Angels and Rainbows - remembering our angels and praying for rainbows

Sorry to see you here cake but welcome and sorry for the loss of your baby. Our first child was still born at 41+2 in August this year. Grief is a very personal thing and you will find your way. Those first few weeks are hideous. I've very nearly left Facebook a few times especially due to people complaining about their families. I also get annoyed with people at work complaining about how uncomfortable they are being pregnant and I would give anything to be in their shoes with a healthy baby growing inside me again.

Kayleigh sorry AF turned up, we tried just DTD every other day but that doesn't seem to be getting us anywhere we've only been trying for a few months but sometimes I think we will never get there.

Ducky that's awful that someone woul move the things from your little girls grave. When I was at E's grave the other day I noticed someone had gone round and left a yellow rose on some of the graves that had no flowers on. It makes me feel sad as I worry that people are judging us based on what the grave looks like, almost like the graves have been neglected so someone else has put flowers down. It just makes me uncomfortable.

AFM well work has been OK really exhausting pretending to be fine all the time. People still do that awful head tilt how are you? It's funny as people never really want to know the answer, I'm not really sure what the answer is anyway! The worst is people telling me I'm coping so much better than they would be. One colleague has tol me several times that I'm so strong that I it happened to her She wouldn't even be able to get out of bed. Makes me feel like not only could I not manage to deliver a baby who was alive but I can't even seem to greive in the way people expect! I am glad I'm back at work though despite how that might have sounded.

Hope everyone else is doing well

cake i've not heard of the smep, i'll see if i can find out about it. For the past 4 months af has arrived exactly 28 days after the previous one so i don't get why suddenly it's changed.

earth i second what critter said regarding you saying you don't belong here. Having someone here who has gone on to have their rainbow is invaluable in my opinion.

Kayleigh so sorry about AF. I've heard of the sperm meets egg plan too, the woman who set up the website on it is called 'Deanna'. It wouldn't have worked for me because of my erratic to non existent cycles, but I have a friend who used it successfully.

Cake I had my first bleed about seven weeks after J was born, but I think it was annovulatory- if you aren't breastfeeding they do come back sooner. Maybe a sign your body is trying to recover? I was pleased to have my cycles back as it signaled a new chapter but I can imagine it would bring up painful feelings too.

Earth I can't believe you said you don't belong here. I am so grateful you've been here to light the way for me and other women who haven't had subsequent babies after their loss. You are so generous to keep posting here and supporting us all. I know we all massively appreciate it. It's lovely to hear about baby M and baby F - and that M hasn't erased your grief for F, although he has brought you joy. It's useful to know these feelings continue to be complex.

Ducky hope you're doing ok. Still can't believe what happened to your little girl's grave.

kayleigh not sure if you've tried the smep (sperm meets egg plan) but I know a few people who have had success with it...sorry can't add a link at the mo but there's a whole website on it x

ducky i wasn't using any opks or anything, but the nurse i saw at my doctors had said anywhere from cd11 to cd 19 would be my fertile days. We'd dtd plenty during that time and still nothing

earth thank you for the welcome. I'm so sorry for your loss but how fantastic to hear about your rainbow, so nice to know there can be happy endings xxx

kayleigh so rubbish that AF arrived

Talking of AF, I think mine has shown up today too, 5 weeks to the day after having W by emcs. At least I think it's AF as I stopped bleeding post op over 2 weeks ago. I've only got a mild ache in my tummy, seems like the same sort of amount of blood as AF, so could it be here this soon??! Seems mad. Although I had emcs with my dd too, I bf'd for ages and AF didn't return for months so I have nothing to compare it to.

Oh Kayleigh, that's rubbish, I'm sorry. It is so disheartening when AF arrives.

Ducky, no wonder you are shaken, that is an awful thing for someone to do. I agree with talking to the council/church.

Sorry to hear about AF Kayleigh were you tracking ov in any way or just looking for signs? X

Quick update- AF has arrived- a day early. I'm so upset right now, we'd dtd lots around suspected ovulation time and it's obviously still not enough. I'm beginning to lose faith in a rainbow happening . Apologies for the wallowing post, i just feel so fed up

Love to all xx

Hi Cake, I'm so sorry that you need to join us on this thread. What a truly truly shitty year you have had. Firstly, I think you are wonderfully brave for even posting on here so early in your grief, I hope that we can support you as much as I have been supported by the ladies here. No emotions and feelings are off limits, however unattractive you might think they are, one of us has probably felt similar before, and if not, we won't judge!

I don't really "belong" here anymore, but hang around anyway. My first baby, F, was stillborn in Sept 2012 and I was blessed (and totally shell shocked) to be handed my (live) wonderful rainbow boy in March this year. He has brought happiness back into my life, in those dark dark days after F died I never thought I would be able to have a life that even came close to containing smiles and laughter, but here I am, and I feel very very lucky. I still cry for F and all of the things that we have missed out on (and I wouldn't want to not cry over him, in fact writing this has brought the tears to the surface) but the raw and painful grief has eased.

I really hope that your ttc journey is a short one.

Thinking of your wonderful W tonight, what an amazing fighter x

ducky that's so awful, I can't believe people are so heartless. As Kayleigh says it might be worth a word to your local council? Sending you hugs xx

critter thank you. I'm currently not working - hate the term sahm as always feel it sounds like I'm sitting at home all day, if only! But anyway, it does mean I don't have to face the issue of colleagues, clients etc, I can't imagine how I'd cope in my old role. So I have the welcome distraction of keeping dd busy and dealing with the interesting pre school behaviour! But at the same time, as my day to day life revolves around looking after dd, spending lots of time with other mums, babies etc, sometimes I feel like I'd welcome the change of scene an office would offer. In reality I know wherever I am I'll have rubbish days and slightly better days.

kayleigh keeping everything crossed for you for your bfp x

cake I can't say i blame you for coming off Facebook. I'm ok now, it's just a bit disheartening at first because i stupidly thought i'd be pregnant again by now. I think there's been about 20 pregnancy announcements/ births since we started trying for our rainbow in June.

ducky I'm not at all surprised you're angry- i'm angry for you! Why can't people just leave things alone? Maybe it's worth expressing your anger to your local council about it- they may be able to do something. Sending you big hugs this evening

AFM, well we're meant to be going to my friend's little girl's christening on Sunday, and said little girl had come down with chickenpox, so if AF doesn't arrive tomorrow and i get my BFP i'll have to ring the doctors to get some advice, although looking online most sites say if you've had it already you should be immune- but always best to double check

Love to all xx

oh and madem - when you have those moments of lightness, grab them, no matter how fleeting, and don't feel guilty! If G had lived, I can't imagine that he or she would want you to be in deep sadness forever. Those little moments of joy are what keep us going and sustain us through all the darkness.

ducky ugh, I'm so sorry that happened to your little girl's grave. Incidentally, if your work colleagues haven't experienced baby loss, they don't know what they are talking about. I would have gotten pregnant a month after losing J if I physically could have, so I totally understand your choice.

cake I think giving FB a miss for a while is not a bad idea. I shared a couple of photos and announced what had happened to us a month after my son was born, and got a really lovely response, but I have also hidden a LOT of people. I don't like hearing people moan about ridiculous stuff and I have a low tolerance for lots of pregnancy bump pics now. It also protects you from people who say stupid stuff to you. Nothing like losing a baby to bring out some classic remarks from idiots. These first weeks are horrific, you're being an absolute champ if you're just managing to put one foot in front of the other. Are you able to have some time off work?

How is everyone today?

I am so so angry I was feeling quite positive this morning, I went and got dd a little tree for her grave.. Took it up to her to find someone has removed things from her grave I found the things they had took, it was as if they took them and chucked them. Now I'm having a massive wobble

critter thank you so much for the welcome, and I'm so very sorry for your loss. Not an essay at all - or if it is then it's a very helpful and eloquent one so thank you xx

madem hello again and thanks for the introduction to the thread. I know exactly what you mean about playing with your dd. Sometimes I feel like such a fake when I'm playing with my dd, and angry at myself that I just can't enjoy her properly at the moment, and scared that she is picking up on the mood and how it will affect her. So generally beating myself up about everything. Hard not to, I know it's not helpful though and the psychologist we are seeing has been helpful with this side of things too. I'm so glad you woke up feeling 'normal', it's absolutely as you say, about finding a new normal I think. It's a hard road but I'm glad you're making your way along it xx

kayleigh I've come off Facebook for that very reason. Just bombarded with pregnancy announcements, births, baby photos and then people posting cr*p about what a difficult day they were having just sent me into a total rage. So I just posted that I'd be going for a while and feel a lot better for not being on there at all. The people who matter are in touch with me anyway, the rest is just noise so I'd really recommend giving it a miss for a while x

Oh Kayleigh, I hate them

I have another couple of appointments imbetween, one more scan to go, think I might hold a record for the most scans in a pregnancy!

ducky 2 weeks!! Good idea about breaking the time down into chunks, hopefully that will help. Do you have any more midwife/doctor appointments before your induction?

AFM was hit by another pregnancy announcement on facebook this morning. I'm happy for the lady in question, it's just put me in an odd mood. Think i might give the household cleaning a miss and bugger off back to bed and see if i'm in a better mood

Love to all xx

Yes I had one AF and then got pregnant, a lot of people (mainly at work) had a lot to say about this but I was just so desperate to be pg again. It's obviously a very very personal choice and a difficult decision to make but I think for me I made the right one I wanted to start TTC ASAP as I knew that would be a difficult journey and I have v long cycles so thought it would take a while but I was very very lucky.

My induction is two weeks today so I'm trying to break that time down in my head to get through it in shorter chunks

Hugs to everyone x

A sad and gentle welcome lovely cake . I am glad you have found the way to this thread, full of the kindest ladies who have been to hell and back.

Critter your words are always so poignantly accurate. Split open. I think of you all time and that little heartbeat.

Ducky I didn't realise how recently you had lost your dd either. Of course you will be a complete ball of anxiety. I really hope that time goes fast for you for the next few days until you meet your rainbow x

I read all our babies' stories and then more and then remember we do still have to move on from it. One day after the other.

Last Monday, for the first time since we had G, I woke up feeling 'normal' (for want of a better word). I immediately knew I wasn't feeling the same as usual, as my 'new normal', as someone else put it here before. I can't describe why it was different but I was very aware of it. I think my heart felt light. It didn't last. It was a fleeting sensation, but it gave me hope that I might know that feeling again some day.

We too have an almost 3 year old dd. Baby G was due in January (cake were we on the same a/n thread by any chance?). I feel like an actress reading a script sometimes when I 'pretend happy' with her. She chatters away about funny little things and I respond and interact with her - or so it seems- but inside... I try my absolute hardest to still find joy in the moments we share as they too will pass and I will long for these days of her being so little still, one day.

Gentle hugs all round tonight.

Hi cake, welcome to our little thread, but I'm so sorry you're here. The early weeks are just a fog of shock and pain. Just keep putting one foot in front of the other, talk to us if it helps, or not - we are all here for you and understand what you're going through.

My little boy died 20 hours after he was born in January - he was full term, I was 39 + 3 when he was born after a straightforward low risk pregnancy, but he had a velamentous cord insertion (where some blood vessels in the cord are exposed) which ruptured and he was deprived of oxygen for too long and had massive brain damage.

On waiting to TTC - it's really personal, I was desperate to have another baby as soon as possible, but I think it's different for everyone. I also had an emergency c section, and was told by my very experienced and wonderful consultant to wait six months to TTC again, but then he later told me I could go ahead at 4 and a half months. My son was IVF-conceived after two and a half years TTC, and we had some frozen embryos left. I got pregnant again in June but miscarried at 5 and a half weeks, and I'm now a little more than 6 weeks pregnant after another round, 10 months after my loss…. but it's been bloody scary with some big bleeds so I am not taking this pregnancy for granted at all.

TTC after losing a child is awful because you don't get a 'free ride' because of your loss - and I think that is part of the reason they recommend waiting a while. Miscarrying after my full-term loss was horrendous but I had to be ok with that possibility to go forward.

My motto on all this is 'the only way out is through'. Time passes, you feel pain like you couldn't have imagined, but the days do pass.

If you want to VBAC the risk of uterine rupture (which is very small anyway, but when you've been on the worst side of the statistics, that isn't necessarily comforting) goes down a little more after 18 months (i.e. - if you wait 9 months to TTC). Other doctors say 3 months is ok if you want a repeat c section and I know women who've gotten pregnant 3 months after a c section and a full term loss.

Sorry for the essay. Lots of love to you, and again - I'm so incredibly sorry this happened to you. It splits you open. I so hope you have good support from family and friends and I'm really glad your hospital care has been good - it makes an enormous difference.

Thank you betty for that, I think a lot of the 'wait a year' advice comes from those wanting to attempt a vbac but I was told i wouldn't be a candidate for that (and wouldn't want to either). It will be interesting to see what views I get from various medical folks but I can totally understand why they say the emotional side will take longer to figure out x

cake, re. waiting after a c-section, there doesn't seem to be a medical consensus on it. I was initially advised to wait a year, then at my six week check the consultant suggested that six months would be more realistic (partly because she was taking into account my age [37]). After three months we decided that we were really to start trying again, and got the go-ahead from the bereavement midwife. (They also suggested making sure that I had been through a full menstrual cycle before we started trying, which made a lot of sense to me). Most medical personnel suggested that being emotionally ready takes longer than being physically ready, and as kayleigh says, only you will know when that is. x

cake i too was blissfully ignorant with my DD, although not with my older DS as we'd had an early miscarriage between the 2. With regard to you TTC again, only you will know when you're ready. Sending gentle hugs xx

Oops cross post, thank you betty. It's comforting already to be sharing this with people like you that understand but I'm just so sorry we all have to 'meet' under these circumstances. Xx