Fantastic 40+ thread - part 6

Tina, I have had acupuncture on and off for nearly 2 years. I started after MMC2. Apart from the very first session when I had a bad headache for the rest of the day, I have never felt any physical after-effects. My acu always checks my pulse and breathing, looks at my tongue and asks me about my cycle/symptoms etc. I have had needles in tummy, back, leg, wrist and hand (not at the same treatment) then lie quietly for 30 mins. Have also sometimes had Moxa which is a warming treatment applied over my tummy. I'm seeing her weekly at the moment. Hope that helps.

Waves to all.

morning ladies - after a bit of insight please if that's ok? I'm having my first session of acupuncture this week and just wondered what to expect? (Other than being a human pincushion of course lol)

how do you feel afterwards for example and how long do the effects last?

I don't think different cycles matter, at least I wasn't told it would matter. I just happen to be having mine done on the same cycle, but had timing been otherwise this month would have had to do 2 different cycles.

at that hospital doctor! What an incredibly stupid tactless thing to say.

Thanks knickyknocks - I actually had dc1, dc2, mc, mc, dc3, mc, so it is a bit confusing, because I think, well, I did manage one of them when I was a bit elderly! I had a hospital appt recently for something else and the doctor asked when I had the last mmc. She then said, 'but you have a 6 year old, so it's not as if you're stuck for something to do, are you?'

I was at that as I'm pretty sure I don't just want another baby to fill the time between nail appointments and macrame classes !

Can I ask one more thing please? Do the tests have to be done on the same cycle? I won't be able to get an appt for the day 2 ones in time, but I could get one for the 21DPO ones - is that no good? Do they need to be in the same cycle?

twirlyagogo I have one DD and feel that I should be incredibly grateful for what I have. I know that I am blessed to have her, given the uncertainty that life can sometimes offer - and certainly given the tragedy that ladies have faced on this thread alone.

Your 3 miscarriages are incredibly sad, especially given you've had 3 successful pregnancies. I think that that in itself is difficult - to think that you can carry successfully and then suddenly (or it feels that suddenly) you encounter problems. It's not easy to deal with. I fell straight away with DD, but haven't been able to since. Now, after 13 months of trying, I'm just beginning to wonder whether I need to start thinking about not having any further children.

You want another child, there's nothing wrong with that - no shaking required xxx

miaalexandrasmummy lovely to hear from you. I was the same re cancelling the doctors appointment for day 1 to 3 blood tests. I was hoping that it was just a formality and that I wouldn't have to go, but then that blasted AF arrived. Will keep my fingers crossed that your consultant appointment will be before your Easter break, so you can go away, not having to be frustrated of missing any appointments. Hugs as always. Thinking of you and wishing very hard that you have some wonderful news very soon.
twirlyagogo those tests sound just like the ones I've just had. Good advice from the other ladies. I'm having my progesterone done this Friday.
diege compliments to the chef for Friday!
beangrower you OK? Haven't heard from you in a while....
angelgeorgie hope you and Phoebe were thoroughly spoilt on your trip home
latestarter agree that when I m/c last year, all I wanted to do was (after the initial tremendous disappointment) was get on with TTC. I remember also feeling terribly frustrated. But enough chat about m/cs. For today you are pregnant - and we're here cheering you on through the journey. Wishing you lots of positive vibes for tomorrow and Thursday.
italian your trip to the supermarket does sound very driving miss daisy...sounds like those liqorice comfits were well earnt! Yummmmm!
Hello to everyone else beattie, lol, gum, ff, hippy and jolls

Thank you to everyone for the help with the timing of my SWI . As thought, Friday night was impossible, but Saturday was fine (think that's all the info you need.....!!) That said, am increasingly frustrated with DH's shift pattern. If things don't happen this month have worked out my next most fertile time falls yet once more when he's on lates and then nights....grrrrr! My other worry is that even if I do get pregnant that he has a terrible work schedule from June to September (thanks to the Olympics) and that I'm worried that given how sickly I was whilst pregnant with DD for the first 16 weeks, that I can't take the risk - I may have to consider, taking time out of TTC for a few months. Oh the joys of shiftworkers. I'm very proud of hubby but sometimes wish he would have a normal job. Right, moan over.

On a more positive note, day 1 or 2 bloods have come back completely normal. Progesterone test this Friday. Hoping that if that comes back fine, then GP may still consider referring me to the consultant on the basis of my 2 m/cs last year (albeit one was a chemical pregnancy).

Lots of love xxx

Sorry Italian didn't answer your questions - I'm 46. I had the mmc almost 2 years ago (May 2010), but it was very early, just under 12 weeks.

I don't think I really 'tried' as such for the first six months after that, then I was more just hopeful than anything that I'd hit the right time, but I'd say I was definitely trying to catch the right time for the past year. I did get a positive last May, but took my period a week later, so I'm not counting that one.

I know it's really unlikely because of my age - I think the mc rate is 75% over 45 isn't it? Then there are all of the other problems and challenges, but there's still a tiny glimmer of hope there.

When I read the heartbreaking stories of some other women here, I do think I should give myself a slap and be thankful for the three lovely kids I have, because the 3 miscarriages I've had are in no way comparable to their losses, and I do hope I'm not being insensitive by posting here. It took me a while to post because I suppose I do feel there is a hierarchy of loss in many ways and someone with three healthy kids who is ancient doesn't have any right to be whining about wanting another baby when there are those who are trying for their first after tragedy. (I'm not so judgemental about other women, nor would I be about someone who had exactly the same RL situation as me, but I do feel that way about myself - I think I just need a shake really . . . )

Thank you so much , both of you, for that info. Italian - you raised something I had meant to ask about the time of day AF comes on too! I started yesterday at about noon, so I'm taking that as day 1, but, you're right - if it comes at bedtime, surely that isn't day one?

PO was post-ovulation (not sure if that's really the abbreviation though!).

I wouldn't be able to get day 2 tests done this month as I couldn't get a GP appt that quickly. I've just called and got one for Friday - not too hopeful that they'll know much as they're not great on most things I ask, and the amount of expertise here is much higher I think!

Gum - I tried temping but never seem to get much going on; most of the time the reading suggests I'm dead . . . I have been trying sticks, and think I usually register round about day 8. Is that too short then?

PS MiaAlexandrasmummy sorry I whittled on about the car when I should have said so sorry that you are having a hard time. Gum has said it really, but that is no excuse for me being a total oaf and not saying anything to you about you! I can't imagine how it feels and I am just hopeful that you do have some helpful, supportive and loving people around you and also that you will soon be pregnant. I know it won't take away the sadness of Mia but it will sweeten life a lot and I really hope you get there. I totally know the feeling of hoping you don?t end up needing this or that test or whatever but you have started down this path and I really REALLY hope and pray it will lead to a wonderful darling baby for you. God Bless.

Hugs to all. I must go to bed now as I said I would start earlier nights!

HI Twirly, I'll put in my 2 cents worth about the tests.

Doctors always say day 3 or day 21 of the cycle etc, but what's important is the day in relation to ovulation. They usually do day 2-3 tests (easy to know because you get your period), they check your FSH level, and your estrogen and LH.These things can give them an idea of your ovarian reserve (though I wouldn't take it too seriously as these things can and do fluctuate).

The day 21 test can be confusing. The idea is they want to test your progesterone level 7 days after ovulation to see if you have ovulated,and if your progesterone level is high enough to support a pregnancy. If you do this test on day 21 and your cycle is 25 days long, it will give a false level and won't tell you much at all. You really need to know when you have ovulated. The best ways to get an idea of that is through ovulation predictor sticks (which will be positive 12 - 48 hours before ovulation), or by taking your basal temperature every day and charting - you temp will rise after you ovulate, or if you are having ultrasounds to follow your cycle, they can tell when you will ovulate. Doctors base the day 21 test on a "textbook" 28 day cycle when you ovulate on day 14.

You probably know this stuff - but just wanted to put in what I know, as it may help.

As for your 25 day cycle, this isn't a problem unless your luteal phase has shortened. So you really need to know when you ovulate, and if AF arrives sooner than 10 days post O, then you may have trouble getting and staying pregnant. If that's the case you can try to extend the luteal phase by taking a B-complex supplement or Vitex.

I have found temping to be an incredibly useful tool. It has helped me follow my cycle easily and I usually know when to expect my AF. It is also reassuring to see that I have ovulated. Unfortunately, temping can't tell you when you will ovulate - you can't see that til you get a temp rise. However after months of temping you can usually see a pattern and have an idea. SOme people find it stressful to take their temperature first thing in the morning, without getting up etc, so it isn't for everyone. If you are interested, then Fertility Friend website is fabulous.

Mia'smummy, I'm sorry that life is hard for you and that you are missing Mia. I can't begin to know what you are feeling, but I'm sure that it is really hard. I'm thinking of you, and I hope your journey to a new pregnancy won't be too long.

Lol - it is so nice to hear from you. I'm sorry about the shelling on this thread, I just couldn't stay quiet when I felt my snug friends were being unsupported. I'm so excited about your pregnancy. Remind me if you've had your 20 week scan? Will you/did you find out the sex of babes? I suppose you're thinking of names. What a lovely time for you.

I've spent the last couple of days in bed, and watching movies and doing very little else. As well as the lovely AF arriving, I also had a tummy bug which had me feeling low.
It was a bummer(pun not intended!), as the weather's been gorgeous, and I've been stuck inside. I think it was my body's way of telling me to sit still for a bit and relax. So I did! I feel better today.

Latestarter - how nice to have another Aussie in the Snug. I'm from the West, but live on the south coast - a gorgeous seaside town. We live very near the beach - about 5 mins walk- and have beautiful views of the water.We are also surrounded by bush.Very lucky in that regard.You can have a look at some of it on my blog if you want. Just click on my name here, there should be a link there.

It's been unusually dry and warm here in the west this summer, and at the moment, Sydney is experiencing heavy rain and flooding - hopefully the weather will be lovely by the time you get home. Sydney is usually a lovely sunny city.

I seem to have written a novella - sorry everyone!

Welcome Twirlyagogo

So sorry to hear about your mmc.

Can I ask how old you and how long you have been trying?

Sorry to be dense but what does PO mean?

I am not sure if tests are on day 5 and day 21 but your GP will be able to tell you. Day 5 sounds a bit late to me for the first test. The quicker you get along and see the doctor to check the days you need the better (IMHO) because if they want to start this cycle and today is your day one then you have only a few days to get started for this cycle.

The day your period comes on is taken as Day 1, (although I have been told that if you come on later in the day, after 5 p.m. or whenever, then you would count the next day, in the case of your example the Tuesday, as your day one). Anyway, assuming it is the Monday, then yes, that's day 1. Four weeks from that date would be the Sunday, the day 28 when a standard cycle would be due to end and if the period did not come on them yes that Monday would be Day 29 BUT if the period came on like clockwork then that Monday would be day 1 again. If your cycle is shorter than 28 days (as mine was) your day one would be your next full day of period. So I would say if you came on on Monday 1st October and your next period started on FRIDAY 26 October then you would have a 25 day cycle and if you came on on Thursday 25 October then your cycle would be 24 days. BUT to be honest I would chat to doc about all this because they can advise you.

Just for the record, and I am NOT a doctor I THINK the two test you need are an FSH test which I THINK needs to be done around day 3 (it might be between days 2 and 4 BUT I am pretty sure it depends on the length of your cycle). IF your cycle is shorter than the standard 28 day one you should tell your doctor because they MIGHT alter the day or lean towards one day or another for the test.

infertility.about.com/od/infertilitytesting/p/day3_fsh_levels.htmDay

The doctor may wish to do a progesterone test, this could be around day 21 BUT again your doctor can tell you when to come in for that.

There might be other tests, e.g. possibly Luteinizing hormone, the doctor would suggest so best to speak to them.

Good luck.

And also (sorry, am on a roll now I've decided to de-lurk), is it even worse than I thought now that I have a 25 day cycle? Do I need to try and extend that - if so, how?

Thanks again!

Hello all -

Have been lurking for a while but it was a bit . . . erm, fraught in here when I was thinking of posting so I waited until it had calmed down a bit!

Can I ask for your expert input on this please? AF arrived today which was day 25 of cycle, which is pretty much what it has been for me in the almost 2 years since mmc. I'm going to ask my GP for tests this month - which I think, from what I've read, are 5days PO and 21 days PO, is that right?

Hope you understand this bit - those tests will be based on a 28 day cycle, I assume, but if someone had their period on a Monday which was Day 1, then if they took it exactly four weeks later, that would be Day 29 wouldn't it? Or am I being daft? So, if I take my period on Day 25, does that mean I have a 24 day or 25 day cycle for counting when I should get the tests?

I'm not sure even I understand what I'm saying there, but hopefully some clever clogs will work it out.

Can someone also let me know if I'm right in thinking those are the two batches of tests which need done too?

I won't even start on my progesterone questions yet . . . !

MiaAlexandrasmummy thanks for saying hi, and for caring about the car thing, yes I did drive. Took mum to the supermarket after church. Parked, carefully, moved car to be exactly in the space because it is an expensive hire car. Then she said, "Can we get a bit closer to the door, it is raining?" YES, Driving Miss Daisy, I moved to take her to the door and then re-parked. I was a bag of nerves as have seen one accident at local supermarket car park and had friend who had another accident in the car park there! All pretty trivial!

Had a lovely day, lunch with mum and a service at 4.00 this afternoon which was really lovely.

Just eaten a whole 1/4 of Liquorice Comfits!

Hugs to all.

Hi all. I would be happy to meet up in London too sometime...

Sounds like most people had pretty relaxed weekends, which has to be a good thing. Missed out on a good cafe evening on Friday though, will try to arrive in good time next week.

Me, just feeling a bit numb about life at the moment. Missing Mia. AF arrived today, so have days 1-3 blood tests booked for tomorrow - was secretly hoping I might have to cancel. Gah. DH getting sorted tomorrow too. Waiting for our first consultant appointment now, and reading up on the whole assisted conception saga. Bet the date will be when we are booked to go away for Easter.

italian thinking of you. Hope you managed to drive that car, stress free.

knicky hope the plan for yesterday morning worked out...

Hi all
Latestarter good luck Tues & Thurs sending you lots of positive vibes. Xxx
Lol yes, I ve had lovely weekend, thanks. Never mind me!!!Phebs, quite rightly, spoilt by all!!!
Hi all hope everyone is well?
Nothing to report here just chilling tomorrow & tidying our house , as it's a tip!!! Bit low key; but hey ho I could be at work!!!

Phew - the shelling's stopped. I'll just hang up my tin hat on the snug coat hooks...

BB - can't tell you what a relief it was to read your post! So glad you're ok - and absolutely delighted that your dh is home, supportive and being fun to be around. What a weight off your shoulders. Doing it all on your own isn't fun, I know.

Diege amazing food as always. Presume you're pureeing and freezing mini Sam-size portions? So efficient.

Hippy Gawd, what did you say? Sorry, no, don't say. You'll get yourself banned. Rebel! x
Gum can't help being delighted that your af is now so regular. It's such a good sign and I know you were aiming for it. I'd do the DHEA again in the first 2 weeks, if I was in your position. Who knows? As long as it doesn't have any side effects (I definitely over-did it in my desperation).

Jolls what fantastic news about your scan. You must have been delighted to see that little heartbeat. And spot on for dates, too. Yay!

Angel hope the family spoiled you this weekend. You deserve it. Hoping Italian, too, has had a calm hormone-balanced weekend. I can only guess at what it must feel like to be regged up and down like a yoyo. It will all be worth it. It must be good to feel that you can do positive things to help the process. It's the powerlessness that's so awful when you're ttc, I think.

FF I hope you're not as big as me. I'm not very big-framed and this baby is sticking out like Mr Greedy's tummy. Diege I'm going to match your last photo by June!

Latestarter if you're in London, I'm free from Easter. Just message me and I'll come up on the train. Unless you've changed your mind. I must have missed your previous post.

Love to all - yes, Curly, if you're lurking! X

Hee hee Latestarter, I know what you mean about willing on nap time . How old is your ds? Mine is 2.9 and has now dropped his nap (though has them at nursery ). At least ds2 has a good 2 hrs at lunch. How are you feeling? Quite an anxious week for you but we're all here supporting you xx A lot of us have been where you are, with good outcomes too, so lots to feel positive about!

Morning everyone, or eveing for gum, sorry AF got you, but swiming and chips sounds lovely. My DS also loves swimming, but it would be so nice to be able to do it with him at home in the sunshine (I'm also aussie). We are making a trip home in a couple of week for over 4.5 weeks (sydney) and I cant wait, hopefully still a bit of sun around. Where are you, I get the impression you are near the beach? How old is your DS?

I didnt realise there was such a good chef in the bistro, is this a regular Friday event, I will have to make sure I make a reservation for next week.

Thanks also for you comments diege, it's unfortunate that you are so far away - I'm in London as you are the only one who wants to meet up :(. I have another blood test on Tuesday and a scan on Thursday, so fingers crossed as I'm not feeling too confident. I love the idea of the virtual helicopter, I will be send it round to everyone early Thursday morning.

knicky hope you managed to do the deed, it's silly as even though FTIAMP, I am a bit jealous, you're in the best part of the month and in with a chance. One of the worst parts of a MC for me, is that in reality it ends up taking six months out of your ttcing efforts if only I could be pregnant without having to be pregnant IYKWIM . Fingers crossed for you, me and everybody else.

How long before the FET italian?

Hope everyone is well on this wet (london) sunday morning, my DS has just thrown cheerios all over the floor - again, so better go and sort out, please hurry up nap time. Hello to everyone else, flies - hope you are glowing with happy pregnancy hormones, bean - where are you, jollster - looking really good, angel - enjoy your trip home and big hugs to everyone else.

Hey ladies if anyone has any experience of nail piercing, please pop onto this thread and give me your experiences! Thanks

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/style_and_beauty/1420137-Has-anyone-had-their-fingernail-pierced?msgid=30411925#30411925

Thanks Diege xxx
You too xxx
Love to all xx

Afternoon! Enjoy your weekend Angel
Quite peaceful here with the dcs out, and dc5 currently asleep in his pram. Ded worth the hectic preparation!
Hope everyone's ok, D x

Hippy xxx
Hi Italian hope you re ok today?
Knicky hope you managed the swi today ?
hi BB great to hear from you xx
Diege missed the snug again!!!! Xx
Gum xxx
FF hope u re ok?
Love to all. Late posting as wr re at my folks for the weekend so been having a good old catch up. Xxxx

Diege Paella, fab I knew you would work out what I wanted and the finger of fudge is great too. Kind of think if it were named now it would not be named finger or fudge! What would it be, twig, sword, stick, memory stick of fudge ... a memory stick of fudge is just enough to give the kids a treat!!!

You're ok Gum, chef is still here, so your chosen meal is on its way!
Bugger about af . I wuld say however that your regular cycles are absolutely very positive - there are eggs there, and where there's eggs, there's hope! Good idea to keep going with the supplements too. Are you still taking that herb mixture thingy? (sorry to be so vague - a sort of superfood concentrate?).
Right, really am off to bed now - will try to see past the chaos of prep to the (relative) peace of just having the baby at home!