Justifying the rape of women

I think Hamas probably would if they could, and then some.

Does that mean that the government of Palestine can now take eye for eye and kill as many Israelis as the % of civilians that have died is quite high ?

This still doesn't make it right, no matter how you look at it.

It does. There were fewer deaths per capita in the 911 attacks than the 7 Octobe ones, as the US has a far larger population. I don't know how to make it any clearer. Those are the figures.

It would depend on the politician and public pressure but atrocities that are that barbaric would be extremely hard to deal with

This still doesn't make it right, no matter how you look at it.

As I understand it the response taken by the US and allies to 9/11 is now considered even by them to have been a mistake.

That’s why Biden warned Netanyahu not to make the same mistake America did.

Far fewer? Nearly 3000 died on the day, don't forget to add the ones who died of their injuries and of cancer, directly attributed to the events of that day.

I said far fewer as a percentage. Ie of overall population.

Tbf the US / U.K. response to 9/11 gave an indication of scale

Far fewer? Nearly 3000 died on the day, don't forget to add the ones who died of their injuries and of cancer, directly attributed to the events of that day.
But, because, according to you, there was no torture or rape, it is obviously not as bad as what happened on 07/10.
I also find it distasteful to compare and grade suffering. It is insulting to the family of any victims and demonstrate a blatant bias: as in, my people's suffering is worth than yours.
By the way, I fully opposed the war in Iraq and was pleased when the French government refused to join in, on the second wave of attacks.

Speculation.

If there are no comparable situations, how can you be so sure what the UK/US/EU would or wouldn't do?

9/11 killed far fewer people as a percentage than 7 October, and there was no torture or sexual violence, and the US went into both Afghanistan and Iraq. I don't need to tell anyone here what those death tolls were either.

Etiquette isn't usually written down. You can just see it from how others behave. Most people quote the poster they are replying to, and use an @ for an important question. I was just a bit confused as to why you would @ me to explain something, then wheni did @ me again to say you understood and disagreed.

I am trying to put this very clearly so you don't misunderstand. If I sound pompous as a result that's a risk I'll have to take.

Wow. OK then. I mean my recollection of the UK at the time was the terror threat was pretty scary.

If there are no comparable situations, how can you be so sure what the UK/US/EU would or wouldn't do?

I was living in Birmingham when the IRA used to blow things up. It was nothing like 7 October.

In fact I'm struggling to think of any comparable situation at all.

Exactly. Me too!

Oh really. I don't think that was the response the UK took during the 70s/80s/90s when there were terrorist attacks by dissident republicans on UK soil.

I also don't think the action the USA took after 9/11 was comparable.

In fact I'm struggling to think of any comparable situation at all.

The outcome is huge suffering but not escalating to other countries too much. The hard part is removing Hamas to install another leadership.

If Hamas were to attack again I would fear for the extent of reaction and what it would cause globally.

@AdamRyan I didn't realise there was an 'etiquette'. I know there are talk guidelines but I am struggling to find anything under that.

Do you mean to sound so pompous?

25th of October so you could say that they are traumatised from the event quite early on. A reaction pretty soon after?

If those 7 Oct raids had happened on UK, EU or US soil, I am pretty sure the consequences would be at least as horrific, perhaps more so.

Over 30,000 people have been killed in Gaza, over half of them children. Gaza is on the verge of an entirely predictable famine, with children under 2 most at risk of starvation. 2.5million people have been trapped in Gaza with no way to escape for almost 6 months, moved from place to place like animals without access to food and water.

Damn right that should be seen as unjustified and disproportionate action in the 21st century. Especially by a western-style democratic country that's allied with the UK, EU and USA.

This is the OP (from December):

Something I keep coming back to.. for the people whose sympathies lie with the Palestinians and think an eye for an eye and that Hamas have been pushed to act the way they have, how do you justify the brutal rape of women by Hamas?

This comes across to me as someone who clearly thinks the actions against Palestinians is a consequence of Hamas rapes. It's not a very balanced OP.

It was barbaric

So shocking, I can’t forget the poor people who suffered from extreme atrocities

I didn't say that, just wondered why you were tagging me in every post that was one line long. Its not the usual etiquette.

I just feel it's unfair, we see so many posts on MN talking about how sickening the attacks on Gaza are, which of course is clearly true. But to bluntly describe them as disproportionate and/or unjustified strikes me as showing an arrogant and callous disregard for the suffering of Israel and the impossible position it's in.

@Dibilnik of course it's insensitive but then that's the point for people.