlements in the occupied territories.

But…

I am just seeing very little empathy on here for Israelis and how they must have felt seeing their fellow citizens murdered in cold blood and their corpses desecrated. And, for me, as someone of Jewish descent, it is this that is troubling.

Friends I know are afraid to go out wearing their Kippahs and Jewish schools are telling their pupils to not wear uniform travelling to and from school.

I am not imagining the antisemitism.

EasterIssland · 06/11/2023 19:34

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:22

The clear antisemitism on this thread is shocking.

Israel had men, women and children slaughtered in a terrorist act by a terrorist organisation (as decreed by our government),

And people think Israel going after Hamas is awful. I just didn’t get the same vibe when the western world went after two whole nations to get to Al Qaeda. Yes, there were protests, but nothing like the same anger. When Jews are killed, people always look for justification and lack empathy: it is tragic.

Israel can’t afford to go in softly given Hezbollah on their other border and Hamas hiding among civilians.

It is a tiny country with a population of only 9 million.

So people not agreeing of you saying “why are you caring if 98% of the population will still be alive” are antisemites. I mean following your own logic why do you care about those dying in 7-10 if only 1400 died ! Maybe cuz some of us care about those that die independently of the amount … they’re people at the end of the day and we care about Palestinians and Israelians. If that’s being antisemitism…

MorrisZapp · 06/11/2023 19:32

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:22

The clear antisemitism on this thread is shocking.

Israel had men, women and children slaughtered in a terrorist act by a terrorist organisation (as decreed by our government),

And people think Israel going after Hamas is awful. I just didn’t get the same vibe when the western world went after two whole nations to get to Al Qaeda. Yes, there were protests, but nothing like the same anger. When Jews are killed, people always look for justification and lack empathy: it is tragic.

Israel can’t afford to go in softly given Hezbollah on their other border and Hamas hiding among civilians.

It is a tiny country with a population of only 9 million.

Anyone who can watch the scenes coming out of Gaza and not feel utter heartbreak must be disconnected from humanity. To accuse people feeling helpless and horrified about the scale of the carnage of being anti semitic is so far into left field as to make you look like a fanatic.

savvy7 · 06/11/2023 19:32

I think Israel is risking a much broader conflict in the Middle East. I fail to see how its actions , in the long term, will increase the safety and security of its citizens.

Wonderously · 06/11/2023 19:32

I believe the numbers are correct. Historically they have consistently provided accurate numbers so no reason to doubt. Looking at multiple bombed out buildings and extensive damage to Gaza landscape, 10k doesn’t surprise me

OuiOuiKitty · 06/11/2023 19:31

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:22

The clear antisemitism on this thread is shocking.

Israel had men, women and children slaughtered in a terrorist act by a terrorist organisation (as decreed by our government),

And people think Israel going after Hamas is awful. I just didn’t get the same vibe when the western world went after two whole nations to get to Al Qaeda. Yes, there were protests, but nothing like the same anger. When Jews are killed, people always look for justification and lack empathy: it is tragic.

Israel can’t afford to go in softly given Hezbollah on their other border and Hamas hiding among civilians.

It is a tiny country with a population of only 9 million.

I explained on another thread today why I am vehemently opposed to Israel. I come from a country that was occupied. There was a genocide in my country that was carried out by starving people. I am watching another occupying power trying to starve 2.2million people. I watched a girl not much older than my teen crying yesterday because she was starving. Can you understand why that might my turn my stomach? Why no matter who does it due to the history of my people I would find it repellent? The same country who committed genocide in my country are right beside Israel, condoning the starving of more people. Can you see why I would find that chilling? Not everything is black and white. Not everything is antisemitic.

abupkis · 06/11/2023 19:30

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

abupkis · 06/11/2023 19:29

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

Newbutoldfather · 06/11/2023 19:28

@abupkis ,

Using your warped logic, Al Qaeda were the victims of 9/11.

savvy7 · 06/11/2023 19:28

If someone doesn't agree with what the Israeli state is doing, does that make them anti -semitic?