CLOMID GANG - the new thread

Hi SKBF, I was supposed to be having another scan a week on Wednesday, but I had another episode of red bleeding on Friday so it's now tomorrow....I feel a bit of a fraud though now because it was so shortlived - by the time I got home from work it had stopped already!

Oh well, c'est la vie :)

Hi SKBF, I was supposed to be having another scan a week on Wednesday, but I had another episode of red bleeding on Friday so it's now tomorrow....I feel a bit of a fraud though now because it was so shortlived - by the time I got home from work it had stopped already!

Oh well, c'est la vie :)

Thanks Loubie. When is your next scan to see your baby's heartbeat?

Good luck SKBF - I really do hope you get a sticky BFP soon (and everyone else too!)

Loubie xx
6 weeks today :)

Update: had scan yesterday and one follicle measured 19.6mm so had hcg jab and have LH surge today. My lining was measured at 11mm which the sonographer described as 'juicy'! Last time I think it measured 7mm at the same time but this time my acupunturist has been working on my lining and I think she has made a difference. So am in sex kitten mode all weekend!

Oh, I asked about overripe follicles and about the fact that they deteriorate at a certain size, ie I questioned 21mm and 23mm which is what I had last time, and she said that it really is 26mm/27mm that they feel is over ripe.

Also meant to say.....I was given clomid for 'unexplained infertility' whilst I waited for IUI (18 month waiting list).

I responded VERY well to clomid (because I ovulate without it anyway that's no real surprise!) and had 4 follicles on their way to rippening. They told me if I had any more they wouldn't proceed.

SKBF - It was a couple of years ago but I'm sure that it was 16 and then one month only 14 so they told me to go to my local gp's clinic in a day or two.

Now I am having the jab at my gp's on day 13, 14 or 15 !! I decide!!

Sound right to anyone else?

Thought not!!!!

I was originally told that an ideal size for a follicle was 20 mms.

dizzy,

Having read your most recent posting I would seriously consider dispensing with this clinic's service altogether and find another unit to work with.

I think your third papagraph is particularly telling - it is said that in the initial stages at least you are better off under the NHS.

You were not monitored properly to my mind either going by my own experience (I was seen at the NHS unit weekly over a period of several months for blood tests and ultrasound scans).

Hope you get on allright next week - I think you certainly have much to discuss.

Hi Artoo and Coggy!! Artoo, I wonder if your cons should agree to give you the hcg jab at a certain size? I thought when my follicles were 21mm and 23mm that large meant strong which I now realise doesn't necessarity mean that. What it does mean though is that I respond well to clomid in that some women do not respond well and the follicles do not mature from taking the clomid.

Coggy, when you say your follicles weren't big enough but they gave you the jab anyway 'as you had travelled a long way', what size were they? I was told they should be a minimum of 18mm. Having said that, if yours were say 17mm and they gave you the jab, by the time you ovulated say 24-36 hrs later, maybe they were the right size?

When I booked the scan last week I did think to myself that as I know that I respond well to clomid (ie I got preg in first cycle, this is my second cycle), maybe I should just look out for ovulation and BD and then wait rather than go through all the fuss of scans. After some thought I decided against the DIY approach and booked my scan but I did wonder if I didn't have the hcg jab surely the body would release the egg when it was ready? But apparently not! Of course some women on clomid don't have the jab and they ovulate without the hcg help but I wonder how many don't as they need help with the release and they find themselves going down the IVF route?

I had another session of acupunture today and now she is away so will go back on Monday week. She has been working on my progesterone, my blood flow to uterus, my liver and lining.

atilla, I have wondered the same thing about being prescribed chlomid. My last (and 3rd) consultant basically said he usually prescribed chlomid to most of his patients who have unexplained infertility instead of to iui as did my first consultant. when I asked why, he said the 'younger ones' tend to want to go down the high tech route and immediately refer for iui/ivf.
He also did not discuss the risks and effects of chlomid,just that it would give my ovaries 'a boost'.I have since learned that it has quite serious side effects. I was monitored for the 1st month but didn't ovulate until day 18 and prior to that, when nothing was showing on the scans as early as day 10, all I got from the nurses was...thats strange, I wonder why thats happended and maybe you should just go straight to ivf then...so you can understand why I'm reluctunt to be monitored again.

I use a clinic in manchester and if anything the service is worse than any care I have had with the NHS.

am not going to take anymore chlomid after this month. will see what consultant has to say next week.

I'm very interested in this too.
I have hcg injections to release the eggs and I wasn't going to have one this month to see if it makes any difference....now thinking that the follicle could get too big I amy re-think!

Last time I was on clomid I had a scan to see the size and each time the follicle wasn't quite large enough but they gave me the injection anyway as I had travelled a long way to get to the hospital! That can't be right can it??!!
Needless to say I didn't get pg on any of those three attempts!!

SKBF - I found your comments about follicles very interesting, as I've been wondering similar things.

On my second clomid cycle, I had a 27mm follicle!! I think I ovulated the day after that scan, but it seemed like a very large follicle to me. I've now gone through three clomid cycles with no success, and I have wondered all along if I really do ovulate, or if the follicle just gets absorbed back into the body. I've not had a trigger injection at any time, and I've not had a 21-day blood test to confirm OV. I wonder if my follicles are getting too big before they are released.

I'm back with my consultant on the 6th June, I definitely have a few questions to ask him.

Hugs,
Artoo.

Hopecat

No am not a doc.

BTW the list of "missed" tests comes from Professor Robert Winston's book called Infertility.

Iew years ago may be a problem now. I think I'll make note of the tests you mentioned as I have another appntment next wed so I will ask the consultant what he thinks.
dizzy

I would seriously consider getting a second opinion from another gynae consultant at another unit before you embark on IVF particularly if there is no diagnosis of the underlying problem.

Generally speaking some private places as well offer very poor treatment for much expense. It is not the case at all that going private automatically guarantees better treatment.

If there are seemingly no ovulatory problems I am wondering why they put you on clomid in the first place. BTW does your cons work in the NHS?. I ask this as usually a "yes" answer to this question can give a degree of competance. They may well have thought the other tests were not needed but this should have been discussed with you anyway. I am also concerned to read that the nursing staff there were not very good towards you either - it is vitally important that you can all work as a team.

I wish you well next week also.

attila x

I am so pleased all is well Loubie. Good luck with your next scan.

I am on day 13 and had my scan which showed one follicle measuring 14.6mm which is smaller to my last clomid cycle which showed 2 measuring 15mm and 17mm on day 11. So I am going back on Friday which will be day 15 and poss they will give me hcg jab to release egg. I did ask if I didn't have the hcg jab, is there a chance that the follicle doesn't release the egg and is just absorbed by the body and I was told that sometimes the follicle can release the egg too late so that the quality of the egg is not so good as it was earlier. So at 18mm the follicle is ready to release the egg. On my egg releasing day in the last clomid cycle, my 2 follicles were 21mm and 23mm which with the info today makes me think that they were past their optimum quality ?? Does anyone know anything about this?

hi,

atilla...wow! some of what you said is new to me.

Its been pretty clear to me reading other peoples experiences that every private hospital does things differently. neither myself or my dh have been tested for the things you have mentioned although I was aware that the tests were available. I have conceived twice before (2nd was an m/c) and been trying again for just over 2 years, have had internal scan to check uterus and hcg x-ray to check tubes - all ok. bloods and sperm count done -all ok. nothing more invasive than this.

could the hospital have deemed the other tests not necessary because I have conceived before. surely what might not have been problem a few years ago may be a problem now. I think I'll make note of the tests you mentioned as I have another appntment next wed so I will ask the consultant what he thinks.

on my last appointment my consultant gave me 3 options: give up! try ivf or try a course of clomid for 3/4 months which could give my ovaries a bit of a boost (no ovulatory problems been detected so assuming none). On first couse of clomid was being monitored but the nurses caused me so much stress with their lack of knowledge and insensitive remarks that didn't bother on 2nd cycle.

If the clomid doesn't work this month then I feel I have no option but to try ivf as suggested by my consultant. I can't have it on nhs as age limit is 37.

Hi Rachee....long time no speak!!!
I am on CD3 and had period cramps for nearly seven days before AF finally came - never had that before.
Possibly clomid???!!!

I didn't realise you were also a Devon lass - how freaky is that?!!

Can't stay for long as dh is calling.........

i am on day 8, and still getting period like pains, really bad this month. does anyone else suffer....

Dizzy, i thought the first round of IVF was free on the NHS ??? please can anyone clarify this.....

I live in devon and a local doctor has told me i will get one go on the nhs, i am 35. been trying for two years.

Atilla - am crashing this thread (sorry) as I've seen you post this type of advice before, and I find it all really interesting (particularly your advice re: OPKs and Temp charting - neither of which seem to work unless you live like a nun).

Are you a doctor?

dizzy

I don't think your cons is actually being defeatist - more like realistic (clomid should be used for a maximum of six months after which time other treatments should be tried).

"Unexplained infertility" is infact no diagnosis at all - all this means is that the docs have so far failed to find out what is wrong.

The most common tests that tend to be omitted are:-
Adequate x-rays of the uterus which may show abnormalities not seen at laparoscopy in either the tubes or uterine cavity.
Hysteroscopy - telescope inspection of the inside of the uterus which may occasionally show abnormalities not otherwise seen.
Carefully timed post coital testing to see if sperms are surviving in the cervix
Repeated sperm counts over several weeks and months to make certain there is no subtle abnormality
Testing the sperm in special media - such as swim tests or velocity testing. When this is done it can sometimes uncover a hidden cause for the supposed "unexplained" problem.
Thorough hormone tests to detect abnormalities of male hormone or early falls in progesterone.
Scanning of the ovaries to see if follicles really are developing and there is no sign of polycystic ovaries.

If not all of the above tests have been carried out then one could argue you have not been adequately investigated (hence also the unexplained infertility tag).

Presumably you were given clomid as ovulation is problematic. In this regard polycystic ovaries or PCOS are common culprits. OPK's and temp charting if either of these two problems are issues are not recommended. Blood tests would be the most accurate indicator of whether you have ovulated or not - both opk's and temp charting are beset with problems and both methods can give misleading results. Have you been monitored regularly whilst on clomid - this should have happened. There is no sure fire way of telling whether its worked or not otherwise. As clomid can also affect levels of LH you should be monitored in any event.

I would not personally consider IVF following on from clomid - it is also too big a jump from a "basic" first stage treatment like clomid to something far more invasive like IVF. IVF is certainly not the cure all for all subfertility problems. Would suggest you talk through other treatment options with your cons at some length before embarking down the IVF route.

Hope the above helps a bit.

I remember you dizzy although I think it was before I actually started posting - just lurking to see what MN was all about!!

I was told that if clomid doesn't work within 3 months...it's unlikely but...posts on here, and my own experience, had proved that wrong. That could be where you hospital is coming from though.

I was perscribed 6 months worth of clomid while I was on the IUI waiting list. All different area seem to do things so differently.

I've got very few days in my second phase of my cycle and the clomid sorted this out before. No-one at the fertility clinic even suggested it was a possibility and I only found out by 'mistake' by reading posts on here and investigating myself!

I'm now on my 2nd cycle of clomid.
(Had 3 cycles on it before two years ago.)

hi, not posted for a few months and I'm not a regular so hope you remember me

just started my third cycle of clomid. I chose not to be monitored last month for reasons I mention before, used opks and temp charting to see when ovulated which was day 13 or 14 so seems like back on track after late ov on 1st month of clomid (day 18).

have an appointment to see consultant next week to discuss ivf if clomid doesn't work this month. when prescribed clomid was told to consider other options if doesn't work in 3 or 4 months. I've read that some women can be on it for up to 12 months before getting pregnant. Is my consultant being a bit defeatist assuming if its going to work for me it will in 3/4 months.

although going do discuss ivf still not 100% sure I want to do it....and its not just the expense which could do withoug right now. Like iui i've read that theres a low success rate for 1st go at ivf...been referred to as a 'practice run'...very expensive one if thats the case.

I've been really sure about how I wanted to deal with my 'unexplained infertility' so far (had iui before the clomid). I'm pretty sure if I hadn't just turned 38 I wouldn't be turning to ivf quite so soon. Is this the wrong reason to be doing it...I really don't know. Any advice anyone

hi, not posted for a few months and I'm not a regular so hope you remember me

just started my third cycle of clomid. I chose not to be monitored last month for reasons I mention before, used opks and temp charting to see when ovulated which was day 13 or 14 so seems like back on track after late ov on 1st month of clomid (day 18).

have an appointment to see consultant next week to discuss ivf if clomid doesn't work this month. when prescribed clomid was told to consider other options if doesn't work in 3 or 4 months. I've read that some women can be on it for up to 12 months before getting pregnant. Is my consultant being a bit defeatist assuming if its going to work for me it will in 3/4 months.

although going do discuss ivf still not 100% sure I want to do it....and its not just the expense which could do withoug right now. Like iui i've read that theres a low success rate for 1st go at ivf...been referred to as a 'practice run'...very expensive one if thats the case.

I've been really sure about how I wanted to deal with my 'unexplained infertility' so far (had iui before the clomid). I'm pretty sure if I hadn't just turned 38 I wouldn't be turning to ivf quite so soon. Is this the wrong reason to be doing it...I really don't know. Any advice anyone