To TTC or not to TTC, that is one of the many questions...

juices - euw!

Sorry, am not very grown up am I? Might give it a whirl then, but perhaps next month

I am amazed. What I am seeing is straight out of the book. I just wanted to give it a go to see what was happening after the pill, and use it as a distraction to my stress about giving up the syntho-hormones . I feel like it may give me a bit of control back, TBH. Also, maybe get used to it so if we TTC, things may be a bit easier (I know it often isnt as straight forward as that). I didnt expect it to be so obvious, once I knew what to look for. Although Im only on month 1, yet!

I think maybe you could do what I did - get the book, have a read and chose what bits to apply, if any. Even from an educational point of view, its good. Not that you have to buy this particular book to do that, but once you see the cool graphs and get intrigued, its a slippery (no pun intended...) slope to buying a thermometer and keeping an eye on the juices.

Can't help with the satsumas. Sorry.

Suerock DON'T surf for houses you can't afford as you're bound to see the perfect one, perhaps just tantalisingly out of your price range! So, which decisions would be made easier by having a baby and which would be harder? And which way are you leaning?

Hmm, maybe you are right - they didn't want a load of pregnant schoolies so told them NO sex without protection. Ever. I guess also that the age you were taught these things is more the age where you could conceive a hell of a lot more easily than now so it was probably a very wise move.

Am intriguied with this TCOYF business but not sure if I am intruiguied enough to buy the book and start temping etc. Can you, now you are looking, really tell what's going on then? Having never taken much notice of what's going on 'down there' it may have a novelty factor (but how shortlived would this novelty be...) DH might like the idea of not having to pull out through

HP lol reading your description of "fertile eggy juice" crikey, I was almost sick on the screen! only kidding but my sickness ramped up today.

Suerock nice to see that you popped in and hope that things are brighter for you soon.

Talking about loving our pets, I think i have worked out what kind of father DH will be. He is constantly saying to the cats (usually when they are scratching the carpet "now we don't do that do we, no good boys don't do that!" always makes me smile from when I overhear this conversation. Cats and us are currently curled up on the sofa.

Also does anyone know why, oh why you buy a bag of satsumas from sainsburys (yesterday) to find this evening that one of them is mouldy and the others are unripe as anything

Well. I think what we are all taught for education/scientific purposes is based on every possibility, ie on a population level, but at the same time using understandable but perhaps misleading averages, like 28 day cycles and ovulation on Day 14.

My interpretation is that the situation really varies depending on the individual. Say you had ovulated really early in your cycle, and you had sex on the last day of your period. If you had good, sperm friendly CM after the bleeding stopped, it is theoretically possible they could hang around until the egg was released. Perhaps it isnt likely, but it can happen. A lot of figures are given, such as how long sperm can survive in the good eggy juice (5 days) or the dry nasty juice (hours). If you are a fertile 23 year old, you might get many days of fertile eggy juice, thus extending the days in which you could conceive. If you only get 1 day of the stuff, then your chances drop a bit, unless you have had well times sex. The life of the egg seems fairly set at hours-24 hours. Once its gone, its gone, and game over for another month.

The whole thing is a complex but beautifully simple pattern of 'if this happens, then that happens and then this may occur'.

Regards charting. So far, Im enjoying it, but there is a big novelty factor. You have to temp every morning at around the same time, and keep an eye on your CM via fingers and/or pant checking. There is online software to help you keep track and interpret it. Thats actually pretty much it. Im now of the opinion that I couldnt not watch all this going on. Its pretty cool.

Sex education - I think they didn't want to confuse matters (or have a bunch of pregnant school girls to cope with) so we were definitely told you could get pregnant any time! It was all a bit Victorian, now I come to think about it....

I'm doing OK - some days I have a complete meltdown, some days I'm confident it will all work out somehow, most of the time I just panic a bit about how my CV isn't finished yet and how having a baby in the middle would both complicate matters and also make some decisions easier. At the moment I'm surfing for houses we can't afford but which are baby-compatible

Is it worth a buy then? Is it quite faffy - lots of temping and, euw, poking around? Or is it reasonably simple once you get the hang of it?

I want to ask a dumb question. When you were at school and had sex education you got told that you can get pregnant any time, inc even on your period. Considering now some of us are actually considering (I think 'wanting' is too strong a word for lots of us here!) TTC it seems we actually really only have a very small window. Please, Dr HP SP can you explain this to me....?

Writing a report for a course I am doing. Deadline looming. And updating my CV for the job I am interested in. Deadline Friday.

Suerock it's good to hear from you. How are things? I hope they are a bit better and, if not, things are manageable.

I am with you on wishing that babymaking was a bit more predictable. The odds of 20% conception each month doesn't sound great and I think it would very easily take over your lives if you let it.

Yup, it's true and I'll say it loud and proud - I love all my animals with all my heart! So, ner!

HP what are you meant to be doing for us to distract you from?

That is true, but the information provided on how to chart is really good. It is also good at explaining what is happening throughout the cycle. The book is equally written from the point of view of contraception and pregnancy achievement, but I think more people probably use it to conceive than not, given the preference for active contraception like the pill. I figured it was a small amount of money so if I hated it, it didnt matter, and as it is I am finding it fascinating to see it all unfold before my eyes (or fingers )

Suerock! Lovely to hear from you. Please stay for a while! Hope you are ok. How are things?

Just been reading reviews of Taking Charge of Your Fertility on Amazon and, while HIGHLY recommended it all seems to be from people wanting to get pregant rather than the opposite!

Evening all,

Just flitting in and out of MN occasionally at the moment but thought I would drop by and say hello. Sounds like there's lots of exciting things going on like ovulation and snakes and stuff Hope you're all doing OK.

I wish baby-making was a lot more precise than it is. I would really like to say, OK then, I definitely want a baby, therefore a baby will definitely happen, and at a time of my choosing. Ho hum.

Hello! Im back. Another night of work so am catching up with you all before cracking on!

I dont care what anyone says, I adore my cats and couldnt be without them. They have their own personalities and are members of my family. I actually think looking after them has taught both me and DH a lot about responsibility and caring for them surely is a small step towards a human-baby? After all, we cant just drop everything and go a'visiting without making provision for them, and making sure they are healthy and fed is a commitment. Life is too short and full of enough negativity without people getting snooty about how others feel about their pets. Personally I would have laughed at the text from Confused - whats not to like?

My temp stayed high today, and Fertility Friend made the expected adjustment and has me ovulating on Day 13. Yippee! I am firmly in the Luteal Phase now, and the EWCM has gone. The issue of endometriosis has me a bit worried, so its been good to see that no matter what else is going on, some bits might be working . Unfortunately my pregnancy score has rocketed because FF assumes you are trying to conceive, so the good lovin' on Day 13 is considered baby-making rather than protected. Am intrigued as to the trials and tribulations of CM, LST, as Im on a big learning curve.

Right, I'd better do some work. But feel free to distract me....

Oh my goodness, OBEM. Very very moving. Lots of weeping here too. And what lovely parents. So glad that both relationships seemed rock solid as it must put you through sheer hell. I have friends who are going through something similar (and things are pretty bad for their child) so it felt very close to home. They are amazing people, just humbling in their positive attitude and strength and love for each other and their child - like the people on the programme.

I've never been much in close proximity to a dog but I can imagine it's very similar. I also felt your friend's comment was a little off, confused, but glad you're not offended/upset (and neither are they now) - I guess different rules have to apply and you have to make allowances for people when they are that fatigued.

One day perhaps I'll get onto my trials and tribulations with CM - never seems typical and have never really pinpointed ovulation (and more issues which I'll spare you) - but have never quite got to the bottom of it (so to speak!) and every test says everything is fine. Anyway, good luck with it all, HP.

Right, must do some work - hope your night of working was ok, HP - sounds a bit hardcore.

Er... "a dog of visiting"? No idea what that was meant to be but I think it's a typo! A lot of visting perhaps? Anyway, S said he thinks my dog should be on a lead IN the house as well as out as I didn't make that clear either!

Trying to type really fast doesn't work does it, it just means about a third of it doesn't end up making sense...

I have done the comparing children to dogs on more than one occassion where, in retrospect, it wasn't appropriate! I forget that not everyone thinks of them (well, animals) like I do, and people can have especially strong feelings that are anti dog.
Two year olds and dogs are very similar indeed - and when my dog has a 'teenage' moment it is scarily similar to when humans do too!
When I went to London my dog was so over tired and over stimulated she couldn't switch off, and instead wenr all hyper but erratic at the same time. It hadn't helped that she hadn't had a massive run about since the very early morning either (the park was full of bikes and she has a bit of a thing for bikes, which would be easier to control if they were more spread out but in SW2 this isn't going to happen!) She has been similar on a weekend away with about 15 others - but luckily that was in the countru so she could run about as and when she wanted (and when we got back she refused to leave the house for the first day she was so tired!) Gotta love 'em, eh?

As for LQ's commnet about being pissed off about what someone said about her cats chin - perhaps we're all bonkers but I get rather uppity if someone criticizes any of my animals looks or behaviour too! It's almost like a personal affront! When I told S that my dog had been walking the streets off lead he made a comment about it being her behaviour in the house when she should be on a lead that was 'concerning.' He then added she was a 'pain in the arse.' Well, ill or not I was very cross with him! I didn't say so but wanted to point out that in his chaotic house with people coming and going, a dog of visiting, no running about since that morning etc etc she did bloody well, thank you very much! And, while we're at it, S, you try bringing up a dog and then you'll see how bloody easy it is - HA! Ooops, getting carried away again...

Top news YTD that you don't feel sick any more. Maybe there is more to the healing properties of a Travel Lodge breakfast than we would have initially presumed!

Right, I am being strict and signing off as I need to get washed and take this dog out before I go to work.

Have a lovely day, all!

Confused - so true! Have caught myself more than once almost blurting out something (well intendedly) that non doggy types would never get and that the parents would be bound to have found offensive!!
Like, dogs behave like children a lot of the time. Two year olds really. The difference is they stay that way all their life! Then, as you said- consistency. Setting boundaries. Oh, and giving them some direction when they don?t know what to do!! and negative psychology works for my dog at least! have you also noticed that both end up havng this sudden spurt of energy when they're totally tired and should actually be in bed? So tucking both into bed at that point work for both!

Ended up watching OBEM - those babies are so tiny and so precious.

Lol re babies & dogs! I have never had a dog, always had cats. we have 2 cats and one of my closest friends said she didnt like my cats chin! talk about cutting! i said that she might be able to say that about my cat but if she said that about my kids i would kick her behind! ah she's a funny one!

I'm loving the snake jokes - its funny its one of the pet names me and DH have for each other (yes, I know its nauseating!) And SeaGreen - I did too think of Snakes on the Plane! Will check out the lady parts site.

Watched OBEM tonight- oh my word, DH was a bit emotional after too. He got annoyed when the little boy, William came out of his operation and was asking why the Dr's were not straight there to tell the mum what had happened.

It made me think- the worry never stops does i; when you have children I mean. I don't mean that in a pessimistic way but it really does put things in perspective.

Confused I am not much help with what you are meant to have in your knickers, temps or the range of abbreviations. However I do know how bad it could be if you type the wrong thing into google. Just be aware!

YTD good to hear you are feeling good. Yay a small face! :-) I am still a bit dodge on my dates since the whole calculator hiccup- i am either 7 weeks or 8 . Thanks for your advice re work - I think my boss would be ok, she wouldn't blab, I just think it might make it a bit easier if I do tell her, but then again maybe I am better to wait until 12 weeks. Hmmm

HP it wasn't sad as such, just really moving. Premature and or ill babies etc but no deaths and a reasonably positive end.

Seagreen babies and dogs are SOOOOO similar it's not true! The consistency etc and being firm but kind blah blah blah. However, if someone is not into dogs they look at you in horror if you say such things (I know from bitter experience.)

On phone but back shortly

Purposefully - and on purpose!- ignoring the fact that OBEM is on. Oh, go on then, may just get the remote after posting this.
Check this out for a little light hearted fun (so I?ve been seeing all these posters about town) and go to this site, and find it?s an ad for the mooncup (remember we spoke about it on the old thread)! Anyway the site has this button where you can submit what you call your lady bits- and clearly a lot of people did- some of the names are hilarious! here - click to the link at the bottom that says 'tell us what you call yours'.
Confused - glad the situation with your friends got sorted. Dare say they went a bit OTT in their response because of their stress levels- I didn?t think your comment was offensive at all! Though I do say that a lot of doggie rules apply to children (and some rules like keeping it consistent etc apply all through!)- and it?s difficult to keep comments bottled in sometimes when I meet parents with new children! Though it?s got to be better than the woman i know who cooed at the new mum and her baby ?ooh, so cute, it?s just like a puppy!?
LQ- if you took a flight now, it would be Snakes on the Plane! < Crawls off after cracking horrible joke of the week>

Is it sad? I dont do well with sad stuff.