Assisted Conception (and all the bits in between) volume 7

Hi - hope everyone is well. welcome Teds77

Italian well done on dodging that donut :) and great news about you starting. praying for a BFP for you v soon. x

scrummy your friend was a bit insensitive - but hat off to you taking a positive out of it all and being pleased for another BFP. i echo Italian when she says 'you're day will come'

sorry i've been so quiet - been thinking about what to do next. I've ended up getting a second opinion about my low AMH (= only option egg donor). And yes, my AMH is so so so low, that i wont respond to stimilation. :( But on the upside, i am now sure about going for an egg donor :). i've signed up with a nice clinic and got a really good vibe from them. i've told my new doc that i want to be pregnanty by Christmas, and she's up for the challenge

lots of love, luck and positivity to you all - thanks for being there for me.

xxx

Italian on Gonal f I didn't respond much although the lister have told me they would have let me go for longer than guys did. Menopur worked both times but I was on a short protocol so hard to judge.

Thanks beginnings didn't mean to be blasé in my congrats - hoping that the spit did the trick

The compare and constrast option sounds like a good idea. Our experience is different in that I did respond pretty well in some respects - from a starting point of 4 follicles, 3 grew in a pretty textbook way and all 3 had eggs in them. At the moment, and in my very limited experience, I'm not sure whether I'll ever get a better response than that and it's just a case of hoping that in a future cycle, I might eventually get a better quality embryo. I shall maybe send a pm and get that information of you. Thanks very much.

You're welcome teds77 (although I just did metaphorically turn round three times and spit for luck after your congrats - we've a very long way to go before I'll be comfy as I've been here before). I would recommend, if you can afford it, going to the lister for a chat. It'll cost you £150. We did it the day after our follow up at Guys so that we could do a compare and contrast. By going to the Lister we gave up on another NHS go and didn't do that lightly but I don't regret that decision for one second. In my really limited experience, I think the NHS are really good if you have a blockage or fit standard clinically tested protocols. If you don't, they are less able to help you. It's the one area of medicine where I think the private sector are ahead. Which is not necessarily wrong by the way. I kind of believe that the nhs SHOULD be putting more money into say, cancer research than assisted conception. That's just my humble opinion though. If you want to pm me do, and I'll tell you who I saw at the Lister.

Thanks beginnings - very helpful and congrats on your bfp.

So difficult trying to work out the next move

Hi Teds77 and welcome. I had an NHS round at Guy's last year which resulted in a cancelled cycle as I didn't respond. At that point I knew I had high FSH but not that I had low amh as they hadn't measured it. They told me to have one more go, using the same long protocol but switching from Gonal F to Menopur and if that didn't work, to go down the donor egg route. I hot footed it to the Lister where the low amh was diagnosed.

The data on short vs long protocols is still inconclusive - the lister and guy's are currently doing a study that I was invited to take part in - and I heard at Guy's that the likely outcome is that they'll find it makes no difference. All i know is that the Lister do use them and apparently for good reason. I have had two fresh cycles at the Lister, both have been short, and both have resulted in BFPs. Sadly the first one didn't work out, although I've discovered thrombophilia and I immune issues since. I'll let you know how the second one goes - it's still in play!!

Hope that helps

Hello Ladies - hope you don't mind a gatecrasher - I'm usually on the 'Just starting ICSI/IVF' but would appreciate a bit of advice as a think one or two of you might have experience of low AMH and also the Lister Clinic.

It looks very likely that our first round of ICSI is going to end in a bfn - I know I should stay positive but my embies were just 3-cell and 2-cell on my 3dt so that's proving very difficult! That was my one NHS 'go' at Guys and so we're thinking about what can be done differently this time/whether we should change to the Lister as they are very good with low AMH/high FSH and how quickly can we cycle again, especially if we change clinics.

We did the long protocol this time and I'm also wondering, regardless of where we end up, whether a short protocol would be better - again any advice gratefully received.

Thanks.

Thanks lissysilver, scrummy and fretfree. I feel better today. I did a digital test this morning and it came up as 2 to 3 weeks since conception which makes sense. Does anyone know if actually, they're measuring from implantation for us? That would make sense.....if that's the case, I reckon it's just over two weeks which puts me in the right range.

Last night I felt particularly queasy and burpy (nice).

fretfree that sounds good to me! Another two days and you'll do well I'm sure.

Sounds like your DH is fab scrummy.

Hi to everyone else

Fretfree - looks like your 15 and 13 follicles will grow to the size they need to by Sat, 2 more days of growing is good. Lots of protein for you to help them along.... my clinic said 65g a day and whether it worked or not I got 5 follicles the right size for mature eggs.

Hi there scrummy - people can be so insensitive. It's easier said than done but try and let their ignorance go otherwise it will just fester. It might help to verbalise your hurt to your friend so at least you have a way of 'closing' the issue and won't keep on coming back to think about it. Hugs.

beginnings - big fingers crossed for you. I think I would be the same, although obviously worrying is not to be recommended. I had my final cam and blood test this morning: E2 at 1800, although follicles only 15, 13 (x3) and others around 10. The Dr has told me to do two more days on Puregon with 75ui and then have the ovulation trigger shot Saturday evening. We have insemination on Monday morning. I am really nervous - I mean, could this really work?? Everyone seems to talk about viable follicles being over 17/18mm - my largest is only 15 and that is the same size as it was on the scan before (the day before).

I was looking over the success rates earlier on (yes - I know I need to step away from the Google) and it all seems so low - but I was surprised when I learnt of how low the overall rates for normal pregnancies. But I suppose if it works it's a 100% success rate and if it doesn't it's 0% so I should just ignore them all!!

So sorry - just re-read through and I've rather gone off on a waffle. Hi to everyone.

Hi all thank you so much for your kind words. They mean a lot and just highlights what a lifeline this thread is - imagine what it was like without social media - we all just suffered in our corners, brave ones joined meeting groups and the rest just went slowly mad, I'm sure of it.
Told DH all about last night and had a little cry when I went home. He thinks it propably was a question of unfortunate choice of words, but then he just sees the good in everyone. I'm still a bit funny about it so will raise it when we meet again in a few days. I hate to think that I'm talked about as 'the one who failed' when we are nowhere near the end of the journey yet. I know people talk and I don't mind that bit, I just want it to be accurate. Rant over
On the real TTC front I think my body has delayed ovulation as I still have EWCM and temps not fully up. Let's see what tomorrow brings.

Italian that is fab news!

beginnings thinking of you

scrummy- Oh argh, I'm so sorry about your encounter with your friends. I definitely would've been upset, but on the flip side, I think of the percentage of my friends who ever had fertility issues. They can't and won't ever understand, not that that excuses the insensitivity.

Italian- Yay you! That's SO exciting!

frustrated- You'll be sniffing until you start stimulating. Your lining and blood tests need to be right before you start the stimulation meds, but that could be not long after you get your AF. As I said, I still had a cyst growing and needed to bring on another AF, but as soon as I got it and was scanned to the get the all clear, I started stimulation.

beginnings- Oh please, please try to relax! I know I felt the same way as I approached seven weeks (which is when I lost the baby last year), and I still look after I go to the toilet, but I've tried to convince myself that everything is going to be ok. Calm is better than stressed. Your numbers are only going up, and that's great news!

rowing- Where ya been?

lucy, womanly, keziah, fretfree, and marmite- I hope everyone is doing well...

scrummy I'd have been spitting nails after that. You have every right to be hurt, furious at being discussed like that and are entirely within your rights to have a robust conversation with your friend.

Thanks frustrated yes, five weeks today. Honestly, I'm terrified. Would be fair to say that I'm almost catatonic I'm so scared. I just keep thinking back to that horrible horrible phone call in March when I was told that my HCG level was 3 having been 123 a week earlier. I think I'd taken a "box that off and move on" attitude but it's only today that I'm realising that actually it had a pretty big effect. The fact I'm on clexane, aspirin and steroids helps but doesn't mean that any chromosomal issues are dealt with. I just need to get to Sept 6 now. That's when I'm having my scan which will be 6+5 so we should be able to see if there's something viable there. All spotting has stopped. In fact all mucus has stopped (sorry Tmi). I still feel a little nauseous, especially if I get hungry, and I have the metallic taste from time to time........this waiting game is so hard.

italian that is great news!! Here you go! Have you dates yet?

scrummy that would have really upset me too. I'm sure they didn't mean for you to hear, and hopefully they'd be very sorry if they knew you had heard, but it was still a very stupid thing to say. You will get your baby, it's when, not if.
Italian great news that it's all starting soon. I'm sure you have mixed feelings, there is so much anticipation and emotion tied up in all this. Excited for you and really hoping it all works.
scrummy I got back from the vets finally (cat bruised but fine). I can't answer your questions about long protocol sorry. I'm sure lissy will know. Keep going with the no decaf. You're over the worst bit!
Hi to everyone else

Hello scrummy - so sorry you are having one of these days. I really understand how you feel. Trying to get pregnant seems to be full of 'those days'. I would have been annoyed by that too, its really not v sensitive of your friend - particularly as she just announced she was pregnant. Perhaps you should talk to her privately? Try to stay strong and be patient - as others have said to me on this thread the other day, its all about perseverance. It will eventually happen to you and then you will be able to show off your beautiful baby(ies) to your friends after all. Thinking of you.

italian YAY - thats super news!! How exciting. What treament are you going to be on? When do you start?

lucy hope you are not still waiting for the vet...! Its day 3 of no decaf. And its HARD!!!

Question for you all -- when you are on a long protocol, what happens on day 1-5 of of your new cycle? I will be sniffing from day 21 until AF, then I know that I will have drugs training and hysteroscopy on day 5 or 6 - but what happens in between? Will I need to inject or is it a drug free couple of days?

Hope everyone is keeping well.

beginnings are you ok today? Today is 5 weeks isnt it?

lissy how are you? are you starting to show?

Evening all. Had one of those moments tonight...went to have drinks with a good friend and a group of her friends (birthday drinks). Arrived and no sooner had I sat down that my friend announced that there was one more to arrive, and she was nearly 6 months pregnant. I've know about it for a while and am not upset to find her pregnant. What upset me was that another one of my friends friend said 'I thought she couldn't get pregnant' and I saw my friend whispering 'no, that's 'scrummy''. And I've felt really awful since. It's the first time I've felt like a failure and I wanted to scream and shout to say - actually it's not that I CAN'T get pregnant, I just haven't got pregnant yet! The only thing that made me feel good was that when the now pregnant friend (you keeping up?) arrived and whilst chatting turns out she'd been off the pill for 6 years and no BFP. Met a new guy, and after trying again, fell pregnant after 4 months. It was so nice to hear that she was finally getting her bundle of joy.
I'm sure i'm hormonal too and tired, so maybe I'm over-reacting, but you would have found that upsetting too, yes?

Anyway, enough about me! frustrated that's great news and the time btw now and the 6 will just fly by. Hope you have nice plans for the weekend.

Lucy nice to hear from you. Glad to hear you're drawing strength from other people's experiences. I've often wondered about colonic....not in fertility kind of way, but as a general cleansing, but always come to the conclusion that it would be just too gross and undignified.

Italian thanks for the tea tip I will give it a go. Your Appt must be soon? You must feel excited and nervous at the same time?

beginnings that's great news about the levels rising. I know it won't help, but sending calming thoughts your way anyway....

lissy I think you're right. I will stick to general vitamins until they've completed their tests.

Lucy I've given up on EPO to see if that may have caused my extensive spotting, as I read somewhere it may cause early AF...I've notice lack of EWMC as a result, but not enough to worry me.

Well done on donut dodging Italian!

beginnings your hcg is rising really well and I'm sure tomorrow will pass without incident. Sending lots of positive thoughts your way.
level I'm so sorry I didn't comment on your lap. I'm glad it went ok and that your recovery is going well.
frustrated yay, you get to start really soon. How exciting!
I think I have only been able to cut out gluten because I've been steadily purifying my diet for a while. If I was still eating sugar (I.e. Cakes and biscuits) I think I'd find it near impossible to cut out sugar and gluten at the same time! Good luck with giving up decaf. I have to say, when I gave up decaf I had a similar withdrawal to giving up the real thing, which just shows how much caffeine is still left in it.
Wishing you all a nice eve. I'm currently waiting at the vets with my cat without an appointment (he's been scrapping I think and has a bad foot) and think I will be here a llloooonnnnnggggg time [bored emoticon]

Hello everyone, you are such stars, all of you. Thank you for picking me up - it worked. The last two years have been such a roller coaster of emotions, panics, excitement, sadness and it would be great if it was all a bit easier. It does help to talk to people who are going through similar things. Yes - perseverance is the key and patience I suppose. Level is right - there are difficult times in life, and this is one of them. But I am sure the bad patch will be over soon...Thanks for your support. Onwards and upwards.

beginnings dont be scared. Thats amazing news. So so pleased. and will be thinking about your milestone tomorrow! Exciting.

womanly are you sleeping better? Hows the soreness?

lucy so glad to hear that humira is not giving you the dreaded symptoms. How are you doing today? I am impressed about your gluten free diet. Wow. I couldnt do that. Although I think I may have decided to formally give up decaff coffee too. V hard.

level thanks for your lovely message. It does sound as if your laparoscopy went well. how long have you got before the endo starts growing back and does it def grow back?

Thanks for the hug pocket - reciprocated.

fret are they monitoring you for the IUI? In any case I would have intercourse every so often. Yes when I did my IUI they did say you needed to leave one day in between intercourse and the procedure...

italian hey. I am 33, 2.5 years of unexplained infertility, lots of clomid, chinese medicine (since ditched it), 2 IUIs. Have been resisting ivf until now but am about to embark. You?

Some news. The argc called me yesterday to say that the chromosome tests have come back early and normal for me and DH. So we can start this cycle. It looks like I will start sniffing on 6 Sept. I cant believe it. I am excited and v nervous at the same time...

Sounds good Lucy. and good spot on rowing! she hasn't been around for ages.

HCG level 878 today up from 345 on Monday. Can't work out if I'm less or more scared. Feel a bit sick and not in a symptomy way. 5 weeks tomorrow. Can I really get further than that??