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Conflict in the Middle East

"You don’t need to share your views on Gaza"

67 replies

TheWayTheLightFalls · 02/11/2023 14:40

A) Headline is terrible b) absolutely aware of posting my opinion of someone else's opinion about everyone having too much of an opinion on things, on a chat forum which is all about sharing opinions. And I can give or take James Marriott. But, actually - I agree with this.

"One of the bleakest discoveries of the pandemic was quite how many people imagined themselves to be amateur epidemiologists brimming with compelling insights on lockdowns and vaccine science. The war in Ukraine turned the epidemiologists into experts on military hardware. The war in Gaza has bestowed an unexpected new round of degrees in Middle Eastern history."

He goes on to explicate, though I'm not sure how much of a published paywalled newspaper article I can legitimately post here.

I just wish there was more "I don't know", more "It seems like x but I can also see that it might be y, or z". More "Here's something I found but does anyone know anything about this source, is it legit?" People on this forum are literate, typically with some education behind them, demographically likely to be at or near middle age. I cannot bear the hot takes and unreferenced links from all corners of the internet. It's unhelpful and, I'd say, actually harmful - people read it and get stirred up and pushed to more extreme position taking, more black and white thinking.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/you-dont-need-to-share-your-views-on-gaza-n87dq0sj9

This thread will change nothing, of course, but if we're all sharing our opinions then this is mine.

You don’t need to share your views on Gaza

Today’s mania for self-expression sparks a rush to pronounce on big events, often in ignorance

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/you-dont-need-to-share-your-views-on-gaza-n87dq0sj9

OP posts:
ferntwist · 02/11/2023 20:55

How do we use the share token? It doesn’t seem to come up when I click the link. Thank you

Lamelie · 02/11/2023 20:49

Also read that article and couldn’t disagree more. I hope I’d have had an opinion on the rise of the Nazis, treatment of First Nation peoples, sterilisation of the mentally disabled, disenfranchisement on the basis of race, ditto sex, slavery, child labour, child sacrifice in ancient Maya.
🤡

Abra1t · 02/11/2023 17:37

[to stop]

Abra1t · 02/11/2023 17:36

LittleMsTellTheTruth · 02/11/2023 15:20

Only a certain type of person would want people to be and stay ignorant.

I’ve reading, learning, watching, listening and educating myself more.
And it horrifying.
Words are not enough.
Everything Israel has done since -48, everything every single Palestinian has been through.
Humanity ows them everything.

So, like I said, everyone who wants people to stay ignorant, is most likely not a good person / have good intentions.

He doesn’t want people not to educate themselves. He wants people spouting off based on watching a few TikTok’s.

BeethovenNinth · 02/11/2023 17:35

I read that article and couldn’t disagree more

calyrex · 02/11/2023 17:34

GirrlCrush · 02/11/2023 14:43

My opinion has been formed on tik tok of all places

Seeing with my own eyes what's happening first hand....in both Gaza and Israel.

No need for any newspapers, tv journalists sat in studios, specialists,epidemiologists or whatever else.

Who needs experts when you have tiktok Confused

FOJN · 02/11/2023 17:12

I don't need a degree in Middle Eastern history to know that collective punishment of a captive civilian population is wrong.

Feel free to direct me to the approved sources of information which will make deliberately depriving people of food, water and basic medical care morally OK? If becoming an "expert" is required to overlook these crimes against humanity then I'd rather stay ignorant.

By your logic we would all need multiple degrees in a range of subjects to have an opinion on anything or be qualified to vote.

Itisyourturntowashthebath · 02/11/2023 17:11

There are a couple of people on here who I hope run UK military or governance strategy irl (unlikely). Grin I read a post earlier and my first response was, we need you on a negotiating team.

I like a mix of opinion and fact, I like my links long and to noninflammatory sources. Wikipedia is fine it does the job plus it is referenced and has an edit history.

Misinformation, half quotes and daily mail type headlines irritate me.

Everyone brings something to the table, because everyone views the issue from a different angle. Black and white thinkers are often scared.

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 02/11/2023 16:47

Sometimes the evidence is there for all to see. And corroborated by the media and UN. This isn't the case regarding vaccines, where ignorant people were spouting pseudoscience.

TheWayTheLightFalls · 02/11/2023 15:45

I can see it mybed. There are a couple of people on here who I hope run UK military or governance strategy irl (unlikely). But at the moment for me these are heavily outweighed and on a democratic forum it often feels like who is shouting the loudest.

I don’t think it’s about staying ignorant @LittleMsTellTheTruth , or that’s not how I read it. More imo about reading plenty, reflecting and channeling that in ways that are useful.

OP posts:
MyBedIsMySpiritualHome · 02/11/2023 15:24

Listening to what was going on in the government during the run-in to covid showed me that actually ‘amateurs’ (like those on the MN Covid data thread at the time) can actually be extremely accurate and insightful, showing better understanding and insight then those in power.

So I disagree to a degree. I don’t think on all occasions that sitting back and ‘letting the leaders’ deal with it in the way they see fit is necessarily the best thing to do. When you consider what a mess they often make of it.

I think using the channels we can (MPs etc) to express our views is healthy and reasonable.

Bobslug · 02/11/2023 15:24

The trouble with learning about stuff from tik tok is that it doesn’t help you analyse what’s going on. War is always terrible. Sometimes it is undoubtedly necessary. Often it is not. What should Israel do to protect its citizens from Hamas?

StarbucksSmarterSister · 02/11/2023 15:21

Too many people opine without having any understanding of the background. This article is absolutely correct.

LittleMsTellTheTruth · 02/11/2023 15:20

Only a certain type of person would want people to be and stay ignorant.

I’ve reading, learning, watching, listening and educating myself more.
And it horrifying.
Words are not enough.
Everything Israel has done since -48, everything every single Palestinian has been through.
Humanity ows them everything.

So, like I said, everyone who wants people to stay ignorant, is most likely not a good person / have good intentions.

Hellers · 02/11/2023 14:56

Excellent post OP and a very thought provoking article.

GirrlCrush · 02/11/2023 14:43

My opinion has been formed on tik tok of all places

Seeing with my own eyes what's happening first hand....in both Gaza and Israel.

No need for any newspapers, tv journalists sat in studios, specialists,epidemiologists or whatever else.

OP posts: