To TTC or not to TTC, that is the question... as Hamlet sort of said about something else entirely

Each test result will bring more information, and the doctors will use this to plan the path your friend could take regards his treament. Like you say, you will all know more after the biopsy.

How are you doing? When is DH back? I know you said you felt better able to cope with the initial shock by yourself, but I think the time has come for a well deserved cuddle.

Hope those of us who live in the east got home safe and sound before the snow hit.

I think, but I don't know (my opinion is based on a very small sample of case studies, not a general care pathway) that 3 months of chemotherapy is indicative of a containing course of treatment, rather than a 'cure' attempt.

Just had a look at the Cancer Research site. It says the following about chemo for advanced panreatic cancer:

"If you have symptoms from advanced pancreatic cancer, your doctor may suggest chemotherapy. The chemotherapy won't cure the cancer but it might shrink your cancer and so help to relieve some of the symptoms. It may help to slow down the growth of the cancer for a while."

It sounds like a positive move, the results are mixed, but treatment to slow the spread of / shrink the cancer, could give your friend more time. Some times the extra time can be quite long (my Gran had uncurable ovarian cancer for 5 years, which was about 4 years longer than expected), but timescales can be cruelly unpredictable.

But yes, I think you are right to be mildly hopeful, if teh cancer actually shrinks in response to treatment, that could give your friend several additional months (or even years) of comfortable life. Incurable does not always = immediate.

Update!
He has to have a biopsy on Monday. This will then give more of an idea for treatment, which will be either chemo or, bleakly, a case of making him more comfortable. The consultant was talking in three month chunks of chemo too, which is sort of promising.

Isn't it...?

This is helping me so much, thank you!

No, he doesn't have a partner. He has a ridiculous number of friends but no girlfriend. I think it's sinking in slowly now (but may again hit me like a tonne of bricks) so I think I'll be able to hold it together a bit more when I speak to him. He is a very open person who doesn't have any qualms about bursting into tears in front of people so may already be doing, I am not sure.

I suppose I could say I am lucky in the sense that I have never had something like this to deal with so far in my life (not that I am feeling very lucky!) as it's so prevalent - cancer I mean - and so many have direct and hearbreaking stories.

I think I'll give him a call tonight. He hasn't updated his blog thing yet about the trip to the oncologist (this may sound weird behaviour but it is 'very' him) so not sure what's going on there yet. Hopefully we'll know more soonish and then can start to deal with it. He sounds very keen to try chemo so hopefully this can be a good option that won't compromise his quality of life too much.

Going round in circles (as is my head) so will stop typing now and re-read all your lovely messages.

Confused, your friend sounds to be handling things as well as he could be in thh circumstances. I think you have the right attitude (i.e. not being optimistic when its just not realistic, not wanting ot be emotional all olver your friend). I do think its important that you keep communicating and that you do speak to / see him soon. You are right to not want to weep all over him, but I do think you need to be in touch and be honest. I think real emotional reactions can be quite helpful. And if you are someone that your friend can be a little more touchy feeliy with, then he might appreciate contact where his upper lip doesn't have to be so stiff.

This is probably a bit tagental, but one of my Mum and dad's friends (went to school with my Dad - so a really old friend) turned up at the hospital when Dad was dying (it was fairly sudden in the end, despite the fact that he'd been ill for a while, so the village grapevine was working overtime). She was actually too late (his life support machine was switched off 30 minutes before she arrived) but she'd wanted to let my dad know just how much she loved him. In someone else it might has been an intrusion, but her response (and her affection for my dad) was so real that it was just lovely. Me and mum ended up having to spend a good hour mopping her up and looking after her, but it just felt good to know that others were are cut the core as we were.

Does your friend have a partner? I just ask cos if he is getting that sort of close emotional support already then your are probably right to hang back a bit. But I think if you are one of few people with whom he can share closer emotions, then do get in touch and don't try to be stronger than your currently are. Maybe he needs an opportunity to be a bit emotional alongside someone with whom that is sort of normal behaviour?

I think what I'm getting at is that whilst an emotional response from mates with whom he has never had that type of relationship would be pretty awkward, maybe an emotional response from you wouldn't be so bad, as that is a bit more normal? In my limited experience of terminal illness, what sufferers want as much as possible is a bit of normality, as we do all have to get on with the business of living, even whilst we are dying.

Take care. xxx

Hello, Am home again today as was no use at work. Turns out the woman I work with is going through the exact same thing with a friend of her's, who has a matter of weeks left.
My friend is at the hospital now and is probably being given various options for treatment. He sounds quite chipper in his online blog thing, which is great (amazing even?) and seems to be getting a lot of strength from the messages he is getting.

HP think the analogy of feeling like your heart is being ripped out is very accurate.

[take care confused - just a small line to say hang in there, this too shall pass]

thank you x

Oh petal, I just don't know what to say. You did the right thing leaving work, you need some time to yourself with this news.

I lost someone I loved dearly to cancer a few years ago, and when I was told the prognosis I felt like my heart was being ripped out.

Two things are going to get you through all this - love, and support. I hope we can be there for you, in our slightly weird, small way.

X

Thank you all.
I left work today as I unravelled and would have been no use - they were lovely about it and have been told to take as much time as I need. The lady I work for, one I didn't seem to get on with very well, was so lovely but said, as I was leaving, 'I hope you get good news.' That's the thing, I won't get good news. This is not me being pessimistic, I am possibly the most optimistic person I know, but it is realistic. I can't think of anything else at the moment. It's easier when I am with other people but it still comes in waves. I can liken it to when you split with someone you have been with for a long time. You remember the good bits, the mediocre bits and the bad bits and it is also hard to imagine when this person - providing it was a long relationship, of course - wasn't in your life. Then, the prospect of them not being in your life is heartwrenching. Well, imagine this but 1000 times harder - you have 12 years of memories, you and this person know one another so well, and this person won't soon be in your life as soon they'll be dead.

Fuck.

Suerock I have never been backward in coming forward about mentioning the unmentionable, but know where you are coming from. My mum's friend whose husband died of cancer had people cross the street rather than have to speak to her and that must have been awful. However, I cannot ring him (person who's ill) at the moment as I will unravel, something he has specifically said he 'doesn't need.'

DH is away for a few days and while I feel disloyal for saying so, I am glad. I does get on with the person who is ill but they are not friends on their own terms, he see's him very much as my ex boyfriend. With him being away I feel as if I can indulge in the memories I have of this man being in my life without feeling as if I ought to hem it in. DH also has no former partner he is friends with so can't really relate to it.

Might have to go get glass of wine...

Oh confused, I'm so sorry to hear about your friend. Unfortunately pancreatic cancer is about as sucky as cancer can get, as I know you, and he, know. I know exactly what you mean when you say that it doesn't seem right that life just carries on. Just make sure he knows that you are there for him, whether he wants to talk about his illness or just to chat about good times. When someone's ill or bereaved, people not knowing what to say can sometimes lead to no-one saying anything, which can be very isolating.

Can't type more as am at work and pretending to be working. Hearing news of illness like your friend's brings it home to me why I do the job I do (I need a half rueful, half sad smiley here, which MN hasn't provided)

Damn it, life is unfair at times Sending you a big virtual hug, and don't worry about venting here.

Oh Confused, I'm so, so sorry. What a heartbreaking situation, for everyone involved.

I am literally walking out the door to go to work, will be back later. I'm thinking of you, and your friend.

Morning, and thank you. Just re-read your post YTD three times.

No, generally he is not very touchy feely. Well, he can be with me but I think that's possibly as we used to go out.

I have not spoken to him since I found out as I don't think I'd be able to keep it together, which would be no help for anyone. So, I send a card yesterday wishing him luck for the appointment with the specialist on Thursday. He has also set himself up a private group on Facebook that all his friends can see and I have posted a message on that, although as he specifically said he didn't want sympathy and things it was tricky to keep it light. Actually, I think it would have been tricky to write something sympathetic too now I think about it. He currently has about 100 messages from people on there and said it was a great help.

I think I do know what you are getting at when you say that it is often just as hard for those who love the person who is ill. I guess life has to carry on as normal for the likes of me, even though something like this is going on. It doesn't seem right somehow - it's almost like life should NOT carry on! It can't and really ought to stop in it's tracks surely? I really can't imagine a world without this person in it, to be honest, and, at the age we all are, it seems so bloody unfair that this is going to happen.

I've got to go and get ready for work now. Am utterly exhausted as I woke up in the night but couldn't go back to sleep as I couldn't turn my brain off.

Thanks again for the words of support - I'll write more later. So sorry to hear about what you went through with your dad too. xxx

Oh Confused, so sorry to hear that, what a crappy thing to happen. It's so unfair.

I know its going to be really hard, but I think you are goign to have to take the lead from your dear friend. If he is being stoical, then so must you. He has just been given the news that he has uncurable cancer (and pancreatic cancer with secondaries in the lungs and liver is as shitty as it gets, as I'm sure you know) and not only does he have to face that awful reality, but he has to manage the reactions and emotions of all his friends.

Have you spoken to him at all since you found out? Is he generally not particularly touchy feely (hence stoicism would be a natural first response?). I think you are right not to ring and weep all over him, probably not a good response, but you do need to be in touch soon to make sure he knows you care (but not in a mawkish way).

It's going to be tough, but I think the best think you can do is prepare yourself to be as supportive as possible for your friend. He's going to soon be living with a whole new reality of chemo and weakness and a series of 'last' things.

This might sound odd, but when you say "I cannnot imagine what it is like for him. Fuck, it's bad enough being me!" I don't think that is self obsessed and, in a strange way, being you is sort of more difficult. I always thought that when my Dad had cancer he had the slightly easier role, he had no choices, no decisions, he just had to take the treatment and fight the illness. My Mum on the otherhand had to support my Dad, keep all the practical stuff going (they were in the middle of a house renovation when he was disgnosed) and deal with all the sympathy, requests for health bulletins from friends etc and her own grief and worries about the prospect of losing her husband. I'm not explaining it very well (and not having had cancer myself, I'm probably not qualifyed to judge) but I think that sometimes it is easier to bear suffering yourself than to watch those you love suffer.

Anyway, I'm rambling now, but just wanted to say I'm really sorry. Sending lots of affection and sympathy your way and please do vent here as much as you need.

Thank you! Glad someone is there at the end of this thread as need to vent. I keep having everything go round my head and it keeps hittting me again and again like a ton of bricks. He has been ill for about 8 weeks and we knew it was something bad, but this is so bad there is no good in it, if you see what I mean. If he just had cancer of the pancreas it wouldn't be good by any stretch but as it has spread... well, you know what I am saying.

There isn't really much you can say, now I think of it, but it is nice to get messages like yours all the same. x

I?m so sorry to hear that Confused ! I really don?t know what to say as anything I say risks sounding trite. I dont know why bad things keep happening to good people. Take care, hugs, and please vent as much as you need to.

Sorry to put a downer on things but I need to brain dump and also need the support as DH is away for 3 days...

A very good friend of mine, my former boyfriend of five and a half years, has just been diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. If this is not bad enough - and read the stuff about prognosis etc on CancerUK for the grim facts - it has also rapidly spread to his liver and also a lung. In short, there isn't anything other than chemo to treat and that won't get rid of it, it will just prolong his life expectancy. I, and his many many friends, are devastated. He is being very stoic about it, and is boycotting all sympathy, which is probably a good thing as I can't imagine soppy platitudes help much when you are his shoes. I can't stop crying - hence, haven't rung as would be aliability more than anything else - but I cannnot imagine what it is like for him. Fuck, it's bad enough being me! (I hope that doesn't sound utterly self obsessed and you get what I am trying to say.)

HP and LST and any other scientist bods, can you hurry up with this cure for cancer please?! You've not got long

Just taken sleeping tablet but will log on tomorrow - sod work finding out. I feel moral support is more important and can't brain dump on my mates, who are all his mates too, as they too are in the same boat.

So, be warned - non baby related self obsessed rambling is on the cards!

Urgh. Melons through dainty bits.

(I always do 'clear history' after any MN action, removes any obvious evidence)

btw isn't this maternity dress beautiful!!
three cheers for not having to hold it in!

oops last sentence came out completely opposite in meaning and sounding very scary!!
i didn't mean "i will not stop before i freak you guys and myself in the process"- that was supposed to be "i will now stop before i freak you guys and myself in the process."

re pushing the melon through the lady bits, just a thought to make us all feel better- my book said the oxytocin in the body during labour makes the cervix stretchy so it doesnt feel like it would normally. they made the comparison before and after to the consistency of the tip of your nose (before- hard but springy) to the consistency of your lips (soft and stretchy).
i will not stop before i freak you guys and myself in the process.

Thanks for sharing the slightly less fearsome videos SeaGreen. The first one was pretty chilled. I think I liked that one best cos she wasn't screaming (cos she'd had an epidural, I note) and we didn't get a close up of the business end of the delivery. As someone who generally get light headed at the first site of a needle, I am definately in favour of practical ignorance when it comes to clinical proceedures. I like to load myself up with theoretical knowledge, but I don't want to look thank you!!

I still think that pushing something the size of a melon through my hitherto quite dainty delicate bits is the most hideous part of the whole baby thing. I am totally sold on the being a Mummy part, and the bit in the video afterwards, when the baby is breathing and safe and cleaned up made me a bit weepy. I accept that my life will be totally different post child and, whilst I don't know how to be a parent (and the prospect of teenagers terrifies me), I reckon I can figure it out and I'm sure it will be worth it. I am even coming round to the idea of being pregnant and I can see how that could be really special (although a bit of me still thinks is all abit like Alien). But I don't think I'll ever think of birth as something other than horrendous.

You know what, I think I'm feeling a bit pinkish. Not full on red, but definately an orangy pink. Like Confused I'm a bit of a control freak, I don't like my body being tampered with. Fortunately, I'm generally healthy, so don't have much to do with the medical establishment (well, apart from working for them - but I do IT systems, a little more bits and bytes, than bits and bites!), but that probably makes me all the more reluctant to put myself in a position where a variety of interested professionals can have a poke around my insides.

There isn't an emoticon for feeling slight nauseous, so I'll have to make do with this one.

I don't think I've seen a video of childbirth from the midwife's point of view since I was at school, when they were trying to put us off teenage pregnancy. (It didn't work - and here's a weird thought - the daughter of my classmate who had a baby at 17 will now be the same age as her mother was when she sprogged. So if I'd got my skates on I could be a grandmother by now )

You have to be careful with MN at work if you want to keep stuff private - I try not to go on it as all our web use is monitored, but occasionally wander through. So today, my boss grabbed my mouse and said "Do you mind? I just want to show you something on the net" - I was terrified MN would pop up in the history or something! So I too will be being a bit more restrained. And thinking of keeping stuff private, I don't think DH knows I ramble on anxiously about TTC, but I don't suppose he'd be very interested. But I suspect I am instantly identifiable to anyone who knows me.....

ok last post was a bit rambling so let me explain-
the medical bits interest me, have always been interested in biology and medicine and that sort of thing- sort of person who looks at the syringe when they give me an injection - so might be able to aim for clinical curiosity and get away with that one.
the next step- ie the actual kid is the one that worries me more due to my lack of experience with babies.
it could be my broodiness stems from v selfish feelings of wanting to undergo something special for 9 months (and adoring DH and family etc, being able to get away without holding it in, joining the club, getting to choose clothes and names etc) rather than real maternal instinct!
hope that is less rambling

maybe it's because i see things through rose tinted spectacles a bit, as i have very faint recollections of my sibling being a baby, and not much experience with babies etc after that- or at all..
I do see your point Confused.